What software do you use?

I'm looking to buy a program or two to help me in the unending quest to find overlays. Since I don't believe that any program will operate as a black box, the purpose of the program will be to find horses that meet the criteria I set, which I can then analyze manually.

I know that HTR is excellent, and the latest version looks like Ken is putting a lot of things in it so that it's useful to more than just pace handicappers. Pace handicapping isn't my strong suit, and I'm looking more towards something that is a bit broader in its spectrum of analysis.

What programs do you use, and what criteria do they use for their output?

[Vigors]

" You already have the knowledge of existing programs

to determine EXACTLY what you're looking for...but you

seem to be overlooking the obivious...just give Tom Console

a shout....I'm sure he'd go out of his way to help you !!!

[Vigors]

.......I'm sure he'd go out of his way to help you.........

.............off an Airplane without a parachute.....

[Richard]

Midnight,
Please do not take this post the wrong way as it is not my intention to antagonize any one.Have you considered using SNAPCAPPER PRO SE?This program looks at each horse in the field from an overall perspective and produces its ratings.I can testify that using this program got me the number 5 spot finish in the Public Handicapper PH Prep contest A year ago(out of about 2500 players).Just a suggestion Midnight,nothing more.
Richard

[tcat]

HTR

[Doug]

Midnight

I don't know what your criteria is.

Check out the platnum report at Racingpicks.com

Lots of stuff, Horse for course, patterns, trainer angles, true odds line, etc.

This stuff is computer generated so I find it best to verify manually. I love big prices and believe me this one gets some doozys in the top four.

Of course it is like anything else, you have to use it with a little artistic view, but at $27.95 per month it may be worth checking it out.

I have no interested in this report except for using it.

Any others use this report services? opinions?

Doug

[JoeG]

Hey midnight:

I use HSH for t-breds and some homegrown databases for harness races. Both of these I use in the way you're seeking: finding overlays.

I assume you're looking for t-bred software, so I'll comment on HSH. HSH can automatically import odds from the "At the Races" software from Gary Pizzigoti or semi-automatically using the Supertote web site and some copy-and-pasting. Using one, or a weighted combination of up to four of the programs 14 main composite factors, you can press a button to find horse with an optimum betting percentage (basically an overlay) based on odds and rating. This is one of the most basic parts of the software that has been in there for a while. I've used this as my main source of betting over the past 6 months.

The one "drawback" of HSH is that there are so many different parts to the program, that you may suffer from one of two problems if you decide to get it. One is the "child getting lost in the candy store" problem. You will have the urge to try every piece of "candy" in the software and never figure out a profitable way to use the software. The worst variation of this is one I suffer from: every time Dave (the programmer) comes out with a new feature I have a tendency to play with it and after "a little" testing take it too the windows...often with bad results. I usually end up going back to the basics that I'm currently using now.

The second problem is related to the first: Little written documentation. Dave has done a good thing recently with a video newsletter that can be purchased every few months, but a good basic manual with some simple ways to use the software does not exist. The message board has a number of good people who are willing to help with any questions someone has, but when a newbie receives the software for the first time, he/she has little idea as to how it should be used.

But to get back to your question, if you're looking for a software package that does a good job of finding overlays, HSH is one that fits the bill, at least the way that I use it. It won't produce a traditional oddsline sheet, but if you do your betting from a computer attached to the internet it could help you.

Right now I believe there is just one flavor of HSH. Dave often runs specials but I don't believe there is one now. I think Dave is thinking about an HSH lite version that doesn't have all the bells and whistles (like database, AI stuff) but I know its not available now. Frankly, I don't use all these bells and whistles right now. I'm glad tthat i have them, but really I don't need them.

If you have any questions or are thinking about HSH, you can send me a message. Its a big investment but for me its been worth it. The way I play I check the races 1-2 mtp and place my wager after 2 button presses. I still don't pre-cap races very well, though some people with HSH are just the opposite. If you're a go to the OTB with a sheet type of person, I'm not sure if HSH is for you right now. If you plan on betting from home, HSH could be right for you.

[JoeG]

...one other thing

I've also tried Racing Picks. This would be a good product to use if you are a take it to the track kind of guy. I would probably use it if I went to an OTB or one of the local casinos to bet the ponies.

With these "sheets" I would concentrate on one of a few areas:

1) Use the oddsline for their top 4 picks and take the horse with the best overlay of 50% or more among the top 4

2) Bet any trainer angle that qualifies over 8-1 odds as they explain it on their web site.

I only purchased the sheets for one month to check them out, but they seem to do a decent job in the weeks that I tested them. they list a ton of angle, but there is no way to bet them all. The trainer angles seems to be the most profitable.

Thanks for the information.

[Doug]

JOEG WROTE,

I only purchased the sheets for one month to check them out, but they seem to do a decent job in the weeks that I tested them. they list a ton of angle, but there is no way to bet them all. The trainer angles seems to be the most profitable.


JOEG is correct in saying you can't use them all. They give angles for almost every horse in the race. I like to use them when a horse is not in the top 4 and a real good price. Don't mind betting a couple horses per race if need be. They have several different betting stratagies designed for the output of the reports.

JOEG. I don't bet online or by phone, but why do you think these reports can only be used at the track? There are several sites that give live odds on the races to find the overlays and good prices. Just curious.

The only drawback I have found to these reports is that you cannot scratch horses. They do the early scratches, but not late scratches. So sometimes a horse may not be listed as a lone e or lone s, but after scratches there may be one.

There are days when the top choice wins 5 or 6 races. Lots of short prices there. Here and there you catch a goody.

IMO these sheets are as good as any other reports or software programs that I have personally seen or used. And again, the price is right. They have reports for just about any track you can think of.

I would be very interested in (if there are any) sharing insights with others about these sheets.

Doug

[JoeG]

Doug:

Sorry...didn't mean to imply that they could not be used from home. I was only trying to say that they were a good tool for a print it out and take it to the track system. I personally prefer using the software I have (HSH) while I'm at home and have access to a computer. Its simply a comfort level i have at finding overlays when I'm home that I don't have using the racingpicks sheets.

I tracked the oddsline for 3 weeks at all the tracks and found that using their instructions I had a 2.5% ROI betting all overlays in the top 4 picks. Betting the best overlay only among the top 4 picks returned a 8% ROI. The site's testomonials reflect some inflated ROI numbers that are a little misleading. Also they don't provide great instructions on how to use the oddsline. For example, they talk about betting the best overlay in the top 4. What does that mean? There are a few interpretations. Also many of their examples in their little articles imply great exotic winnings can be had. But I could pick out an example of a $500 trifecta from my software from 3 days ago that I could have gotten.

Now that's not to imply these sheets are bad or good. I just wanted to point out the plusses and minuses. That's why I echoed your post about the sheets because it could be a good tool. But based on my tests, I found that i can make 3 times the ROI using the software that I use. So that's why I said the sheets would be good for a take it to the track kind of guy.

The things that I found best about the sheets were the trainers angles at 8-1 or better with 3 lines of comments as they stated. I found them returning about 30% ROI....not too bad except for some runouts.

The worst were their inflated testomonials related to their oddsline. Yes they say to use it as a tool and test things out repeatedly, but printing testomials and high priced examples imply a pot of gold.

So in short I say the racingpicks sheets are a good tool if used properly. Just as I say the HSH software I use also is good tool if used properly.

I know there is some good software out there. There I haven't used it personally, people I respect tell me HTR is a great software product. From personal experience, I know HSH is a good piece of software. I pointed out the good and bad points of HSH above in my first post. Because I can't translate what I do in HSH to a sheet of paper, I can't use it at the OTB. Some people with HSH pre-pick, but there are others like me who are slaved to the odds. To each his own.

[tedwin]

midnight, I would wholeheartedly recommend HSH. As one of the posters indicated, the scope of the program is quite large. It is not a "one size fits all program; there are numerous approaches that can be used with it. Different approaches work better for different handicappers.

I will mention several attributes:

1. While the diversity of approaches can seem confusing if one first tries to master the whole program, the ability to find a particular approach that is right for you (or any particular user) is far greater than with other programs with which I am familiar.

2. The program is ever expanding. Dave has put out many updates without charging for them.

3. Due to the number of updates, a written manual may be out of date almost as soon as it were issued, but the videos mantioned in another post are extremely effective in learning how to use the program (both the older parts and the new updates).

4. The customer service that Dave Schwartz provides is truly outstanding. I mentioned in another post a few weeks ago that it should be a model for providing suctomer service for any company. Some of the answers will come from other users on the HSH Bulletin board, but Dave responds very quickly both to questions asked of him on the bulletin board, and by email when that is a more appropriate way to deal with a particular problem of a particular person.

I am sure he would also be happy to talk with you by phone if you have specific questions you would like to address with him - either before a purchase while you are in the process of making a decidion on what to get or afterwards if there is a reason that would make it more appropriate than using either the bulletin board or email.

[Doug]

JOEG

I agree with all you said.


as with a lot of productsthere are inflated roi's.

On this trainer study you did. The 8-1 and up theory. Was that for all tracks they list?

Doug

[JoeG]

Yes....all tracks over 20 days if I remeber correctly. There were some bombs in there which made the roi that good. I believe the win% was in single digits...I'll have to find the data when I get a chance.

They seemed to be the best "icons" on the sheets.

[oldstuff]

I have FOCUS by ADPA along with about 15 data files for about 6 tracks sitting in my computer.

It "guarantees" a minimum of 65% win, up through 85% (?)

I just can't relate to it. Their terminology (SCs32, npRcs, etc) makes absolutely no sense to me. Their online manual is somewhat ok but too technical, without adequate explanation. Seems like it was written by someone who figured that everyone would understand it. Maybe I have to keep building my models more but as I understand it the models only track the last 15 races (in each category).

I haven't given it a fair chance. Anyone use it with any success? I have lost about $400 last year using it (very minimal use). Betting can be directed to a single horse, but it seems the program is directed to Dutch and 3/5 exactas.

I also have Talbot Pace (computer) program as well as Allways, TRS, Handicapping Magic, Multicaps, Einstein, Speed40.

I am looking for the final 'holy grail' as my eyesight is failing and I just can't read the form too well any more. Allways data is good but like the form, becoming undecipherable. Just give me one good program....just the final 'one' to stick with for the few years I have left. Suggestions appreciated.

I am going to take a good, long hard look at RaceMaker. I used it for 4 races Sunday, cashed 3 tickets and the 4th bet came in 3rd. I hate to tell you that I used it 'out of the box' and I don't think Boyd intended it to be used to pick winners. I didn't realize it was a handicap 'tool'. I only found that out when I read his post. So I made a mistake.