HANA Day at the Races - Can you make it?

[DeanT]

When: Saturday April 18th 2009

Where: Keeneland Race Course (might as well make the number one rated HANA track our first destination!)

Time: Post time!

Dear HANA Members,

We would like to invite all or any of you who may be in the Lexington area on April 18th to join us for a meet and greet at Keeneland Race Course. Over the last several weeks the board at HANA and several members have decided that the time has come to get together. Since most of us have only met online, or not at all, it certainly would be good idea. And Keeneland in the spring? That’s tough to beat for horseplayers.

As most of you know, we just started here not too long ago. We have not raised very much money (thanks to everyone who has contributed!), so do not expect anything elaborate in terms of giveaways and such; however, we should have some fun planned for the day.

We will update members when we get more information over the coming weeks.

We sincerely hope that several of you can make it. Although we read all comments and emails, chatting with members, and understanding what makes them tick, face to face, is as good as it gets.

Thanks, and please reply via email or below if you think you might be able to make it.

The HANA Board

[cj's dad]

SARATOGA


Please keep in mind the period of August 15th thru the 23rd at Saratoga when on a typical Saturday (22nd), somewhere in the neighborhood of 15-20 PA members will be in "the tent".

[DeanT]

If all goes well it hopefully wont be the first and only.

It is pretty amazing how many members are from Lexington, so that is a good start. As well, KEE in the spring is a destination for many. I am looking forward to meeting Mike Maloney, perhaps Ray Paulick, Ron Tiller and a few others from the area.

I wonder if Rich B makes it at that time. I would like to meet him too.

I hope a few PA'ers are there at that time.

[rrbauer]

.

I wonder if Rich B makes it at that time. I would like to meet him too.



Is a pig's ass, pork? :)

[DeanT]

I'm taking that as a "hell ya I will be there! :)

Looking forward to it Rich.

[Charli125]

I'll be there. I've been looking for an excuse to get out to Keeneland, and this is it. I might even talk the fiance into it...we'll see.

Does anyone know how close the Sheraton is to the track?

[BillW]

I'll be there. I've been looking for an excuse to get out to Keeneland, and this is it. I might even talk the fiance into it...we'll see.

Does anyone know how close the Sheraton is to the track?

If it's in Lexington, It can't be too far. Do you have an address?

[BillW]

There's a 4-points by Sheraton just off of Newtown Pike. That's maybe 15 mins from the track. (warning, I'm bad at estimating distances :) )

[Charli125]

There's a 4-points by Sheraton just off of Newtown Pike. That's maybe 15 mins from the track. (warning, I'm bad at estimating distances :) )

That's the one. Perfect.

[rrbauer]

There's a 4-points by Sheraton just off of Newtown Pike. That's maybe 15 mins from the track. (warning, I'm bad at estimating distances :) )

15 min will cover it easy.

[Charli125]

I bought my tickets and booked my hotel. I'll be there the evening of the 15th through the evening of the 19th.

I'm coming on my own, so i hope you lot are a friendly bunch.

[DeanT]

We should be able to have a chat before this, but if something happens, just look for Bill W standing by the walking ring. He will be carrying a netbook, and be wearing these.

http://images7.cafepress.com/product/314350367v2_350x350_Front.jpg

[rrbauer]

I bought my tickets and booked my hotel. I'll be there the evening of the 15th through the evening of the 19th.

I'm coming on my own, so i hope you lot are a friendly bunch.

We're "friendly" when we're winning. Awful company otherwise! Looking forward to meeting you. When it gets closer we'll arrange a meeting spot. I will be there and I think BillW will be there on the dates you mention. If they let DeanT into the country and we excuse his bad habits (harness racing) he might be there also.

[Charli125]

We're "friendly" when we're winning. Awful company otherwise! Looking forward to meeting you. When it gets closer we'll arrange a meeting spot. I will be there and I think BillW will be there on the dates you mention. If they let DeanT into the country and we excuse his bad habits (harness racing) he might be there also.

I think we're all a lot more friendly when we're winning. Having never been to a track outside of CA and WA, what is the recommended attire? I'd love to show up in my HANA shirt, but I'm not sure if they have some sort of dress code, it being the South and all.

[DeanT]

When I went I stopped at a drugstore on the way and kids were in there for UK all dressed up, and they were buying booze (I was too, I had to get some Kentucky bourbon). I asked where they were going, thinking a wedding, but they were heading to the track! That was really cool.

I wore regular clothes. But it was interesting to see so many folks dressed up.

BillW will be wearing the above, so pretty much anything is acceptable I guess :)

[BillW]

When I went I stopped at a drugstore on the way and kids were in there for UK all dressed up, and they were buying booze (I was too, I had to get some Kentucky bourbon). I asked where they were going, thinking a wedding, but they were heading to the track! That was really cool.

I wore regular clothes. But it was interesting to see so many folks dressed up.

BillW will be wearing the above, so pretty much anything is acceptable I guess :)

It sucks being a moderator. So many snappy comebacks, but I'd have to moderate myself (and in public too, the shame would be unbearable! :eek: )

There are dress codes for the restaurants which are probably already full. Otherwise you can get away with just about anything. The kids get into dressing up, but it's not required, just tradition.

[miesque]

I think we're all a lot more friendly when we're winning. Having never been to a track outside of CA and WA, what is the recommended attire? I'd love to show up in my HANA shirt, but I'm not sure if they have some sort of dress code, it being the South and all.

That is a very true statement. :D

While at this point I do not have my specific attire planned, I will just state that being in danger of failing to meet the dress code has never been an issue for be at any track. I realize there are probably a few people who have actually spent time with me at the track with me who are :lol: as they read this because my attire has a pretty narrow range and it doesn't matter what track I am at.

[rrbauer]

The only "dress code" at Keeneland is in their clubhouse (their turf club) which is coat/tie for gents and it's not open to the general public anyway; and, a couple of the restaurants with similar requirements (see their website).

I will go anywhere my jeans and HANA sweatshirt will take me. If they don't want my money then that's their problem. There is no dress code in the box seat areas or other sections.

[DeanT]

Ok that salts it Charlie. The summary: Look for Bauer in a HANA shirt and jeans, Billw with a netbook and HANA boxers, and Theresia in an evening gown and pearls :)

[Charli125]

The only "dress code" at Keeneland is in their clubhouse (their turf club) which is coat/tie for gents and it's not open to the general public anyway; and, a couple of the restaurants with similar requirements (see their website).

I will go anywhere my jeans and HANA sweatshirt will take me. If they don't want my money then that's their problem. There is no dress code in the box seat areas or other sections.

That's good enough for me.

[BillW]

Ok that salts it Charlie. The summary: Look for Bauer in a HANA shirt and jeans, Billw with a netbook and HANA boxers, and Theresia in an evening gown and pearls :)

T. is going to get lost in the sea of co-eds. they do like to dress up there. :ThmbUp:

[Grits]

Bill, we've met at the track in the past. Maybe not the distance factor, but on Fridays and the weekend I might allow more time than this, or else some of you guys may be sitting in traffic, then finding the only parking left--way out on the hill with a very long walk to the gate.

People traveling from all directions on Interstates 64 and 75 are converging at Newtown Pike, moving on to New Circle Rd. New Circle can back up on Fridays and the weekends from--before the Keeneland exit to the side entrance (at Man O War) and the 1/4 mile further front entrance (on Versailles.)

You guys allow yourselves a bit more time on weekends. Especially coming from the various motels on the Interstates. And for anyone visiting Lexington for the first time, whatever you do, DO NOT exceed the speed limit on New Circle Road at any time. No to, or from, the track, the restaurants throughout town, etc. Those who do so are a huge source of revenue for the city.:rolleyes:

The only thing worth adding concerning attire choices. Make sure they're varied. April in Kentucky can go from 75 one day to 35 the next. With wind! Traveling down through the Ohio Valley.

Bill, remember the Spring meet a couple of years ago?

Monsoon, and sweaters and jackets--come to mind.

There's a 4-points by Sheraton just off of Newtown Pike. That's maybe 15 mins from the track. (warning, I'm bad at estimating distances :) )

[Jim the Tolerable]

Just ordered the tickets. I'll be there with my HANA pin proudly displayed.

[highnote]

You guys allow yourselves a bit more time on weekends. Especially coming from the various motels on the Interstates. And for anyone visiting Lexington for the first time, whatever you do, DO NOT exceed the speed limit on New Circle Road at any time. No to, or from, the track, the restaurants throughout town, etc. Those who do so are a huge source of revenue for the city.:rolleyes:


See this link for lists of speed traps in Lexington/Keeneland area

http://www.speedtrap.org/speed-traps/keyword/keeneland/Kentucky/Lexington

New Circle Rd. Bypass Lexington, KY
On the outer loop they will sit just over the bridges at Clays mill rd and Parkers mill rd but sometimes in the straights. Mostly at rush hours times. Also on the inter loop but not as often

[Charli125]

This might be a stupid question, but I'm always amazed at the places that don't have taxi's.

I won't be renting a car, as I don't drive.(No, I don't have a DUI, yes, my license expired! I live in a city, and never have need to drive. I know, it's weird.) Is there cab service in the area?

[BillW]

This might be a stupid question, but I'm always amazed at the places that don't have taxi's.

I won't be renting a car, as I don't drive.(No, I don't have a DUI, yes, my license expired! I live in a city, and never have need to drive. I know, it's weird.) Is there cab service in the area?

I imagine it will be easy to find one with the airport across the street.

here is what google turned up:

http://lexington-ky.addresses.com/cities/taxi-cabs/Lexington-KY-1407.html

[rrbauer]

Where are you staying? Contact them and see what they suggest. They might have a shuttle.

[miesque]

I will be staying at the Hilton Suites Lexington Greene (which is the Nicholasville exit 19 on New Circle), so if anyone else is staying there or in the immediate vicinity let me know. :)

[Charli125]

I just talked to the Sheraton and she said that there is no shuttle, but it's easy to get a cab. Excellent.

I remember flying into some small airport in Virginia, and I had told my friend that I'd catch a cab. Unfortunately, there was no such thing.

[BillW]

I just got into Lexington last night. Anybody at the track? PM me.

[Grits]

I'm slowly debating it. But not until after Easter. I mean, really, it didn't look exactly like Spring today while watching TVG. How long are you gonna be there?

I just got into Lexington last night. Anybody at the track? PM me.

[BillW]

I'm slowly debating it. But not until after Easter. I mean, really, it didn't look exactly like Spring today while watching TVG. How long are you gonna be there?

Thu the 19th (HANA day at the races is on the 18th) It was a bit cool today but cleared toward the end of the day. Tomorrow should be sunny.

[Grits]

If I get into town, I'll pm you. Storm Cadet, Maxspa, or TomCat coming?Thu the 19th (HANA day at the races is on the 18th) It was a bit cool today but cleared toward the end of the day. Tomorrow should be sunny.

[BillW]

If I get into town, I'll pm you. Storm Cadet, Maxspa, or TomCat coming?

Tomcat lives here ( and did nicely today at the track!) SC and Max are no shows as far as I know (at least they are keeping it a secret from me :) )

[JustRalph]

Bill............tell Tom I said hi..............

looks like I am out this trip

[Charli125]

I made it in last night, and I'm still busy noticing all of the nuances of this place.


They have shrieking hawk sounds piped over a VERY loud speaker system outside the airport. While waiting for the shuttle I must have looked like a crazy person each time I ducked to avoid the invisible hawk.

Everyone here says sir. I'm a respectful guy, and I respect my elders, but I don't call the kid making my coffee sir. So far, everyone has called me sir, even when they were busy telling me no with an incredulous look on their face. Such as, "No sir, we don't have any food at the hotel after 9. I'm sorry sir, but everyone has already had their supper."

My hotel doesn't serve food after 9 pm. No food in the bar, no room service, no vending machines, etc. So, I walked across the street to the Waffle House which my hotel bartender assured me was not to be missed. I thought she was messing with me, but the food was actually pretty good. Substituting hash browns for french fries is genius.

It's a bit overcast right now, and a little windy, but it looks like it'll burn off by race time. I am really looking forward to my first visit to Keeneland.

[cj's dad]

If you think that you have encountered politeness so far, wait until you get to the track. Doors opened for you, pleases, thank yous and sirs are never ending.


A classy place IMO.

[Jeff P]

Just a quick update...

I'm sitting here at KEE with some of the guys... I'm on my second beer. We have a table on level 2 right in front of the paddock. Laptops and printouts everywhere.

Richard Bauer is here... Stuball... Bill W... Tom S... Charli125... Miesque... Corby from BRIS... Mike Maloney joined us for a while... and a few others....

And we're having an absolute blast. Stuball already paid for his trip. He nailed the exacta in R3... and a then followed that up by (after waiting for what seemed like ages for the results of the nose photo to be announed... and then sitting through an abjection afterwards) cashing on the 50-1 shot in R8.

We're here and having a blast... live racing in a great venue. Win or lose you can't ask for a better day than that.

If you're in the Lexington area shoot us an email and make plans to meet up:

horseplayersassociation @ gmal . com
(remove the blank spaces first)


-jp

.

[Warren Henry]

I hope that you are taking lots of pictures to post for those of us who couldn't make it this year.

[JustRalph]

Bill, you didn't let him have my seat did you?

Any word on Pincus?

[BillW]

Bill, you didn't let him have my seat did you?

Any word on Pincus?

Nah, Pincus is still a no show :confused: And your seat has an honored place among us :p .

[BillW]

HANA will be presenting in the 6th race today :jump:

[BUD]

HANA will be presenting in the 6th race today :jump:

Kudus---You folks looked great!!
Have fun.

[JustRalph]

anybody get video?

[rrbauer]

If you don't know who Mike Maloney is then go to Blood Horse and just type in his name in the search block. I first encountered Mike in 2000 at Keeneland. Several of the high-volume players there were allowed to use some of the corporate boxes (read: luxury suites) during the simulcasting (no live racing) seasons. We are talking corporate boardroom layouts here. Some of them even had tote terminals in the suites. I hung out with a couple of the players that I knew in the suites that they were using. Mike was in a suite at the other end and there were a couple mutuel clerks in a centrally-located common area . What I remember about Mike was that he commanded complete attention from the clerks when he came out of his "office" and started calling bets. He would start calling bets before he even got to a window and in a period of about 30 seconds he would call hundreds of dollars of exacta and trifecta bets on a race, grab his tix and go back to his "office" to watch the race...usually this was while the horses were being loaded!

Fast forward to Keeneland today. Mike arranged for HANA to use his 3rd floor "boardroom" today (Friday) and tomorrow. About 10 TV's, computer, printer, tote terminal, yada, yada. And Keeneland provided a lot of food and beverage comps, etc. But, it doesn't end there. Mike Maloney was seen in the crowds at Keeneland passing out HANA literature and talking up the virtues of HANA and horseplayers coming together to improve the game.

Keeneland: #1 HANA track. Mike Maloney: #1 HANA member.

[BillW]

Tremendous help and support. A huge :ThmbUp: !

[DeanT]

If you don't know who Mike Maloney is then go to Blood Horse and just type in his name in the search block. I first encountered Mike in 2000 at Keeneland. Several of the high-volume players there were allowed to use some of the corporate boxes (read: luxury suites) during the simulcasting (no live racing) seasons. We are talking corporate boardroom layouts here. Some of them even had tote terminals in the suites. I hung out with a couple of the players that I knew in the suites that they were using. Mike was in a suite at the other end and there were a couple mutuel clerks in a centrally-located common area . What I remember about Mike was that he commanded complete attention from the clerks when he came out of his "office" and started calling bets. He would start calling bets before he even got to a window and in a period of about 30 seconds he would call hundreds of dollars of exacta and trifecta bets on a race, grab his tix and go back to his "office" to watch the race...usually this was while the horses were being loaded!

Fast forward to Keeneland today. Mike arranged for HANA to use his 3rd floor "boardroom" today (Friday) and tomorrow. About 10 TV's, computer, printer, tote terminal, yada, yada. And Keeneland provided a lot of food and beverage comps, etc. But, it doesn't end there. Mike Maloney was seen in the crowds at Keeneland passing out HANA literature and talking up the virtues of HANA and horseplayers coming together to improve the game.

Keeneland: #1 HANA track. Mike Maloney: #1 HANA member.

Makes me smile. Thanks for this Rich.

[Jeff P]

Wrap Up Day Two
Met with Hank Zeitlin - President and CEO of Equibase. Hank was kind enough to sit down and talk with us - and then introduce us around and give us a tour of the IT Center. I never before realized that Equibase was part of the Jockey Club and just how much they do for all of us. One thing we did do was start a dialog about one area where (my opinion) the industry could do a better job of disseminating information to players: Scratches and changes in real time. I plan to follow up that initial conversation with ideas about accomplishing the desired goal: Getting a system in place where scratches and changes are published on the web in one location in real time.


We also met with Keeneland President Nick Nicholson. I can't say enough about the hospitality he has shown us. He really rolled out the red carpet for us. On a crowded Fri afternoon he set us up with a private room... monitors everywhere... a fully stocked fridge... our own betting machine... food and drink vouchers... and even let us present the trophy to the winning connections after race 6.

I have to second what Richard said about Mike Maloney. I can't say enough good things about this guy. Not only did he pass out HANA flyers and talk to people for us, and let us use his private "office," I found him to be completely laid back, open, and approachable about his handicapping. How many serious players can you say that about? We had dinner with him tonight - at a place where he knows the owner... we talked horses and betting and told jokes and just had a good time...

Like I said, I'm just blown away by the hospitality everybody here has shown us.

-jp

.

[BillW]

anybody get video?

I'll see what I can do.

[ManeMediaMogul]

1st) Turfway Park starters usually have the edge in Keeneland's cheap claimers. JOE SIX PACK is sharp right now and offers good value at 8-1 on Mike Battaglia's morning line.

3rd) FIVE BOROUGHS is by outstanding Polytrack sire Distorted Humor. He posted a nifty five-furlong work here on April 7 to tip his readiness. Garrett Gomez enhances his chances.

9th) Winstar Farm's horses have been lights out at the meeting. ADVICE, a hard to ride colt, had trouble in the Sunland Derby and came back to outwork Bittel Road at Keeneland on April 12. Pletcher takes the blinkers off today after a one-race experiment and puts racing's strongest rider, Garrett Gomez on for the Coolmore Lexington (G2).

[miesque]

I am in complete agreement with the comments of Rich and Jeff, Keeneland has been extremely gracious with their hospitality and as a first timer at Keeneland this weekend that was the one aspect that struck me the most, its the little things that make a difference in any experience including a visit to the track and Keeneland is one of the few tracks that seems to understand that. I am someone that travels around a fair amount each year to different tracks throughout the country and I have been known to be rather critical at times but so far in my trip I have not had any complaints. I am also in complete concurrence with Jeff and Rich regarding Mike Maloney, he is a true class act.

[BillW]

Jeff on TVG real soon!

[BUD]

Now--DVR ing it!!

[JimG]

Just saw it. Jeff did a good job and gave props to Paceadvantage.com

Jim

[bobbyb]

WOW!!!

HANA"s message loud and clear on TVG.

Congrats Jeff

bobby

[hoovesupsideyourhe]

Just a quick update...

I'm sitting here at KEE with some of the guys... I'm on my second beer. We have a table on level 2 right in front of the paddock. Laptops and printouts everywhere.

Richard Bauer is here... Stuball... Bill W... Tom S... Charli125... Miesque... Corby from BRIS... Mike Maloney joined us for a while... and a few others....

And we're having an absolute blast. Stuball already paid for his trip. He nailed the exacta in R3... and a then followed that up by (after waiting for what seemed like ages for the results of the nose photo to be announed... and then sitting through an abjection afterwards) cashing on the 50-1 shot in R8.

We're here and having a blast... live racing in a great venue. Win or lose you can't ask for a better day than that.

If you're in the Lexington area shoot us an email and make plans to meet up:

horseplayersassociation @ gmal . com
(remove the blank spaces first)


-jp

.

great job on air jeff

[DeanT]

Really proud of you Jeff. That is tough to do for a computer geeky guy :)

Well done. The web traffic is outstanding, and the little organization is growing today thanks to that, and everyone at Keeneland.

:ThmbUp:

[DeanT]

PS: Someone get that clip digitized. I barely know how to work my microwave.

[BillW]

PS: Someone get that clip digitized. I barely know how to work my microwave.

Microwave won't do it. Most people can't handle that format :lol: I'll hit TVG up for it when I can.

[DeanT]

Tell Jeff he cost me money with all this web traffic and emails. I missed betting Mike Maker in race three. Damn that Platt. He owes me at least three beer. At a nice place, too :)

Looks like a nice day out there, so enjoy yourself.

[JustRalph]

the thing to take from the interview was Todd Schrupp

telling Jeff that TVG wants to be the network to "get the word out" for HANA

I think he was making a statement there............

[BUD]

DiTTo JR DiTTo

the thing to take from the interview was Todd Schrupp

telling Jeff that TVG wants to be the network to "get the word out" for HANA

I think he was making a statement there............

[rrbauer]

They came within a couple hundred of an all time attendance record today. Big crowds are tough at this place.

Disappointed that there weren't ANY (I think this is right) local HANA members other than Mike Maloney that joined our group. We had folks from Washington, Calif, Texas, Alabama, Tennessee, Indiana, Wisconsin and Virginia all show up on their own nickel. C'mon Kentucky we need your support! Horse racing is your state's life blood....show it!

[Jeff P]

Day 3 Wrap Up Sat

HANA Day at the Races Sat 4-18-2009

The day began with breakfast at the Horseman's Kitchen on the backside. On the walk over from the kitchen to the front gate we stopped to let a man on horseback pass us near the shedrow. HANA member Fred Palmer recognized him and called out "Larry Jones!" Larry stopped and chatted for a few seconds. It wasn't until Larry removed his helmet that I recognized him myself.

We met with Keeneland President Nick Nicholson. He described the incredible amount of forethought and detail that went into many of the things that most visitors at Keeneland might take for granted... for example the height of the infield toteboard in relation to line of sight - so that horses running down the backstretch are always visible from the grandstand... how the poles indicating the finish line have the mirror located in the right place: the exact center of the pole marking the finish area. This causes the line in photo finishes to match up perfectly with the area marked as the finish line by the pole.

Note: This is something that should be a no brainer for all tracks everywhere. I can think of a lot of tracks where the mirror is placed several feet away from the pole. IMHO this is bad practice. It gives you a false finish line... a pole marked "Finish" when in fact the mirror several feet away from the pole is used as the actual finish line. As with a lot of things - Keeneland has this part exactly right.

Then we talked about some of the things that matter to us players:

1. Track Signal Availability to ADWs
2. Takeout
3. Drugs
4. Pool Integrity

We started a genuine dialog on these areas. And even though we had blocked off more than an hour for the meeting we ran out of time. Nick had to leave to introduce the chior members who sang the national anthem. But he graciously agreed to sit down and meet with us again tomorrow.

Then we met with Tony Allevato of TVG - who asked me to be a guest on their live broadcast.

I've never been on TV before and didn't know quite what to expect. Todd and Matt asked some questions about HANA, takeout, and drugs. One thing I didn't want to do was bash the industry too hard while on camera. HANA is all about giving the player a voice and making the industry aware of customer needs and wants. I hope it came off ok.

Then there was a day of live racing. I managed to have a good day. But in the post parade before the Lexington I noticed that #11 Advice was acting up, tossing his head, and shying from the crowd. Theresia, who posts as Miesque, was sitting next to me and liked the horse. I'm afraid my negative comments about his pre-race antics were a little too strong. I think I talked her off the horse... who came rolling over the top of them late to pay $33.60 to win. If I had it to do over again I would have kept quiet as a MOUSE.

After the races we had dinner and drinks with Mike Maloney and Matt Carothers. Mike told some racing stories that had me laughing so hard I literally couldn't breathe.

It was a long day - one that was over all too soon. I'm really starting to like this place. It grows on you... the hospitality... the racing... the people.


-jp

.

[DeanT]

Blog readers keep asking for photos, so get me some you bums! And stop drinking with the boys, you have programming to do :)

Nice wrap up!

[kenwoodallpromos]

You did good on TV! I too like to see ALL the race!

[Cangamble]

Are we going to be able to get the interview up on Youtube?

[BillW]

Are we going to be able to get the interview up on Youtube?

Working on it. I just need to get them my e-mail address.

[Grits]

Then there was a day of live racing. I managed to have a good day. But in the post parade before the Lexington I noticed that #11 Advice was acting up, tossing his head, and shying from the crowd. Theresia, who posts as Miesque, was sitting next to me and liked the horse. I'm afraid my negative comments about his pre-race antics were a little too strong. I think I talked her off the horse... who came rolling over the top of them late to pay $33.60 to win. If I had it to do over again I would have kept quiet as a MOUSE.

This has been a nice thread, you all have achieved a great deal.

JeffP, you really, really should have remained quiet. LOLOL

Its distressing when this happens to someone. Its terribly unfortunate. Too, it can ruin one's day. We get by, knowing, there are days we'll come back with our choice hitting the wire first.

I didn't bet on this race, but I did watch it from the paddock, to the post parade, to the wire.

Advice, not only looked dead fit, he could NOT keep his four feet on the ground. Hard to contain himself, he was constant, in-place motion. I don't care what he looked like on paper, he looked extraordinary in the physical sense, pre race.

Obviously, we all see differences in horses, and maybe I'm coming out of the woodwork, post race here, whatever . . . . still, he looked like a million bucks worth of ready-to-run racehorse.

I'm sorry this happened to Miesque, if, indeed, you did talk her off of this one.

[PaceAdvantage]

Wow...I'm gone a few days and look at everything I missed! WOW!

Good going guys! Jeff gets to be on TVG AND dine with Matt C.? Seems like some folks out there are rightly taking HANA seriously...as well they should...

I'm pretty blown away with how far HANA has come in such a short time...you guys ROCK!

And please, someone get that video of Jeff on TVG up somewhere on YouTube...I missed it!

[BillW]

Wow...I'm gone a few days and look at everything I missed! WOW!

Good going guys! Jeff gets to be on TVG AND dine with Matt C.? Seems like some folks out there are rightly taking HANA seriously...as well they should...

I'm pretty blown away with how far HANA has come in such a short time...you guys ROCK!

And please, someone get that video of Jeff on TVG up somewhere on YouTube...I missed it!

I just talked to Matt C. after the races this evening and reminded him to have it sent out to us. We have a place reserved on our youtube site :) .

[kid4rilla]

They came within a couple hundred of an all time attendance record today. Big crowds are tough at this place.

Disappointed that there weren't ANY (I think this is right) local HANA members other than Mike Maloney that joined our group. We had folks from Washington, Calif, Texas, Alabama, Tennessee, Indiana, Wisconsin and Virginia all show up on their own nickel. C'mon Kentucky we need your support! Horse racing is your state's life blood....show it!

I didn't make it, but trust I am telling everyone who I come across to be a part of HANA. The pub on TVG really helped, and I am really excited about the possibilities of the "procott", and the actual possibility that players can work together.

Is it possible to have a "black list" of wagers/venues with usurious takeouts that can be communicated to members to stay away from? How about a 10-most-wanted-type wager list that indicates which wagers are the worst and track managements can try and avoid being on the list?

[DeanT]

Is it possible to have a "black list" of wagers/venues with usurious takeouts that can be communicated to members to stay away from? How about a 10-most-wanted-type wager list that indicates which wagers are the worst and track managements can try and avoid being on the list?

That is a very good idea! :ThmbUp:

[Cangamble]

That is a very good idea! :ThmbUp:
I love the idea too. :ThmbUp: I wonder why:)

[Indulto]

I didn't make it, but trust I am telling everyone who I come across to be a part of HANA. The pub on TVG really helped, and I am really excited about the possibilities of the "procott", and the actual possibility that players can work together.

Is it possible to have a "black list" of wagers/venues with usurious takeouts that can be communicated to members to stay away from? How about a 10-most-wanted-type wager list that indicates which wagers are the worst and track managements can try and avoid being on the list?K4,
Carrot AND a stick -- sort of a hidden boycott -- what a tremendous idea, and thanks for sharing it publicly. It's nice to know where the good ideas are coming from.:ThmbUp:

[DeanT]

9th) Winstar Farm's horses have been lights out at the meeting. ADVICE, a hard to ride colt, had trouble in the Sunland Derby and came back to outwork Bittel Road at Keeneland on April 12. Pletcher takes the blinkers off today after a one-race experiment and puts racing's strongest rider, Garrett Gomez on for the Coolmore Lexington (G2).

Missed this. Did you shoot and score? Hope so!

[rrbauer]

Is it possible to have a "black list" of wagers/venues with usurious takeouts that can be communicated to members to stay away from? How about a 10-most-wanted-type wager list that indicates which wagers are the worst and track managements can try and avoid being on the list?


You could start here:

http://www.trackthieves.com/TakeoutType.html

[BillW]

I didn't make it, but trust I am telling everyone who I come across to be a part of HANA. The pub on TVG really helped, and I am really excited about the possibilities of the "procott", and the actual possibility that players can work together.


Thanks for the support!


Is it possible to have a "black list" of wagers/venues with usurious takeouts that can be communicated to members to stay away from? How about a 10-most-wanted-type wager list that indicates which wagers are the worst and track managements can try and avoid being on the list?

We're peddling as fast as we can. Full, up to date takeout list is coming. :)

[BillW]

Disappointed that there weren't ANY (I think this is right) local HANA members other than Mike Maloney that joined our group.

Dr. Coney joined us for a while on Saturday and Purplepower made it by Sunday after you left.

[ManeMediaMogul]

Missed this. Did you shoot and score? Hope so!

Made the weekend for me as I didn't make a bet on Sunday. I was alive for alot of money in the late double but missed. Still did very well in the Coolmore with a nice straight bet and a good exacta. Thanks for asking!

[Jeff P]

Wrap Up Day 4 Sun 4-19-2009

It rained today... but that didn't stop us.

Met again with Keeneland President Nick Nicholson. We discussed (in some detail) the issues of track signal availability, takeout, drugs, and pool integrity. We talked about HANA goals and racing industry goals - and how they are basically one and the same. I came away from today's meeting with two things:

1. A realization that a positive relationship now exists between the management of Keeneland and HANA where none existed before.

2. There actually ARE track execs that get it. Nick certainly fits that description.

I'll just leave things at that.

Today was also Military Appreciation Day. Nick explained to us the idea behind this event. Several thousand US Army soldiers - who are still in basic training - are given one day off at the race track. Banks of phone booths are set up, and the soldiers are allowed to make phone calls to anywhere in the world. They call home to their families... wives, children, etc. Nick explained that the first year of the event people were thanking the soldiers for doing what they do and just handing over their cell phones. And I saw lots of that going on first hand today myself. He also explained that the soldiers bought so much ice cream that first year that Keeneland ran out! This year he made sure they had enough on hand for all of them.

Then there was a day of live racing. Miesque headed up to the dining room on level four - while a few of us took over Mike Maloney's "office" again. Stuball had another good day and so did I. Purple Power stopped in. And so did DBantu. He and I talked about HANA goals for a while. Then we talked shop about programming, handicapping methodologies, and professionalism amongst horseplayers.

He brought along a buddy who is a sports bettor and poker player... who oddly enough has almost no interest whatsoever in playing horses. We discussed at length the reasons why... which only highlighted the things HANA is trying to get across to the industry.

After the races we found Mike Maloney in the dining room and said our goodbye's. I can't thank Mike enough for the doors he opened for us at HANA and for all his hospitality here in Kentucky. I really am at a complete loss for words here.

Afterwards we drove out to visit a horse farm.... Zach Kinneman's Tahoma Stud http://tahomastud.com/default.aspx Zach, his wife Kate, and their Farm Manager Otto were kind enough to show us around. We got to pet some of the foals. Zach and Kate then took us to the pasture where 23 year old Mr. Bolg still romps. (They rescued him from a kill pen.) And let me tell you he still looks magnificent. They were even kind enough to give us a tour of the farmhouse (built in the 1820's) that they are restoring.

Again, I am simply blown away by the hospitality and the openess of the people here. If you've never been here you're missing out.


-jp

.

[Jeff P]

Wrap Up Day 5 Mon 4-20-2009

KY Horse Park
We visited the KY Horse Park today. http://www.kyhorsepark.com/index.php Wandered through the museum. And then walked the grounds including the Hall of Champions - which was my favorite. Cigar, Kona Gold, and Funny Cide were there. Cigar ignored us. But Theresia (Miesque) was able to call Funny Cide over to us and soon I was scratching his forehead. It's kind of an overwhelming feeling (at least for me.) As a computer player most of the time I think of the game in terms of 1's and 0's. Scratching the forehead of such a magnificent animal was both exhilirating and humbling at the same time. It was my first time at the Horse Park and I know I'll be back.

Meeting with HDW Data
I met with the guys at HDW... They're based in Georgetown, KY - not far from the KY Horse Park where I was staying. We talked about HANA objectives: improving the game in the areas of signal availability, takeout, drugs, and pool integrity. Then we talked a little bit about quirks in the data itself - and about the need from a player perspective to push for scratches and changes in real time - and where breakdowns in reporting of scratches and changes actually occurs.

Meeting with Equibase
Equibase was gracious enough to meet with me a second time. Present were Equibase President & CEO Hank Zeitlin, Matt McCoy, Rhonda Norby, and Ellis Starr. My goal was to communicate the need from the player's perspective of having one source (Equibase.com) be a place where horseplayers can go to get changes in real time. To clarify, when I say changes, I'm talking about scratches, races off the turf, and rider changes.

The problem isn't a lack of computer power or the ability to report changes quickly on the Equibase site once information is received from the tracks. All of the tracks currently have access to a computerized reporting system. The system itself appears perfectly capable of getting the job done.

The problem appears to be that that human beings (at the track level) occasionally fail to use the system in a timely manner or occasionally make mistakes when they do.

We discussed ways to stop this from happening.

My goal in setting up this meeting was to communicate customer needs and wants to the industry. I think that was accomplished and more. One result of this meeting is that a positive relationship now exists between Equibase and HANA where none existed before. I came away with a very strong sense that Equibase is on the same page as we are. They understand the importance of accuracy and timeliness in reporting scratches and changes. A dialogue on this issue has been started and the parties involved are now much more aware of player needs and wants on this issue than they were before. I'll leave things at that for now.


-jp

.

[Jeff P]

Keeneland IT was kind enough to cut a .wmv file of the trophy presentation on Fri.

Link:
http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/hanapresentation.wmv



-jp

.

[JustRalph]

Good Stuff.......... :ThmbUp:

[BillW]

First I've heard Becker's audio. He was well prepped. :ThmbUp:

[Indulto]

...
http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/hanapresentation.wmv
...I think I can figure out which one miesque is. Does anybody else want to be recognized? ;)

[miesque]

I think I can figure out which one miesque is. Does anybody else want to be recognized? ;)

Thats just me in cognito, I am really a bald, fat 6'4" guy in my seventies...:D

[DeanT]

I think I can figure out which one miesque is. Does anybody else want to be recognized? ;)

I am the short girl in the suit. I just post as a guy to keep paceadvantage posters from wanting to date me.

[PaceAdvantage]

OK, I have to ask...who is the guy in black who kind of has that Harvey Keitel thing going on....(don't take offense...the video is grainy...if you don't like Harvey, then I'm sure you look nothing like him in real life!) :lol:

He's standing way to the right of the screen at the very end...

[miesque]

Here is the actual Winners Circle Picture snapshot for those that are interested.

[Charli125]

OK, I have to ask...who is the guy in black who kind of has that Harvey Keitel thing going on....(don't take offense...the video is grainy...if you don't like Harvey, then I'm sure you look nothing like him in real life!) :lol:

He's standing way to the right of the screen at the very end...

I think his name was Fred something. Quite an interesting character, with lot's to say...

By the way, I'm the guy in the hat.

[BillW]

Thanks for the support!



We're peddling as fast as we can. Full, up to date takeout list is coming. :)

The full takeout (accurate as of the end of the year) and field sizes up to 3/01/2009 are up in the Player Resource area (http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/playerresources.html) of the HANA site. Each category is sortable. Wanna know who has the highest exacta takeout? Click on the title at the top of the column and scroll to the bottom! :)

http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/hanatrackratingsbytrackname.html

[chickenhead]

EXCELLENT!

(I notice it looks like the Trifecta sort is not working properly, all the others appear to be)

[BillW]

EXCELLENT!

(I notice it looks like the Trifecta sort is not working properly, all the others appear to be)

Ooops, we'll see what we can do about that :) .

[Cangamble]

The full takeout (accurate as of the end of the year) and field sizes up to 3/01/2009 are up in the Player Resource area (http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/playerresources.html) of the HANA site. Each category is sortable. Wanna know who has the highest exacta takeout? Click on the title at the top of the column and scroll to the bottom! :)

http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/hanatrackratingsbytrackname.html
I know we discussed this before, but it is important to note that the 50 cent supers section is from an American perspective.
Woodbine and Fort Erie, etc. do have 20 cent supers and win4's but you have to bet them at a Canadian track or through a Canadian ADW. Also, you can't bet 20 or 50 cent supers on US tracks when you are betting through Canadian ADW's or Canadian tracks.

[rwwupl]

I didn't make it, but trust I am telling everyone who I come across to be a part of HANA. The pub on TVG really helped, and I am really excited about the possibilities of the "procott", and the actual possibility that players can work together.

Is it possible to have a "black list" of wagers/venues with usurious takeouts that can be communicated to members to stay away from? How about a 10-most-wanted-type wager list that indicates which wagers are the worst and track managements can try and avoid being on the list?


I love it! The "Black List" or Most Wanted to avoid list is a good idea.

Thanks, The idea gets my vote. :cool:

[BillW]

I love it! The "Black List" or Most Wanted to avoid list is a good idea.

Thanks, The idea gets my vote. :cool:

It isn't our goal to alienate the "bottom of the list". We'd prefer that they contact us to discuss how they might "move up the charts". We would rather leave it to the viewer of the track rating page to decide the makeup of his/her own list :) .

[rwwupl]

It isn't our goal to alienate the "bottom of the list". We'd prefer that they contact us to discuss how they might "move up the charts". We would rather leave it to the viewer of the track rating page to decide the makeup of his/her own list :) .


One of HANA's functions is to provide a road map for players to determine where the best and worst offerings are.

Wasn't that the function also of the Track Ratings recently released?

The top ten was given much publicity. Why not the bottem ten?

[BillW]

Why not the bottem ten?

They're all up for the public to view:

http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/hanatrackratingsbytrackname.html

[miesque]

The purpose of these ratings are to enable the horseplayer to make an informed decision when putting their wagering capital to work. I strongly believe that knowledge is power and that by laying out takeout rates in this sort of sortable manner, players have the power to make a difference by making astute decisions on where to place their money. It is my personal view that if players really care about takeout rates then they should make an attempt to reward those tracks which do provide lower takeout on the pools they participate in. Failure to do so gives no incentive for a track to lower its takeout or think twice about raising takeout.

[CBedo]

They're all up for the public to view:

http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/hanatrackratingsbytrackname.html

Great table! Thanks

[rrbauer]

They're all up for the public to view:

http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/hanatrackratingsbytrackname.html

Good Work Bill!

What are the components of the "Exotic Pools per Race" figures? Figured how?

Thanks.

[BillW]

Good Work Bill!

What are the components of the "Exotic Pools per Race" figures? Figured how?

Thanks.

Thanks, Rich.

I went overboard with KISS. I added all exotics that paid off in each race (pk bets included) The exception was the wagers where there existed multiple payoffs (pk-6 for instance where 6 of 6 and conso's paid off in the same race), I had to make sure that I only used that figure once.

The Exotic pool averages are probably best viewed on a day to day basis rather than a race to race basis due to this but this is something to improve on in the future. The main concern with this release was getting the takeouts right which wasn't easy. The pool avgs. were a last minute addon.

[rrbauer]

TOP 20

35 KEE 3.4306
68 WRD* 2.5556
13 CD 2.5417
29 GP 2.5
45 OP 2.5
53 RP 2.4938
20 EVD 2.4444
33 HOO 2.4127
15 DMR 2.321
32 HOL 2.321
54 RET 2.2698
17 DED 2.2222
58 SA 2.1944
64 TAM 2.1806
67 TP* 2.1806
22 FG 2.0833
36 KD* 2.0694
7 BEL 2.0123
59 SAR 2.0123
28 GG 1.9877

BOTTOM 20

30 HST* 1.2222
50 PM 1.2037
65 TDN* 1.1944
56 RUI 1.0952
16 DEL 1.0794
63 SRP 1.0556
10 CRC* 1.0476
37 LRL 0.9167
48 PIM 0.9167
44 NP 0.9048
61 SUF 0.873
47 PHA 0.8472
55 RD* 0.8413
49 PNL 0.7963
1 ALB 0.7778
3 ARP 0.746
52 PID 0.6852
60 STP* 0.6528
27 FE* 0.463
5 ASD* 0.2917

[BillW]

Rich,

You can click on the top of each column to sort by that column - except for the trifecta column which is broke at the moment. :)

[SuffolkDowns Fan]

could some of these rates be out of the control of the track owners because the state legislature's have mandated the rates?

[BillW]

could some of these rates be out of the control of the track owners because the state legislature's have mandated the rates?

Of course, but from the horseplayer's perspective, it doesn't matter where the takeout is going or who is taking it, it is still lost money.

[rrbauer]

could some of these rates be out of the control of the track owners because the state legislature's have mandated the rates?

I promise you that there are NO RATES in effect that do not have the implicit approval of the industry heavyweights: The tracks and the horse owners. In the grand scheme of things, state governments get very little revenue from takeout and their piece comes from the top of the pile....not the bottom.

[BillW]

Rich,

You can click on the top of each column to sort by that column - except for the trifecta column which is broke at the moment. :)

Trifecta column sort is now functioning.

[Indulto]

The full takeout (accurate as of the end of the year) and field sizes up to 3/01/2009 are up in the Player Resource area (http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/playerresources.html) of the HANA site. Each category is sortable. Wanna know who has the highest exacta takeout? Click on the title at the top of the column and scroll to the bottom! :)

http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/hanatrackratingsbytrackname.html
This sortable spreadsheet is a very useful tool. Would adding sortable columns for average daily handle and average daily purses be of interest to anyone else?

Is this spreadsheet proprietary or is it downloadable to EXCEL for the kind of customization I'm talking about? Does anyone know what the source of such data would be?

[BillW]

This sortable spreadsheet is a very useful tool. Would adding sortable columns for average daily handle and average daily purses be of interest to anyone else?

Is this spreadsheet proprietary or is it downloadable to EXCEL for the kind of customization I'm talking about? Does anyone know what the source of such data would be?

Thanks. The handle info is sortable now. Purses can be put on the list of future upgrades.

We really haven't considered offering the spreadsheet for download. Have you tried just cutting and pasting the table into excel - the results are the same.

[rrbauer]

We really haven't considered offering the spreadsheet for download. Have you tried just cutting and pasting the table into excel - the results are the same.

That works fine although there may be sorting issues due to different cell sizes using the Excel sort feature. I cut and pasted two columns into a new worksheet and was able to sort with no problem.

[Indulto]

Thanks. The handle info is sortable now. Purses can be put on the list of future upgrades.

We really haven't considered offering the spreadsheet for download. Have you tried just cutting and pasting the table into excel - the results are the same.Thanks, BW.

The copy/paste worked on the whole table, but apparently with values only and not formulas (which is why I asked if was proprietary). Thus you can’t readily ask “what would track ABC’s rating be if it were to lower its takeout in pools X and Y.” BTW are these the same ratings as those published in the B-H?

Is there a way to generate average handle per race (and per day) from “MUT Pool Per Race” and “Exotic Pool Per Race?” Perhaps "No. of live racing dates" could join "Avg. Total Daily Handle" and "Avg. Daily Purse Dist" in the upgrade.

If I knew avg. total daily handle and avg. daily purse distribution, would I then be able to determine the % handle and/or takeout going to purses?

[BillW]

My suggestion was an interim solution. When I commented that we hadn't considered releasing the spreadsheet, I didn't mean it to sound that we decided not to but rather that we had literally not discussed it. I will bring it up. Of course it will take quite a bit of work to make it "releasable" to the public and we (read "I") will have take on the task of customer support as with any other product.

Thanks, BW.

The copy/paste worked on the whole table, but apparently with values only and not formulas (which is why I asked if was proprietary). Thus you can’t readily ask “what would track ABC’s rating be if it were to lower its takeout in pools X and Y.” BTW are these the same ratings as those published in the B-H?

Is there a way to generate average handle per race (and per day) from “MUT Pool Per Race” and “Exotic Pool Per Race?” Perhaps "No. of live racing dates" could join "Avg. Total Daily Handle" and "Avg. Daily Purse Dist" in the upgrade.

If I knew avg. total daily handle and avg. daily purse distribution, would I then be able to determine the % handle and/or takeout going to purses?

[Indulto]

My suggestion was an interim solution. When I commented that we hadn't considered releasing the spreadsheet, I didn't mean it to sound that we decided not to but rather that we had literally not discussed it. I will bring it up. Of course it will take quite a bit of work to make it "releasable" to the public and we (read "I") will have take on the task of customer support as with any other product.I appreciate that a lot of effort is involved and certainly HANA is entitled to at least donations for copies of the formulated spreadsheet. All my own personal data manipulation is done using Lotus 1-2-3 and dBASE/FoxPro (.WKS and .DBF files), but if I can ever be of any assistance in terms of data entry and/or conversion, please let me know. If I ever do manage to acquire the data I'm seeking, independently, you're welcome to it.

I currently maintain a Stakes Schedule database with purse and condition fields that lets me list upcoming races by date and within division (or surface) if desired. It can also list stakes within date by track ranked by grade and/or purse in decreasing purse sequence within ranked track. Someday I would like to start recording the BSR and field size for each stake after it was run.

[BillW]

Thanks, BW.

BTW are these the same ratings as those published in the B-H?



No the information has been updated. Most ratings didn't change much, but there were corrections/changes in takeouts and fieldsizes have been updated for the 3/01/08 thru 2/28/09 year.

[BillW]

Thanks, BW.


Is there a way to generate average handle per race (and per day) from “MUT Pool Per Race” and “Exotic Pool Per Race?” Perhaps "No. of live racing dates" could join "Avg. Total Daily Handle" and "Avg. Daily Purse Dist" in the upgrade.



The total avg. daily handle would simply be (Mutuel pool + Exotic Pool) X avg. # races per card. The exotic pool avg. is all inclusive.

[rrbauer]

Seems to me that the later threads in this post have nothing to do with HANA's day at the races and those posts that are aimed at the HANA track ratings should be moved over to a new thread. And, along those lines, it was disappointing to me that DeanT didn't show at Keeneland after hustling people to attend. What say you, Dean? Passport problems?

Anyway, BillW is one of the high-priests at this board so how about it Billy....can you move the track rating stuff over to a new thread?

[DeanT]

And, along those lines, it was disappointing to me that DeanT didn't show at Keeneland after hustling people to attend. What say you, Dean? Passport problems?

Work problems. I had to attend the conference this week as well, so it has been tough to keep the food on the table this month.