Losing my patience with the industry

[highnote]

Last night, I wanted to check the results of a few races. So I go to Equibase.com and select quick results.

I look up one race and look at the payoff.

Then I click on another track and click on the link to the payoff. I am taken to a new screen that says I have exceeded the request limit. Please type in the following code. You know the code -- that funny looking text that they want you to type in, but it's always indecipherable to the human eye. So you end up typing in 5 of them until you get it right. Meanwhile, you've wasted 2 minutes of your life's time.

I can only conclude that this industry really is trying to chase away customers.

What other rationale is there for making it so difficult to check result payoffs?

I don't know whether to laugh or wage war?!

I'm just about ready to capitulate and retire from betting. I thought as a founder of HANA I could help make things better. But if the industry leaders are dead set on killing the industry then there is no hope.

And if the industry leaders are stupid, then I don't hold much hope I can increase their intellectual capacity.

Making users type in a string of indecipherable text if they want to see a result after the user has only looked up one result is just plain dumb.

And if I see anyone at Equibase at a conference I will tell them to their face that it is a dumb idea. At this point, I don't care whether they like it or not. It's just plain dumb and the person who thought of it was a good idea is dumb.

Sorry for my bluntness, but the industry should be making it easy to do business with them, not harder.

There are some good people in the industry and I don't mean to offend the good ones. But there are some dumb ones.

[cmoore]

Isn't that little box annoying as hell..They protect their precious results like its top secret information..Also when someone puts up a article from drf and you click it..You go right to a log in page..I'm like screw that article..I have a log in but I'm not wasting my time to for a 1 page article..

[highnote]

I just wrote to feedback@equibase.com and told them the idea is dumb and the person who thought of it is dumb.

I'm sick as hell of this industry's complete and total disdain for the customer and I'm not going to take it any more.

When they change their ways, I'll start calling them intelligent. Until then, they're dumb.

I don't care if they feel insulted. They insult me everyday with their contempt for me.

[miesque]

Actually I think that particular feature at Equibase was instituted because there were too many impatient people like myself constantly hitting the refresh button on the brower as they are awaiting the posting of entries for a particular track or awaiting official results. I am horribly guilty of trying to find out entries the second they are posted in Equibase in certain situations.

[DeanT]

I am horribly guilty

ESPN has the same people doing it for scores. They are happy to have them as readers. You aint guilty of anything but being a customer wanting to see a race result.

John - go get em!!!

I think this should be a blog piece for Monday!

[BillW]

Actually I think that particular feature at Equibase was instituted because there were too many impatient people like myself constantly hitting the refresh button on the brower as they are awaiting the posting of entries for a particular track or awaiting official results. I am horribly guilty of trying to find out entries the second they are posted in Equibase in certain situations.

I think they are trying to foil automated reading of their results page (which is the automated version of what you are describing). Now whether this is due to concern for resource overloading or simply to spite creative customers is up for debate.

[DeanT]

PS: Hey, it's a wild day already. I am still freaking out how the piece on the Paulick report where the author wants to change the business model so that like 85% of all revenue goes to pay purses is a good idea. He makes THG look forward thinking.

And then Cot Campbell goes and agrees with him. :bang:

Altho I did get a kick out of the last comment.

Fred Pope and Cot Campbell have to be insane. They have no idea about the gambling side of the game.

It’s just impossible they can be this ignorant about what racing’s business needs are.

[Cangamble]

I do track variants for 4 or 5 tracks at a time. Sometimes I miss a few days and have to calculate 10 to 12 variants in one sitting.
Equibase allows you to pull PDF charts up to around 6-8 before you get an error message, and even if you reboot the computer, you have to wait until the next day to see more charts.
When it happens, I just go to DRF for the charts. They don't have the bs going on that Equibase does.

[InsideThePylons-MW]

Altho I did get a kick out of the last comment.

I was being kind. I restrained myself from really blasting them. :bang:

[Tom Barrister]

Actually I think that particular feature at Equibase was instituted because there were too many impatient people like myself constantly hitting the refresh button on the brower as they are awaiting the posting of entries for a particular track or awaiting official results. I am horribly guilty of trying to find out entries the second they are posted in Equibase in certain situations.

You have the right idea. Actually, there were many bots polling the results every few seconds, and this was causing an overload on the system.

ESPN and most other sports sites aren't any different. If a bot (or a user acting like a bot) polls them every few seconds on a constant basis (like the entire time that games are being played), there's an IP ban, whenever the techs spot the excessive requests.

[highnote]

I think they are trying to foil automated reading of their results page (which is the automated version of what you are describing).

Bill,

I only looked at one quick result. When I clicked on a new track to get a second result I had to type in an indecipherable string of text.

Let me say it again -- on the second result lookup I had to type in a string of text. Not after the 10th or 20th or 100th, but AFTER THE FIRST.

Are the f'ing kidding me?

I am so pissed at their stupidity and contempt and superiority complex and monopolistic practices. And it takes a lot to piss me off. They will not hear the end of this from me until they change their practice. And if they don't change, then I'll keep harping on it. Not that they give a shit.

John

[highnote]

Mr. Brian Wells from Equibase contacted me and said they are looking into the issue of the security function that enables it. They don't know how long it will be before it is fixed, but it is being addressed.

Is it possible someone actually cares?

Why is it that nothing gets looked at unless you raise hell?

[highnote]

You have the right idea. Actually, there were many bots polling the results every few seconds, and this was causing an overload on the system.

ESPN and most other sports sites aren't any different. If a bot (or a user acting like a bot) polls them every few seconds on a constant basis (like the entire time that games are being played), there's an IP ban, whenever the techs spot the excessive requests.


Here's a concept -- if people want this kind of data, delivered in this kind of fashion, then make it available.

Whatever happened to meeting the needs of customers?

Did they ever consider that heavy users might be willing to pay a fee for access to real-time, streaming data?

This IS the information age, in case anyone hasn't noticed.

[cj]

Actually I think that particular feature at Equibase was instituted because there were too many impatient people like myself constantly hitting the refresh button on the brower as they are awaiting the posting of entries for a particular track or awaiting official results. I am horribly guilty of trying to find out entries the second they are posted in Equibase in certain situations.

It had nothing to do with that if I remember correctly. It was about offshore books supposedly stealing this cherished information from the site.

[cj]

Mr. Brian Wells from Equibase contacted me and said they are looking into the issue of the security function that enables it. They don't know how long it will be before it is fixed, but it is being addressed.

Is it possible someone actually cares?

Why is it that nothing gets looked at unless you raise hell?

Good luck with that John. I've written them several times about this. There have been times I've gotten the text thing on the FIRST try.

[turfnsport]

It had nothing to do with that if I remember correctly. It was about offshore books supposedly stealing this cherished information from the site.

Correct...they are trying to prevent other sites like off shore racebooks or other horse racing related sites from scraping the site for info and using the mass info for free.

[highnote]

Correct...they are trying to prevent other sites like off shore racebooks or other horse racing related sites from scraping the site for info and using the mass info for free.

Yeah. Well they're also preventing a guy like me from using it. I'm a guy who just wants to check one race payoff.

If I can't use it and the offshores can't use it. Who the hell is using it? :rolleyes:

[JustRalph]

ever heard of Denial of service attacks?

This is a component of that too...........

BOTS and such............have forced this crap on all of us.

[cj]

ever heard of Denial of service attacks?

This is a component of that too...........

BOTS and such............have forced this crap on all of us.

True, but that is not the reason Equibase implemented the feature. I doubt anyone cares enough to bother with them.

[highnote]

ever heard of Denial of service attacks?

This is a component of that too...........

BOTS and such............have forced this crap on all of us.

I have heard of denial of service attacks. I understand that bots use up bandwidth.

However, I am one guy, with one easily identifiable IP Address, who wanted to check two or three result payoffs.

All they have to do is count how many times my IP Address hits their site. When it gets to 10 times per second then shut me off. But twice in one minute? Gimme a freaking break.

And another thing... if people want masses of data quickly and reliably then goddammit, make it available. Businesses are supposed to cater to customers. Monopolies don't have that problem. They do what they want -- customer be damned.

[DeanT]

Of course a good point John.

Betfair has bots galore, some of which scrape data at something like 500 times a second. for accounts who do this there is an added fee for rake. I think 1%. It's the free market - they charge the people who are doing this more, and leave everyone else alone.

We see this response from racing, and have for a hundred years. Do you know what happened in 1900? Racing got together to lobby against cars. They thought cars would hurt racing, so they tried to stop road building. It is in the book Dan Patch, which is quite good.

In our age what would you or me, or any company do about rebaters (offshore ones)? We would take the customer that is using them, and offer a rebate. Racing's response: Put all people in the same boat and treat them the same - charge them all a high price and shut down the offshore.

It is a pattern. They have not changed in 100 years.

[BUD]

With My MS and flirting with Optic neuritis That is effen impossible for me to do----Sorry about the passion--But if I had a dollar every time that happened to me I'd be rich--I agree




Last night, I wanted to check the results of a few races. So I go to Equibase.com and select quick results.

I look up one race and look at the payoff.

Then I click on another track and click on the link to the payoff. I am taken to a new screen that says I have exceeded the request limit. Please type in the following code. You know the code -- that funny looking text that they want you to type in, but it's always indecipherable to the human eye. So you end up typing in 5 of them until you get it right. Meanwhile, you've wasted 2 minutes of your life's time.

I can only conclude that this industry really is trying to chase away customers.

What other rationale is there for making it so difficult to check result payoffs?

I don't know whether to laugh or wage war?!

I'm just about ready to capitulate and retire from betting. I thought as a founder of HANA I could help make things better. But if the industry leaders are dead set on killing the industry then there is no hope.

And if the industry leaders are stupid, then I don't hold much hope I can increase their intellectual capacity.

Making users type in a string of indecipherable text if they want to see a result after the user has only looked up one result is just plain dumb.

And if I see anyone at Equibase at a conference I will tell them to their face that it is a dumb idea. At this point, I don't care whether they like it or not. It's just plain dumb and the person who thought of it was a good idea is dumb.

Sorry for my bluntness, but the industry should be making it easy to do business with them, not harder.

There are some good people in the industry and I don't mean to offend the good ones. But there are some dumb ones.

[turfnsport]

John,

I feel your pain..I can never get those damn things correct.

I dropped equibase a note asking them to try something like this:

http://www.trendmicro.com/vinfo/images/Captchar_A-2.gif

[JustRalph]

John,

I feel your pain..I can never get those damn things correct.

I dropped equibase a note asking them to try something like this:

http://www.trendmicro.com/vinfo/images/Captchar_A-2.gif

they could make it look like that.........

your answer would be "tits" or "Ass" I am sure the Bot couldn't tell............. :lol:

[highnote]

So I go to equibase to check a result today.

I click on "quick results".

I get taken to a new page that says "error exceeded requests. to ensure that this page is being accessed properly, we ask that you fill out the box provided with the letters or numbers in the image seen below." And this is without even getting to look at a single result!

I see they still haven't addressed the "security function that enables it".

They said they didn't know how long it would be until it was fixed.

I have a prediction: NEVER.

[DeanT]

John,

The old way of doing things involved carrier pigeons. By placing a note with a race result in a little bitty band around their legs, they fly them out to a central pigeon farm, where horseplayers can telegraph and get results. All for a fee of $3 per race.

Someone wants to protect that business model and they figure that asking internet users (who are used to getting information quickly and easily) to type in those words, is a good way to get them to use the pigeons again.

That's my theory.