Takeout supplements horse racing industry - Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com

Imriledup · 08-12-2009, 02:46 AM

Lets compare horse racing to the NFL for a second. The NFL charges a one time 'fee' to enjoy their entertainment experience, you pay a one time fee and you get to enter the stadium and enjoy 2 or 3 hours of football on that one charge. With horse racing, you get charged on every race and not only do you get charged on every race, but every dollar you wager gets charged the same amount.

With the NFL, if you buy an upper deck seat, you pay much less money than a 50 yard line seat. In horse racing, each person pays the same, each dollar is 'charged' 20 cents to participate.

Don't get me wrong, i love the 'beauty' of horse racing, but after about the 5th time i've seen horses run in a circle, the novelty wore off. I don't go to the track anymore for the excitement of a 'sporting event' i go there as an investor.

I hate to think that every dollar i wager, 20 cents (blended) goes to put on the show. Honestly, i don't really want to pay to put on the show, i don't have any problem betting on Ant races instead of horse races. With ants, there would really be no overhead, ants don't eat as much as horses, ant trainers won't be walking around with Armani suits and driving brand new mercedes. I'm not sure what the expenses would be to be an ant trainer, but you could probably avoid stall rent and keep your prized ants in a little case in a room in your own house. With ant races, i'm guessing we can get that takeout down to 2 or 3 percent per race.

Back to horse racing and them charging a takeout rate on every dollar that everyone bets.

If i go to the races and bet 1000 for the day, i'm paying 200 dollars towards purses and other expenses for the track to 'put on the show'. The guy standing next to me might only risk 50 dollars for the entire day, that guy, who's getting to enjoy the same sporting event as i'm getting to enjoy, only has to pay 10 bucks, while i pay 200. Doesn't seem fair, right?

I would actually pay 200 dollars admission fee to get into the track as a one time fee if they would let me bet 'takeout free' races. I think 200 per day is plenty of money for one person to contribute to 'the show'.

Bring on the Ant races with a 3 pct takeout.

macguy · 08-12-2009, 12:19 PM

I'm wondering if you're really comparing apples to oranges.

I realize that both horse racing and football are sporting events, I think your comparison is perhaps not quite accurate.

I would think a more apt comparison would be going to the racetrack for the races, and going to a sports book to bet on football.

When people pay to buy tickets to a football game, they immediately know that there will be no fiscal return on investment, they are simply paying for the enjoyment of watching the game.

When people go to the racetrack, most go for gambling entertainment, not "watching the horses" entertainment.

Pacingguy · 08-12-2009, 04:01 PM

Tell us something we don't know. This is part of the problem racing is having. Everyone wants to have horse racing; no one wants to pay for it. Racing is an expensive sport to put on and you will never get it down to a real low takeout rate. That being said, there certainly is room to reduce the takeout to a more reasonable level.

We all have a choice when it comes to wagering. If you want a real small takeout, I suggest you head to your local casino. if you want to wager on an sporting event, then there is horse racing, unless you can find that ant track.

DeanT · 08-12-2009, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imriledup

Bring on the Ant races with a 3 pct takeout.

You make a good point. Racing has to learn what/who their customers are, and they seem to have a problem with it. Maybe because they do not like the answer? One way or another, they sure do not want to tackle the core problem, which you speak about in your post.

Quote:

David Willmot runs Canada's famous Woodbine racecourse. He has watched his business lose ground at a frightening rate to competitors
By the end he put it to one of the punters that his betting on a soulless internet exchange - which was not putting money back into racing - would eventually see the death of the thoroughbred business. "You'll be betting on frogs," Willmot offered. The punter replied: "Then I'll find the fastest frog."

Nothing illustrates racing's problem better. Some studies show as much as 95 per cent of thoroughbred betting is done by pure punters, five per cent by traditional horse lovers. And punters will bet where they get the best service and the best return on the dollar.

Horseplayersbet.com · 08-12-2009, 09:11 PM

If betting would magically stop on NFL games tomorrow, the league might as well go out of business.
You know what fuels the NFL, what creates the advertising market, what sells the merchandise? It is the low takeout gambling aspect of it.

It has a ripple affect.

And yes, the NFL is an expensive game to put on too.

Gone2Golf · 08-12-2009, 10:54 PM

Is takeout too high? YES. But that doesn't compare in anyway to the expenses for other sports. The NFL is $100+ per ticket and what...I get to sit there and maybe see the game that would be better viewed on television. There has to be takeout to fund the sport of racing...it is very expensive.
Now if we were only going to have two or three tracks run per day and everyone is betting on these few products...then you could have a 5% takeout and still have huge purses. In fact, that would probably be the best thing for racing...eliminate 30,000 of the 60,000 races per year and we'd all be better off!

Marlin · 08-12-2009, 11:51 PM

Most of the time when I "enjoy" the NFL I pay 10% takeout on the flip of a coin. Perhaps the worst analogy ever.

garyscpa · 08-12-2009, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imriledup

...Bring on the Ant races with a 3 pct takeout.

Just from a handicapping perspective, what do you use as the length of a length in ant racing?

And would we still have to deal with Polytrack?

Imriledup · 08-13-2009, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by garyscpa

Just from a handicapping perspective, what do you use as the length of a length in ant racing?

And would we still have to deal with Polytrack?

Imriledup · 08-13-2009, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marlin

Most of the time when I "enjoy" the NFL I pay 10% takeout on the flip of a coin. Perhaps the worst analogy ever.

I'm no expert on sports betting, but i think the takeout on sports betting is only 5% (because you don't pay takeout when you win, so half the bets you make are takeout free and the other half you lose 10% which makes the avg approx 5%, assuming you can pick 50% winners)

Marlin · 08-13-2009, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imriledup

I'm no expert on sports betting, but i think the takeout on sports betting is only 5% (because you don't pay takeout when you win, so half the bets you make are takeout free and the other half you lose 10% which makes the avg approx 5%, assuming you can pick 50% winners)

Maybe I need to pick more winners!

You are right of course. The analogy still doesn't work for me. The "novelty" after five races could wear off as easily as the "novelty" after five first downs. JMO!

Imriledup · 08-13-2009, 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marlin

Maybe I need to pick more winners!

You are right of course. The analogy still doesn't work for me. The "novelty" after five races could wear off as easily as the "novelty" after five first downs. JMO!

Money's money, there's no novelty, its all about the dirty green paper with the dead presidents on it! Maybe we ought to take up poker, i mean, how hard can THAT be?

Marlin · 08-13-2009, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imriledup

Money's money, there's no novelty, its all about the dirty green paper with the dead presidents on it! Maybe we ought to take up poker, i mean, how hard can THAT be?

I'd bet on the ants. But how are you going to "juice" them? And who is going to ride them?

kenwoodallpromos · 08-13-2009, 03:30 AM

Horseracing. Horsemen= business; horseplayers= "gaming"; non-betting fans= sport.
Ant races- no thanks, it is not government sanctioned, so if I get caught betting on it I can go to jail.

Horseplayersbet.com · 08-13-2009, 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kenwoodallpromos

Horseracing. Horsemen= business; horseplayers= "gaming"; non-betting fans= sport.
Ant races- no thanks, it is not government sanctioned, so if I get caught betting on it I can go to jail.

I wonder if ant racing would draw PETA's attention.