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08-20-2012, 11:26 AM
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#1
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Screw PC
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 15,728
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Augusta National opens membership to women
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...08-20-11-00-47
First two women members: Condi Rice and Darla Moore.
__________________
Truth sounds like hate to those who hate truth.
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08-20-2012, 11:40 AM
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 14,569
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Oh my......
Plenty of things can happen when the appropriate nuts are put in a vise. 
Seems 80%+ of pollsters here disagree:
http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...hlight=Augusta
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Want to know what's wrong with this country?
Here it is, in a nutshell: Millions of people are
pinning their hopes on a man who has every
chance of returning to the WH, assuming that
he can manage to stay out of prison. Think about it.
Last edited by horses4courses; 08-20-2012 at 11:42 AM.
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08-20-2012, 12:20 PM
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#3
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by horses4courses
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80% didn't say they disagree. They said Augusta can do what it wants.
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08-20-2012, 12:27 PM
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 14,569
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by cj
80% didn't say they disagree. They said Augusta can do what it wants.
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Exactly.
They were asked if Augusta National should open it's membership to women.
Change, or status quo. Easy choice.
__________________
Want to know what's wrong with this country?
Here it is, in a nutshell: Millions of people are
pinning their hopes on a man who has every
chance of returning to the WH, assuming that
he can manage to stay out of prison. Think about it.
Last edited by horses4courses; 08-20-2012 at 12:28 PM.
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08-20-2012, 12:28 PM
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#5
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Screw PC
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 15,728
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by cj
80% didn't say they disagree. They said Augusta can do what it wants.
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Sorry, but, most polls, like the one referenced in this thread, have poorly written captions. I tend to believe that 80% were reponding to the "they can do what they want" part and not stating, no, they should not allow women.
__________________
Truth sounds like hate to those who hate truth.
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08-20-2012, 12:33 PM
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 14,569
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by DJofSD
Sorry, but, most polls, like the one referenced in this thread, have poorly written captions. I tend to believe that 80% were reponding to the "they can do what they want" part and not stating, no, they should not allow women.
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Well, I'm so sorry. Please excuse my poor writing.
You really think the results would be different if it were a simple "yes" or "no"?
I very much doubt it.
__________________
Want to know what's wrong with this country?
Here it is, in a nutshell: Millions of people are
pinning their hopes on a man who has every
chance of returning to the WH, assuming that
he can manage to stay out of prison. Think about it.
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08-20-2012, 12:59 PM
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,128
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by horses4courses
Well, I'm so sorry. Please excuse my poor writing.
You really think the results would be different if it were a simple "yes" or "no"?
I very much doubt it.
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Absolutely the results would be different. They are two entirely different questions. You think "Augusta has the right to make its own policies" and "Augusta shouldn't allow women -- ever!" are the same thing? Talk about muddled thinking...
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08-20-2012, 01:01 PM
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 18,962
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There goes the neighborhood.
Just kidding of course. It's a smart move for Augusta.
Of course Martha Burk of the National Council of Women's Organizations is crowing this morning:
"Oh my God. We won. It's about 10 years too late for the boys to come into the 20th century, never mind the 21st century. But it's a milestone for women in business."
So there's one plank out of Martha's soap box.
She had her 15 minutes of fame in the sun, let's hope that's it.
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08-20-2012, 01:05 PM
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 14,569
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by GameTheory
Absolutely the results would be different. They are two entirely different questions. You think "Augusta has the right to make its own policies" and "Augusta shouldn't allow women -- ever!" are the same thing? Talk about muddled thinking...
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They are one and the same.
If Augusta National were allowed to do what they want, there would be no women members.
They have already been through the ringer on race and religion.
Pretty easy to know where they would be on that one, too, given the choice.
__________________
Want to know what's wrong with this country?
Here it is, in a nutshell: Millions of people are
pinning their hopes on a man who has every
chance of returning to the WH, assuming that
he can manage to stay out of prison. Think about it.
Last edited by horses4courses; 08-20-2012 at 01:06 PM.
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08-20-2012, 01:16 PM
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#10
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PA Steward
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 88,646
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by horses4courses
You really think the results would be different if it were a simple "yes" or "no"?
I very much doubt it.
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Of course they would be different. And they most certainly are NOT one and the same.
How many articles have been written about how important the wording of a poll is when trying not to "swing" results one way or another?
This is polling 101.
But you are free to ignorantly continue thinking all those who responded the way they did to your flawed poll are misogynists.
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08-20-2012, 01:22 PM
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 14,569
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage
Of course they would be different. And they most certainly are NOT one and the same.
How many articles have been written about how important the wording of a poll is when trying not to "swing" results one way or another?
This is polling 101.
But you are free to ignorantly continue thinking all those who responded the way they did to your flawed poll are misogynists.
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This poor writer puts it down to poor reading.
I wouldn't interpret the results as hatred towards women.
Perhaps, a tolerance of an archaic institution, and those in charge.
__________________
Want to know what's wrong with this country?
Here it is, in a nutshell: Millions of people are
pinning their hopes on a man who has every
chance of returning to the WH, assuming that
he can manage to stay out of prison. Think about it.
Last edited by horses4courses; 08-20-2012 at 01:28 PM.
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08-20-2012, 01:34 PM
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#12
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Screw PC
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 15,728
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Greyfox
There goes the neighborhood.
Just kidding of course. It's a smart move for Augusta.
Of course Martha Burk of the National Council of Women's Organizations is crowing this morning:
"Oh my God. We won. It's about 10 years too late for the boys to come into the 20th century, never mind the 21st century. But it's a milestone for women in business."
So there's one plank out of Martha's soap box.
She had her 15 minutes of fame in the sun, let's hope that's it.
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The Chinese say a journey begins with one step. They don't say anything about how long the trip takes.
I'm sure there are those which feel Augusta National should have had a knee-jerk response to allowing minorites and women by changing their policies immediately. Perhaps they should have. But, at least, now, the change is in place.
__________________
Truth sounds like hate to those who hate truth.
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08-20-2012, 01:47 PM
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,128
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by horses4courses
They are one and the same.
If Augusta National were allowed to do what they want, there would be no women members.
They have already been through the ringer on race and religion.
Pretty easy to know where they would be on that one, too, given the choice.
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More muddled thinking. Your original poll was badly conceived because it read as if you were asking whether or not they should essentially be forced to admit women against their will. I know I read it and answered that way myself -- NO, they should not. This has nothing to do with whether I agree with their preference to deny women, simply an affirmation of their right to do so. If your question was purely about whether we (the poll respondents) shared that same preference then you should have left the bit off about "they have the right to do what they please" and also added a "who cares?" option since I don't think any of us have a stake in it or not. If you had done that, I know I would have answered differently. I would then solidly be in the "who cares?" category, but if given just "Allow Women?" yes or no then I would have voted yes -- allow them.
But you made the question about rights and that's completely different, and so the answers you got were completely different from the question you apparently really wanted to ask, and that's what we are telling you now.
Why argue? Make a new poll with a clear question if you are wondering...
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08-20-2012, 02:16 PM
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 14,569
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by GameTheory
More muddled thinking. Your original poll was badly conceived because it read as if you were asking whether or not they should essentially be forced to admit women against their will. I know I read it and answered that way myself -- NO, they should not. This has nothing to do with whether I agree with their preference to deny women, simply an affirmation of their right to do so. If your question was purely about whether we (the poll respondents) shared that same preference then you should have left the bit off about "they have the right to do what they please" and also added a "who cares?" option since I don't think any of us have a stake in it or not. If you had done that, I know I would have answered differently. I would then solidly be in the "who cares?" category, but if given just "Allow Women?" yes or no then I would have voted yes -- allow them.
But you made the question about rights and that's completely different, and so the answers you got were completely different from the question you apparently really wanted to ask, and that's what we are telling you now.
Why argue? Make a new poll with a clear question if you are wondering...
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I take your point, and appreciate how you put it across.
As I stated above, I don't believe anyone voted as they did to be spiteful towards women.
They simply believe the club has a right to do whatever.
There's no point in doing another poll.
It's water under the bridge now.
What I expect to happen over time is the revelation as to how this change came about at Augusta National.
Not making a simple gesture such as awarding a green jacket to female IBM CEO, Ginny Rometty, obviously had ramifications.
Money talks.....
__________________
Want to know what's wrong with this country?
Here it is, in a nutshell: Millions of people are
pinning their hopes on a man who has every
chance of returning to the WH, assuming that
he can manage to stay out of prison. Think about it.
Last edited by horses4courses; 08-20-2012 at 02:18 PM.
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08-20-2012, 02:19 PM
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#15
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 9,893
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by horses4courses
This poor writer puts it down to poor reading.
I wouldn't interpret the results as hatred towards women.
Perhaps, a tolerance of an archaic institution, and those in charge.
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Why? What you wrote was unclear - not a big deal.
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