Quotes And Comments That Make Sense

[Horseplayersbet.com]

I am starting a new thread for gems about the state of the game (horseplayer related of course) found on the internet:

http://www.horseraceinsider.com/blog...-and-tomorrow/

Horseracing is still marketed as if it has a monopoly on legal gambling,
where the need for a cohesive voice and long term strategic planning was not
required to be successful. A racetrack would be built and people would come
and bet!

The industry has generally been run by Horsemen who have viewed wagering as a necessary evil. They have little understanding of the gambling component
and thus little understanding for their current and potential customers. In
some cases racetrack board members are prohibited from wagering.
Those who remain in the Horseplayer choir believe that horserace wagering
offers unique components that make it the most exciting, exhilarating and
challenging form of gambling. The industry will continue to decline until
racetrack operators can identify and embrace their customer, the
HORSEPLAYER, and conclude that Horseracing must be marketed as a 'GAME
ABOUT GAMBLING' and not a Sport of Kings!

Horseracing’s Day of Atonement is long overdue.....
EP

[rwwupl]

Originally Posted by Horseplayersbet.com

I am starting a new thread for gems about the state of the game (horseplayer related of course) found on the internet:

http://www.horseraceinsider.com/blog...-and-tomorrow/

Horseracing is still marketed as if it has a monopoly on legal gambling,
where the need for a cohesive voice and long term strategic planning was not
required to be successful. A racetrack would be built and people would come
and bet!

The industry has generally been run by Horsemen who have viewed wagering as a necessary evil. They have little understanding of the gambling component
and thus little understanding for their current and potential customers. In
some cases racetrack board members are prohibited from wagering.
Those who remain in the Horseplayer choir believe that horserace wagering
offers unique components that make it the most exciting, exhilarating and
challenging form of gambling. The industry will continue to decline until
racetrack operators can identify and embrace their customer, the
HORSEPLAYER, and conclude that Horseracing must be marketed as a 'GAME
ABOUT GAMBLING' and not a Sport of Kings!

Horseracing’s Day of Atonement is long overdue.....
EP

Yep, Thats it

[DeanT]

A good comment today on the horseplayer blog from "Quarter Pole"

http://blog.horseplayersassociation....62896788305844


That was a nice piece and I enjoyed reading it.

Horseracing needn't look any further than the internet where online poker has taken young adults from all over the world by storm.

What, might you ask, does poker have over horseracing? Certainly not excitement (grinding poker can be quite boring). Certainly not intellectual challenge (although poker is quite close!). And certainly not the chance to make a quick score (to make a quick score (1K+), you might have play for HOURS online in a single tourney).

Nope, none of the above! What horseracing lacks is at the heart of fundamental ecomonics: THE LACK OF A PERCEPTION THAT IT IS PROFITABLE!

Why do the young kids play poker? Because they perceive that if they work hard enough at it, they will eventually become +EV long term. NO SUCH NOTION exists with horse racing.

Consider that you can find online training sites for poker ad nauseum. Just do a quick Google (or in deference to your contributor, a Yahoo! search) for "online poker training" and you will find some outstanding training sites for relatively little money that can have you near-profitable in a couple of months of hard study. NOTHING like this exists for horseracing; instead all you get is people peddling lousy tips, speed figures, and for the most part, useless or superfluous information.

In addition, you can go to NUMEROUS sites online that list DOZENS of winning "poker pros" whose results are documented and posted. I challenge you to find and list FIVE "horseracing" pros that are profitable and whose names are public. Oh, these five may exist, but no one knows of them, and more importantly, because no one knows of them, they cannot help the sport attract what it needs: interest from young people that think or believe they can beat the game in the long run.

The solution to racing's woes is obvious: make people believe that they can win money long term by betting horses. NOTHING MORE and NOTHING LESS. If this was done, the issues of admission, the cost of a DRF, the odds changing after the bell, the drugs, the "super-trainers", field size, and all other "issues" would magically disappear. Easier said than done,isn't it?

And with that, sir, I proclaim the eventual slow death of racing as the cancer of takeout metastasizes and brings it to its Hospice in the caverns of Belmont, Hollywood Park, and Churchill Downs.

Good luck at the windows and thank you for your time.

[Imriledup]

Originally Posted by Horseplayersbet.com

I am starting a new thread for gems about the state of the game (horseplayer related of course) found on the internet:

http://www.horseraceinsider.com/blog...-and-tomorrow/

Horseracing is still marketed as if it has a monopoly on legal gambling,
where the need for a cohesive voice and long term strategic planning was not
required to be successful. A racetrack would be built and people would come
and bet!

The industry has generally been run by Horsemen who have viewed wagering as a necessary evil. They have little understanding of the gambling component
and thus little understanding for their current and potential customers. In
some cases racetrack board members are prohibited from wagering.
Those who remain in the Horseplayer choir believe that horserace wagering
offers unique components that make it the most exciting, exhilarating and
challenging form of gambling. The industry will continue to decline until
racetrack operators can identify and embrace their customer, the
HORSEPLAYER, and conclude that Horseracing must be marketed as a 'GAME
ABOUT GAMBLING' and not a Sport of Kings!

Horseracing’s Day of Atonement is long overdue.....
EP

Betting NFL games is also exciting, exhilirating and challenging but the bookies and Las Vegas dont' raise the Vigorish to pay the salaries of the players. Horse race bettors are paying the salaries of the Trainers, Riders and other participants who put on the show. That's the problem.

[cj]

The industry still seems to think racing is entertainment and that customers don't mind paying for them to put on the show. You would think the empty grandstands might give them an inkling it doesn't work any longer.

Memo to race track executives...it is gambling. People don't want to play a game with little chance for success in the year 2009. I was thinking about this today after watching the first from Suffolk and two from Philly. If I were a new fan and today was my first day at the track, how excited would I be seeing three heavy favorites win. For the fee of about 20%, you get the chance to double your money! Hooray for racing. There are too many pools and too many tracks, and takeout is too high.

People play the lottery with a very high takeout, but at least they have the chance, very small, to change their life with a very small investment. Racing offers none of this except a couple of days a year.

Do we need place and show betting? Do we need exactas, trifectas, and superfectas on nearly every race? P3s, P4s, and daily doubles galore? Imagine a poker game where 10 guys show up, and you break it down into 5 two man games...great fun, eh?

Do we need racing at Penn National, Mountaineer and Charles Town all on the same night at the same time? Do we need racing at Belmont, the Meadowlands, Philly Park, and Delaware too?

There is so much wrong I could go on for days. But until the things above are fixed, nothing is going to change.

[Imriledup]

Originally Posted by DeanT

A good comment today on the horseplayer blog from "Quarter Pole"

http://blog.horseplayersassociation....62896788305844


That was a nice piece and I enjoyed reading it.

Horseracing needn't look any further than the internet where online poker has taken young adults from all over the world by storm.

What, might you ask, does poker have over horseracing? Certainly not excitement (grinding poker can be quite boring). Certainly not intellectual challenge (although poker is quite close!). And certainly not the chance to make a quick score (to make a quick score (1K+), you might have play for HOURS online in a single tourney).

Nope, none of the above! What horseracing lacks is at the heart of fundamental ecomonics: THE LACK OF A PERCEPTION THAT IT IS PROFITABLE!

Why do the young kids play poker? Because they perceive that if they work hard enough at it, they will eventually become +EV long term. NO SUCH NOTION exists with horse racing.

Consider that you can find online training sites for poker ad nauseum. Just do a quick Google (or in deference to your contributor, a Yahoo! search) for "online poker training" and you will find some outstanding training sites for relatively little money that can have you near-profitable in a couple of months of hard study. NOTHING like this exists for horseracing; instead all you get is people peddling lousy tips, speed figures, and for the most part, useless or superfluous information.

In addition, you can go to NUMEROUS sites online that list DOZENS of winning "poker pros" whose results are documented and posted. I challenge you to find and list FIVE "horseracing" pros that are profitable and whose names are public. Oh, these five may exist, but no one knows of them, and more importantly, because no one knows of them, they cannot help the sport attract what it needs: interest from young people that think or believe they can beat the game in the long run.

The solution to racing's woes is obvious: make people believe that they can win money long term by betting horses. NOTHING MORE and NOTHING LESS. If this was done, the issues of admission, the cost of a DRF, the odds changing after the bell, the drugs, the "super-trainers", field size, and all other "issues" would magically disappear. Easier said than done,isn't it?

And with that, sir, I proclaim the eventual slow death of racing as the cancer of takeout metastasizes and brings it to its Hospice in the caverns of Belmont, Hollywood Park, and Churchill Downs.

Good luck at the windows and thank you for your time.

Great post. Who IS the Phil Hellmuth and Phil Ivey of horse racing? Who's the really cool guy with the sunglasses who hits all the pick 6s and is driving around in a new Mercedes on horse race winnings?

Who's the professional gambler who wants to come on the TVG set and talk about how much money he makes per year just betting the races?

Its like racing is doing a great job of hiding its winning players. They may as well be in the witness protection pgm, no one really knows who they are.

Even winning tournament players like the guy from Tennessee who wins all the Vegas contests, why haven't we seen someone like this interviewed on TVG to talk about how he has made good money in this game?

I watch TVG, HRTV and almost all racing programs on tv and listen to many racing programs on radio i've never really seen or heard of anyone who came on and talked about winning?

If you look at the results from racing in the United States over the last few decades you will find HUNDREDS and even THOUSANDS of 6 figure Pick 6, Superfecta, Pentafecta, etc payoffs. You'll see dozens and dozens of life changing payoffs and yet the only time we hear about who is hitting these bets is when a guy hits a Breeders Cup pick 6 on an 8 dollar ticket. Who's winning these life changing payouts? I can't imagine that there are people who hit these large exotic bets who don't want to come on and talk about this stuff.

I guess the problem is that even if we bring on the little old lady from Paso Robles to talk about her 500k pick 6 score, the only people who are seeing her are already racing fans. Non fans don't watch TVG, a lady like this would have to go on the Today show and tell Matt Lauer how horse racing changed her life.

Racing doing a bad job at marketing players who've had life changers.

[proximity]

Originally Posted by DeanT

What, might you ask, does poker have over horseracing? .

great post dean t!!

one more major thing i will add that poker has over racing though is that you can choose your opponents.

in racing you're potentially going against the best on every "hand."

possibly a "racing poker" type of game could be developed where cards representing the numbers of the horses in a race would be dealt and players could then bet on their hands?? super hi five box, superfecta box, triple box, exacta box, win, place, show.... would be the order of winning hands!!

[Imriledup]

Originally Posted by proximity

great post dean t!!

one more major thing i will add that poker has over racing though is that you can choose your opponents.

in racing you're potentially going against the best on every "hand."

possibly a "racing poker" type of game could be developed where cards representing the numbers of the horses in a race would be dealt and players could then bet on their hands?? super hi five box, superfecta box, triple box, exacta box, win, place, show.... would be the order of winning hands!!

That's an awesome point i never thought of, you can choose your competition in Poker.

[proximity]

Originally Posted by cj

Do we need racing at Penn National, Mountaineer and Charles Town all on the same night at the same time? Do we need racing at Belmont, the Meadowlands, Philly Park, and Delaware too?

.

yes, it's called the law of large numbers.

imagine a poker game where you had all night to play, but only ten hands were going to be dealt... great fun, eh?

[Horseplayersbet.com]

The problem with identifying the winners, and I mean long term winners, not the odd lucky person who hit a huge pick 6, is that almost all of them are most likely getting rebates. And I believe racing doesn't want to advertise this aspect of the game.

[Imriledup]

Originally Posted by Horseplayersbet.com

The problem with identifying the winners, and I mean long term winners, not the odd lucky person who hit a huge pick 6, is that almost all of them are most likely getting rebates. And I believe racing doesn't want to advertise this aspect of the game.

interesting.

[chickenhead]

a bit off the topic, but what the hell, time for a little rant.

I was thinking this morning about how the industry likes to think of racing as a spectator sport, or wish it was. I was thinking about the dress codes all the major sports have...the athletes are dressed to the nines pre and post game. And I was thinking about some of the absolute slobs I have seen roaming around inside the paddocks at various tracks.

Note to racing: How about you institute a dress code for the participants in this spectator sport? Does some dude wearing cut-offs and a stained Simpsons T-Shirt (as witnessed by me at Golden Gate) really jive with this high end spectator sport you think you're selling?

Hows about you go pry the dress code sign off the Turf Club door -- and stick it on the pathway into the paddock. And make all the grooms wear the same thing, have them put on solid white coveralls. The horse might look a little more majestic if they were all being walked around by guys in solid white coveralls, rather than whatever garish monstrosity they found wadded up on the floor when they rolled out of bed that morning.

end rant.

[DeanT]

Originally Posted by chickenhead

I was thinking about some of the absolute slobs I have seen roaming around inside the paddocks at various tracks.

I wasn't looking particularly good that day I admit.

[Horseplayersbet.com]

Originally Posted by chickenhead

a bit off the topic, but what the hell, time for a little rant.

I was thinking this morning about how the industry likes to think of racing as a spectator sport, or wish it was. I was thinking about the dress codes all the major sports have...the athletes are dressed to the nines pre and post game. And I was thinking about some of the absolute slobs I have seen roaming around inside the paddocks at various tracks.

Note to racing: How about you institute a dress code for the participants in this spectator sport? Does some dude wearing cut-offs and a stained Simpsons T-Shirt (as witnessed by me at Golden Gate) really jive with this high end spectator sport you think you're selling?

Hows about you go pry the dress code sign off the Turf Club door -- and stick it on the pathway into the paddock. And make all the grooms wear the same thing, have them put on solid white coveralls. The horse might look a little more majestic if they were all being walked around by guys in solid white coveralls, rather than whatever garish monstrosity they found wadded up on the floor when they rolled out of bed that morning.

end rant.

I'm not into dress codes. They rub me the wrong way. I could live with it if all grooms had to wear the same Simpsons shirt every day though.

[chickenhead]

I'm just saying, we already know how delusional racing can be. But if they want to invest in all the pomp and pageantry -- they should spend a minute or two thinking about it. A $4K claimer looks exactly the same as Curlin or Secretariat to most people -- it's the people standing around the horse that clue you in that what you're watching ain't exactly "big time".

At some places it's like a Walmart parking lot, with horses.