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Old 04-07-2015, 12:19 AM   #31
thespaah
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Track Collector
The article (in the Paulick report) mentioned three sites under possible consideration for flats races. Anyone know they might be?
I would imagine the sites would be near major population centers ( where the real estate will be available, but affordable)....Or on or near a major highway or airport.
Virginia is largely rural...Some 75% of the population of the Commonwealth is located within 75 miles of Washington.
The remainder is located in cities and towns stretching along I-81 from Roanoke to Harrisonburg....
With Northeastern VA being the most heavily populated and where most of the Commonwealth's wealth is concentrated, I would imagine a track would be built somewhere between DC and Dulles Airport.
Such a site could tap the DC as well as the northern VA and WV panhandle.
One issue though is the proximity of Charlestown which is only 40 road miles from Dulles.
Of course I could be completely wrong on this one and some horsemen's group may find an investor who would build out near Charlottesville or some other far flung locale.
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Old 04-07-2015, 09:58 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by thespaah
Some 75% of the population of the Commonwealth is located within 75 miles of Washington.
Where did you find that statistic?

The population of VA is 8 million. The Richmond and Norfolk statistical areas, which are farther away from DC than 75 miles, have about 3 million combined. The cities in the west (Roanoke, Lynchburg, etc.) have about 1 million, and there's another million scattered in counties in the southern and western parts of the state. That's over 60% of the state population that's outside the 75 mile radius of DC.

Northern Virginians may think that they make up 75% of the state, but they don't.

Finding a site for a track in Virginia is still as problematic as it was back when Colonial was built. Given Colonial's history, virtually no hope for casinos in Virginia and the general state of the industry, I can't imagine any investor building another track in the state.

Last edited by foregoforever; 04-07-2015 at 09:59 AM.
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Old 04-07-2015, 12:31 PM   #33
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They fell out. Again.

http://live.drf.com/nuggets/12680

Edit to add:

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-raci...adw-operation/

Last edited by Grits; 04-07-2015 at 12:39 PM.
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Old 04-07-2015, 07:55 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foregoforever
Where did you find that statistic?

The population of VA is 8 million. The Richmond and Norfolk statistical areas, which are farther away from DC than 75 miles, have about 3 million combined. The cities in the west (Roanoke, Lynchburg, etc.) have about 1 million, and there's another million scattered in counties in the southern and western parts of the state. That's over 60% of the state population that's outside the 75 mile radius of DC.

Northern Virginians may think that they make up 75% of the state, but they don't.

Finding a site for a track in Virginia is still as problematic as it was back when Colonial was built. Given Colonial's history, virtually no hope for casinos in Virginia and the general state of the industry, I can't imagine any investor building another track in the state.
You are right...Northern Virginia makes up about 35% of the state population....and that percentage grows every year. The 60% number is tax revenue....every 10 dollars collected in state taxes in Northern Virginia, only six dollars is returned to Northern Virginia. So while the rest of the state may get annoyed with our inflated sense of importance...they have no problem spending our money.
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Old 04-07-2015, 08:00 PM   #35
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It doesn't really matter to me where you all spend your money....I just wish you'd make a solid decision on horse race betting and stick with it.
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Old 04-07-2015, 10:12 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foregoforever
Where did you find that statistic?

The population of VA is 8 million. The Richmond and Norfolk statistical areas, which are farther away from DC than 75 miles, have about 3 million combined. The cities in the west (Roanoke, Lynchburg, etc.) have about 1 million, and there's another million scattered in counties in the southern and western parts of the state. That's over 60% of the state population that's outside the 75 mile radius of DC.

Northern Virginians may think that they make up 75% of the state, but they don't.

Finding a site for a track in Virginia is still as problematic as it was back when Colonial was built. Given Colonial's history, virtually no hope for casinos in Virginia and the general state of the industry, I can't imagine any investor building another track in the state.
I found it here....My estimate of 75% was a bit high..http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/maps/virginia_map.html
I chose counties and independent cities in VA only. Nothing in MD, which if I did, would result in about 4.5 million people residing in an around the nation's capital. This does not include those north west or east of DC.
Broken down into the VA pop only, it's around 3.5 million residing within a 75 mile radius of DC....Clearly, the place to build.
Quite frankly, even though Colonial is a nice facility and is unique, it is in an area which is too far from the most populous metro area.

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Old 04-07-2015, 11:53 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thespaah
Broken down into the VA pop only, it's around 3.5 million residing within a 75 mile radius of DC....Clearly, the place to build.
Quite frankly, even though Colonial is a nice facility and is unique, it is in an area which is too far from the most populous metro area.
Fair enough, but how many new tracks, unattached to a casino, have been built lately? Who would possibly invest in one? And how could they attract horses away from the slots-enhanced purses in Maryland and WVa? They can shuffle the money around, and rearrange the organizations all they want, but the economics don't change.

On the other hand, if they can find a steeplechase venue that can be adapted to run some flats races, that's probably sufficient to get them tapped in to the purse fund from the ADW tax.
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Old 04-08-2015, 12:12 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Grits
I am making a strong guess why Jacobs pulled the plug on EZbets and the couple of OTB's that remained open. I think he is of the opinion, that Northern Virginia will land a track. He (in some round about way) is connected to Maryland racing). He knows what's happening behind the scenes with the racing commission and horsemen in Virginia. I hope they build one in Hampton Roads, but I honestly doubt anything will be built to compare even remotely to the track in New Kent. It simply was a bad guess for location for Hampton Roads and Richmond.
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Old 04-08-2015, 03:06 PM   #39
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Report on today's Virginia Racing Commission meeting:

http://www.richmond.com/business/loc...34b0394f9.html

According to this, Colonial's own ADW (EZ Horseplay, which they shut down this week) has been withholding the 5% share from the ADW tax to the Virginia Horsemen's purse fund since November 1. Litigation expected.

There's also a statement from the Va Equine Alliance that they hope to run harness racing in October, and turf racing next year, at Oak Ridge Estates in Nelson County. This is a hunt club halfway between Charlottesville and Lynchburg. Google map (you may have to zoom out to see the oval) ...

https://maps.google.com/maps?q=37.70...num=1&t=h&z=15

(and you thought halfway between Richmond and Williamsburg was a remote location.)
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Old 04-08-2015, 03:40 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foregoforever
Report on today's Virginia Racing Commission meeting:

http://www.richmond.com/business/loc...34b0394f9.html

According to this, Colonial's own ADW (EZ Horseplay, which they shut down this week) has been withholding the 5% share from the ADW tax to the Virginia Horsemen's purse fund since November 1. Litigation expected.

There's also a statement from the Va Equine Alliance that they hope to run harness racing in October, and turf racing next year, at Oak Ridge Estates in Nelson County. This is a hunt club halfway between Charlottesville and Lynchburg. Google map (you may have to zoom out to see the oval) ...

https://maps.google.com/maps?q=37.70...num=1&t=h&z=15

(and you thought halfway between Richmond and Williamsburg was a remote location.)
That Nelson County track must be doing one great business.. I can't get a bet down on them at Twinspires..... Oh wait a minute, I've never even heard of the place.
New Kent wasn't remote at all... But in Virginia, I think you either put it in Richmond or in one of the Hampton Roads cities. No halfway business with this traffic here.
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Old 04-08-2015, 06:28 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by foregoforever
Fair enough, but how many new tracks, unattached to a casino, have been built lately? Who would possibly invest in one? And how could they attract horses away from the slots-enhanced purses in Maryland and WVa? They can shuffle the money around, and rearrange the organizations all they want, but the economics don't change.

On the other hand, if they can find a steeplechase venue that can be adapted to run some flats races, that's probably sufficient to get them tapped in to the purse fund from the ADW tax.
Ok....I think you missed the point here.
I was merely responding to speculation that a horsemen's group would build a track somewhere else in VA. It was NOT my idea.
I was merely speculating as to where the most viable location for a race track within the borders of VA.
Let's face it, WV racing is populated with low end stock. Colonial's meet was scheduled in between Pimilco and Laruel. That was by design and of course Cnl attracted many outfits from MD and DE...
Now, my suggestion would be for a VA track to run the majority of it's races for VA breds. The purses could be funded by ADW and signal fees as well as a stipend from the Commonwealth's breeder's fund.
VA is not going to be a casino state for the foreseeable future. It is just not a priority and I am guessing it is not politically palatable for the majority of the senators and reps whose constituents reside in the suburban and rural areas.
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Old 04-08-2015, 08:16 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by thespaah
Now, my suggestion would be for a VA track to run the majority of it's races for VA breds. The purses could be funded by ADW and signal fees as well as a stipend from the Commonwealth's breeder's fund.
I think that's what the horsemen have in mind. Under the proposed new law, the VRC can grant a limited license to run up to 14 days a year to a facility without "significant infrastructure" - meaning no requirements for a local referendum, covered seating, barns, or specific course dimensions. This seems to describe the Oak Ridge facility, so this must be their "out" if they can't lease Colonial. I think that if they offer parimutuel wagering on it, even if it's just on-site in Nelson County, they can tap into the purse funds.

Are there enough VA-breds to run a decent meeting?

The proposed law is at ...

http://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp...l+SB1097ER+pdf
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Old 04-09-2015, 09:42 AM   #43
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Just a side note of why I hate the news networks equally..All of them get a story and run with it before they know all the facts. A local news network in Hampton Roads reported last night that effective today Virginians could no longer wager horses on the internet since Colonial Downs has officially closed their off track parlors and associated account wagering website. (This did not affect players with Twinspires and other websites for Virginians. No mention of that.)

Last edited by Flysofree; 04-09-2015 at 09:43 AM.
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Old 03-03-2018, 12:29 PM   #44
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Jeff Jacobs is into casinos. He thought he would have casinos in Virginia in a few years after he built the track like the rest of the Mid atlantic states and he would be in the drivers seat. Now he knows that's not going to happen in this commonwealth state so I think he just wants out.


The fourth OTB opened today since this and here comes the opening for gambling in Va. and Colonial Downs reopening maybe.


https://www.virginiahorseracing.com/?p=3196
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Old 03-17-2018, 09:10 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by ctownraces@bp View Post
The fourth OTB opened today since this and here comes the opening for gambling in Va. and Colonial Downs reopening maybe.


https://www.virginiahorseracing.com/?p=3196
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