|
08-11-2014, 03:26 PM
|
#1
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Big Apple
Posts: 4,252
|
The Belmont Park Impact on Saratoga
In reading various posts on this Forum there appear to be some dissatisfaction with Saratoga in terms of handicapping as opposed to year’s past.
IMHO to handicap Saratoga you most know Belmont Park because the two racetracks in the handicapping of races are as different as night and day and it is not just because Belmont Park is larger than the Saratoga Race Course.
The primary differences are in the difference to the turn for the same race distance.
At Saratoga the 1-1/4M race starts 1,001 feet before the turn or little over 1-1/2 furlongs. At Belmont the same race distance is started on the turn at 1,543 feet or nearly 2-1/2 furlongs from the straightaway on the backstretch.
The race distance to the turn comparisons can continue with the 1-1/8M race where the Saratoga race starts about 1/16M off the turn, the Belmont 1-1/8M distance is virtually a “one turn sprint” with over a 1/2M to run to the turn.
What impact does this have on the race distance? It is significant for multiple reasons. The obvious impact being that there is less demand on the horses having to corner into only one turn, as opposed to two turns at Saratoga. Also the long straightaway down the backstretch gives the horses ample opportunity to get into position without having to worry about hitting the first turn shortly after the start. Added to that impact, is that the turn side force at Saratoga is nearly 37% greater on the horse than at Belmont Park.
But the comparisons gets better because at Belmont Park on the dirt you have 1M and 1-1/16M races which also are one turn races, but at Saratoga there are not 1M and 1-1/16M races on the dirt. Therefore the “milers” have to either be able to be speedy enough to run at the 7F distance or have the stamina to get the 1-1/8M distance.
Lastly, we cannot forget the turf where the turf sprint is a very significant part of the Saratoga race agenda, but the turf sprint at Saratoga is run at 5-1/2F where at Belmont Park it is 6F.
Therefore I have attached a layout of Belmont Park for to make your own handicapping assessments.
__________________
Independent thinking, emotional stability, and a keen understanding of both human and institutional behavior are vital to long-term investment success – My hero, Warren Edward Buffett
"Science is correct; even if you don't believe it" - Neil deGrasse Tyson
|
|
|
08-11-2014, 04:37 PM
|
#2
|
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queens, NY
Posts: 20,614
|
Nice diagram.
__________________
"Unlearning is the highest form of learning"
|
|
|
08-11-2014, 05:02 PM
|
#3
|
clean money
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 23,559
|
Thanks Cratos, nice post and diagram.
__________________
Preparation. Discipline. Patience. Decisiveness.
|
|
|
08-11-2014, 06:52 PM
|
#4
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Big Apple
Posts: 4,252
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Fischer
Thanks Cratos, nice post and diagram.
|
Thanks and I am happy that you like the Belmont Park layout.
After Saratoga closes I will post Santa Anita's layout for the Breeders Cup
__________________
Independent thinking, emotional stability, and a keen understanding of both human and institutional behavior are vital to long-term investment success – My hero, Warren Edward Buffett
"Science is correct; even if you don't believe it" - Neil deGrasse Tyson
|
|
|
08-12-2014, 01:07 PM
|
#5
|
Perennial Loser
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 15
|
Can't get enough of these. Thanks, as always, Cratos.
|
|
|
08-12-2014, 01:35 PM
|
#6
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Big Apple
Posts: 4,252
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by fromoffthepace
Can't get enough of these. Thanks, as always, Cratos.
|
You are going to "love" Santa Anita with its downhill turf course and right turn
__________________
Independent thinking, emotional stability, and a keen understanding of both human and institutional behavior are vital to long-term investment success – My hero, Warren Edward Buffett
"Science is correct; even if you don't believe it" - Neil deGrasse Tyson
|
|
|
08-12-2014, 07:48 PM
|
#7
|
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 7,510
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cratos
In reading various posts on this Forum there appear to be some dissatisfaction with Saratoga in terms of handicapping as opposed to year’s past.
IMHO to handicap Saratoga you most know Belmont Park because the two racetracks in the handicapping of races are as different as night and day and it is not just because Belmont Park is larger than the Saratoga Race Course.
The primary differences are in the difference to the turn for the same race distance.
At Saratoga the 1-1/4M race starts 1,001 feet before the turn or little over 1-1/2 furlongs. At Belmont the same race distance is started on the turn at 1,543 feet or nearly 2-1/2 furlongs from the straightaway on the backstretch.
The race distance to the turn comparisons can continue with the 1-1/8M race where the Saratoga race starts about 1/16M off the turn, the Belmont 1-1/8M distance is virtually a “one turn sprint” with over a 1/2M to run to the turn.
What impact does this have on the race distance? It is significant for multiple reasons. The obvious impact being that there is less demand on the horses having to corner into only one turn, as opposed to two turns at Saratoga. Also the long straightaway down the backstretch gives the horses ample opportunity to get into position without having to worry about hitting the first turn shortly after the start. Added to that impact, is that the turn side force at Saratoga is nearly 37% greater on the horse than at Belmont Park.
But the comparisons gets better because at Belmont Park on the dirt you have 1M and 1-1/16M races which also are one turn races, but at Saratoga there are not 1M and 1-1/16M races on the dirt. Therefore the “milers” have to either be able to be speedy enough to run at the 7F distance or have the stamina to get the 1-1/8M distance.
Lastly, we cannot forget the turf where the turf sprint is a very significant part of the Saratoga race agenda, but the turf sprint at Saratoga is run at 5-1/2F where at Belmont Park it is 6F.
Therefore I have attached a layout of Belmont Park for to make your own handicapping assessments.
|
Do you have a link to the source of this diagram?
Are there other tracks listed as well?
|
|
|
08-12-2014, 08:29 PM
|
#8
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Big Apple
Posts: 4,252
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by thespaah
Do you have a link to the source of this diagram?
Are there other tracks listed as well?
|
.
Sorry there is not a link because this layout was personally created by me. I have selected what I believe to be the 20 top racetracks in North America to reproduce into layouts.
I had started doing them in 3D, but I abandon that effort because handicapping is done in 2D.
__________________
Independent thinking, emotional stability, and a keen understanding of both human and institutional behavior are vital to long-term investment success – My hero, Warren Edward Buffett
"Science is correct; even if you don't believe it" - Neil deGrasse Tyson
|
|
|
08-13-2014, 07:05 AM
|
#9
|
Registered User
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 5,005
|
The Belmont Park Impact on Saratoga
Not sure if their diagrams are detailed enough, but "The American Racing Manual" put out by DRF every year has track diagrams for every North American track.
|
|
|
08-13-2014, 11:01 PM
|
#10
|
self medicated
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: toga
Posts: 3,090
|
Regardless of track configuration, form just translates from Belmont to Saratoga. Sometimes its a good way to make Saratoga easier. Its low hanging fruit when the shipping horse is a low price. It works best in the lower levels. Nothing works all the time but if you are betting the entire meet.....you can see how few win and (more importantly) how many run poorly. I like exactas so if I can get one of the top 3 choices out, it gives me room to use my imagination. In the claiming, optional and some of those allowance races. Belmont configuration is a pretty good bet. Its even good with the top horses and something to follow if you plan on betting the entire meet. I'm not saying there aren't times this doesn't kick me in the ass....it does. So I try to look at the higher priced (odds) shippers when I am using my imagination. Being able to toss a short (what I consider an underlay) horse helps me hit some exactas. Belmont "configuration" can often help you find the right ones at the right price.
|
|
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
|