Quick Review of THEE TOP THREE Software

[NorCalGreg]

I actually purchased this program a few months ago, looked it over....and left it alone up until a few weeks ago. It was a snap to install, uses the Bris $1 single data files...which I buy anyway for another software program.

Upon opening the program, you come to a "tweaking" or program module--I simply by pass that, and click "view card".
What that opens is pretty cool---think of the Bris Summary, on steroids.
Appx 25 columns of sortable info such as:

RATING*PRIME*TRAINERWIN%*JOCKEYWIN%*RECENCYPOINTS* CLASSPOINTS
*EARNINGS*SPEEDPOINTS*PACE/SPEED*FINISHSPEED*BLINKERPOINTS

I mentioned I bypass the tweaking part of the program, but of course you're welcome to tweak away. The most important part to me is the ability to make spot plays--and this is where the Program's value lies--the proprietary "RATING". Unlike Prime Power (which is also included in the program)...everyone has it, and frankly it's overbet to death.

Since we have a lot of Aqueduct players...I'll give a couple examples of how THEE TOP THREE went against Prime Power, and scored. (BTW--I haven't done exhausting research--but I restrict my wagering on this spot play to sprints)
Sunday 12-20
5th RACE 6F CL
6-1 ML TTT HI RATED +3 PERFECT DISCO
$11.40

Can also find exacta plays when 2 horses are rated way higher than any others. A $2 box only costs $4, and sometimes can pay pretty well.
From that same day @ AQ

8TH RACE 6F ALLOW

:5: CAPTAIN SERIOUS 121 1-1
:3: BOND VIGILANTE 121 10-1
:4: JOKING 113 5-1

It's clear in hindsight the play was BOND VIGILANTE to win, but I played it safe and played a $2 exacta box only, and was rewarded with a $48 payoff.

Obviously these plays don't happen all the time...just showing what's possible. You're going to have to do your homework, play around with the program....see if you can find some spot plays, like I did.

Almost forgot the best part---the entire program---nothing else to buy--(except $1 bris data files) is $37.25!!! I e-mailed the gentleman, Mike Perucci, asking what was the deal with the price--he said he's retired now-- that's all he wants for it. I'm thinking about trying to buy the rights to this program--charge 2 or 3 bills a copy--so I CAN RETIRE!.
theetopthree.com I didn't do an actual link, you'll have to cut and paste. You can get a sample free--he does answer e-mail too.

I stopped the Bris Summary since they don't bother to answer e-mail--going to start a "TTT" spot play instead, since Mike attempts to help & answers e-mail.

[Dr Gonzo]

Thanks, Greg.

I always wondered what this program was like.

[Flysofree]

I actually purchased this program a few months ago, looked it over....and left it alone up until a few weeks ago. It was a snap to install, uses the Bris $1 single data files...which I buy anyway for another software program.

Upon opening the program, you come to a "tweaking" or program module--I simply by pass that, and click "view card".
What that opens is pretty cool---think of the Bris Summary, on steroids.
Appx 25 columns of sortable info such as:

RATING*PRIME*TRAINERWIN%*JOCKEYWIN%*RECENCYPOINTS* CLASSPOINTS
*EARNINGS*SPEEDPOINTS*PACE/SPEED*FINISHSPEED*BLINKERPOINTS

I mentioned I bypass the tweaking part of the program, but of course you're welcome to tweak away. The most important part to me is the ability to make spot plays--and this is where the Program's value lies--the proprietary "RATING". Unlike Prime Power (which is also included in the program)...everyone has it, and frankly it's overbet to death.

Since we have a lot of Aqueduct players...I'll give a couple examples of how THEE TOP THREE went against Prime Power, and scored. (BTW--I haven't done exhausting research--but I restrict my wagering on this spot play to sprints)
Sunday 12-20
5th RACE 6F CL
6-1 ML TTT HI RATED +3 PERFECT DISCO
$11.40

Can also find exacta plays when 2 horses are rated way higher than any others. A $2 box only costs $4, and sometimes can pay pretty well.
From that same day @ AQ

8TH RACE 6F ALLOW

:5: CAPTAIN SERIOUS 121 1-1
:3: BOND VIGILANTE 121 10-1
:4: JOKING 113 5-1

It's clear in hindsight the play was BOND VIGILANTE to win, but I played it safe and played a $2 exacta box only, and was rewarded with a $48 payoff.

Obviously these plays don't happen all the time...just showing what's possible. You're going to have to do your homework, play around with the program....see if you can find some spot plays, like I did.

Almost forgot the best part---the entire program---nothing else to buy--(except $1 bris data files) is $37.25!!! I e-mailed the gentleman, Mike Perucci, asking what was the deal with the price--he said he's retired now-- that's all he wants for it. I'm thinking about trying to buy the rights to this program--charge 2 or 3 bills a copy--so I CAN RETIRE!.
theetopthree.com I didn't do an actual link, you'll have to cut and paste. You can get a sample free--he does answer e-mail too.

I stopped the Bris Summary since they don't bother to answer e-mail--going to start a "TTT" spot play instead, since Mike attempts to help & answers e-mail.

What is the name of the program? Link possibly? Ignore my post I see now..

[green80]

Have you tried this program enough to have an overall win % or ROI?

[cloud9]

I think the softwares main intention is to finding the top three contenders in a race then you handicap those three . Thats why it is named THEE TOP THREE .

[mikesal57]

I actually purchased this program a few months ago, looked it over....and left it alone up until a few weeks ago. It was a snap to install, uses the Bris $1 single data files...which I buy anyway for another software program.

Upon opening the program, you come to a "tweaking" or program module--I simply by pass that, and click "view card".
What that opens is pretty cool---think of the Bris Summary, on steroids.
Appx 25 columns of sortable info such as:

RATING*PRIME*TRAINERWIN%*JOCKEYWIN%*RECENCYPOINTS* CLASSPOINTS
*EARNINGS*SPEEDPOINTS*PACE/SPEED*FINISHSPEED*BLINKERPOINTS

I mentioned I bypass the tweaking part of the program, but of course you're welcome to tweak away. The most important part to me is the ability to make spot plays--and this is where the Program's value lies--the proprietary "RATING". Unlike Prime Power (which is also included in the program)...everyone has it, and frankly it's overbet to death.

Since we have a lot of Aqueduct players...I'll give a couple examples of how THEE TOP THREE went against Prime Power, and scored. (BTW--I haven't done exhausting research--but I restrict my wagering on this spot play to sprints)
Sunday 12-20
5th RACE 6F CL
6-1 ML TTT HI RATED +3 PERFECT DISCO
$11.40

Can also find exacta plays when 2 horses are rated way higher than any others. A $2 box only costs $4, and sometimes can pay pretty well.
From that same day @ AQ

8TH RACE 6F ALLOW

:5: CAPTAIN SERIOUS 121 1-1
:3: BOND VIGILANTE 121 10-1
:4: JOKING 113 5-1

It's clear in hindsight the play was BOND VIGILANTE to win, but I played it safe and played a $2 exacta box only, and was rewarded with a $48 payoff.

Obviously these plays don't happen all the time...just showing what's possible. You're going to have to do your homework, play around with the program....see if you can find some spot plays, like I did.

Almost forgot the best part---the entire program---nothing else to buy--(except $1 bris data files) is $37.25!!! I e-mailed the gentleman, Mike Perucci, asking what was the deal with the price--he said he's retired now-- that's all he wants for it. I'm thinking about trying to buy the rights to this program--charge 2 or 3 bills a copy--so I CAN RETIRE!.
theetopthree.com I didn't do an actual link, you'll have to cut and paste. You can get a sample free--he does answer e-mail too.

I stopped the Bris Summary since they don't bother to answer e-mail--going to start a "TTT" spot play instead, since Mike attempts to help & answers e-mail.


Looks interesting Greg....
Neither of those horses were in my top 4 handifast
but it could be the Inner Track

keep us informed

[NorCalGreg]

green80 Have you tried this program enough to have an overall win % or ROI?

no, greenie...not yet. I do write down my wagers, but this hasn't moved past the "fun" stage, since I'm still trying out spot plays.

cloud9 I think the softwares main intention is to finding the top three contenders in a race then you handicap those three . Thats why it is named THEE TOP THREE .

true......someone pmed with a question about this very subject. Here's my answer---you can get just as good 3 contenders using the last 3 top beyers. I mentioned the program's real value lies in the ratings--when they differ from others AND you can see at a glance the highly rated horse is from a top % trainer, has recency going for it, etc.
If you just take this program's top 3--why not just take Prime Power's top 3, and handicap those? See what I'm saying?

mikesal57
Looks interesting Greg....
Neither of those horses were in my top 4 handifast
but it could be the Inner Track
keep us informed

You got it :ThmbUp:

[Sparky13]

I actually purchased this program a few months ago, looked it over....and left it alone up until a few weeks ago. It was a snap to install, uses the Bris $1 single data files...which I buy anyway for another software program.

Upon opening the program, you come to a "tweaking" or program module--I simply by pass that, and click "view card".
What that opens is pretty cool---think of the Bris Summary, on steroids.
Appx 25 columns of sortable info such as:

RATING*PRIME*TRAINERWIN%*JOCKEYWIN%*RECENCYPOINTS* CLASSPOINTS
*EARNINGS*SPEEDPOINTS*PACE/SPEED*FINISHSPEED*BLINKERPOINTS

I mentioned I bypass the tweaking part of the program, but of course you're welcome to tweak away. The most important part to me is the ability to make spot plays--and this is where the Program's value lies--the proprietary "RATING". Unlike Prime Power (which is also included in the program)...everyone has it, and frankly it's overbet to death.

Since we have a lot of Aqueduct players...I'll give a couple examples of how THEE TOP THREE went against Prime Power, and scored. (BTW--I haven't done exhausting research--but I restrict my wagering on this spot play to sprints)
Sunday 12-20
5th RACE 6F CL
6-1 ML TTT HI RATED +3 PERFECT DISCO
$11.40

Can also find exacta plays when 2 horses are rated way higher than any others. A $2 box only costs $4, and sometimes can pay pretty well.
From that same day @ AQ

8TH RACE 6F ALLOW

:5: CAPTAIN SERIOUS 121 1-1
:3: BOND VIGILANTE 121 10-1
:4: JOKING 113 5-1

It's clear in hindsight the play was BOND VIGILANTE to win, but I played it safe and played a $2 exacta box only, and was rewarded with a $48 payoff.

Obviously these plays don't happen all the time...just showing what's possible. You're going to have to do your homework, play around with the program....see if you can find some spot plays, like I did.

Almost forgot the best part---the entire program---nothing else to buy--(except $1 bris data files) is $37.25!!! I e-mailed the gentleman, Mike Perucci, asking what was the deal with the price--he said he's retired now-- that's all he wants for it. I'm thinking about trying to buy the rights to this program--charge 2 or 3 bills a copy--so I CAN RETIRE!.
theetopthree.com I didn't do an actual link, you'll have to cut and paste. You can get a sample free--he does answer e-mail too.

I stopped the Bris Summary since they don't bother to answer e-mail--going to start a "TTT" spot play instead, since Mike attempts to help & answers e-mail.

What is the "tweaking" you refer to above? I have this program also.

[green80]

How do you determine TTT's best bets?

[UltimateBetter]

Actually if any body has any Play Module setting it would be nice to share so I
Can tweek with it .

[Zaf]

Tried many software programs in my day. Never heard of this one. Do they have a website ?

Z

[upthecreek]

Tried many software programs in my day. Never heard of this one. Do they have a website ?

Z
http://theetopthree.com/
Also lists on Ebay

[Zaf]

Thanks :ThmbUp:

Z

[Nutz and Boltz]

I have version 2.1, seems like he added a few new features. For such a cheapo price, I think that I might purchase ver. 2.2.

[Partsnut]

It gets better. If you have a coupon you get it for $5.00 less. ;)

I have a copy and haven't given it much time but from the one time I used it, I was impressed.
It's an excellent contender selector.
Spot plays are the real value of this software.

Well worth the price and fun to use.
Mike, the author gives great support,

[JimG]

It gets better. If you have a coupon you get it for $5.00 less. ;)

I have a copy and haven't given it much time but from the one time I used it, I was impressed.
It's an excellent contender selector.
Spot plays are the real value of this software.

Well worth the price and fun to use.
Mike, the author gives great support,

I do not have it but I value your feedback. Thanks for providing it and have a good holiday Bill.

Jim

[Partsnut]

I do not have it but I value your feedback. Thanks for providing it and have a good holiday Bill.

Jim

Jim, thanks for the good wishes. I wish you the same.

[NorCalGreg]

I have version 2.1, seems like he added a few new features. For such a cheapo price, I think that I might purchase ver. 2.2.

attn Nutz.. right off the Jim Robins review onsite: "future upgrades are free"

info@TheeTopThree.Com

Merry Christmas

Good Luck

-NCG☮

[NorCalGreg]

UltimateBetter Actually if any body has any Play Module setting it would be nice to share so I Can tweek with it .

green80 How do you determine TTT's best bets?


Sparky What is the "tweaking" you refer to above? I have this
program also.

Doesn't seem like anyone else has bothered with the "tweaking' part of this program. I'm only interested in the at-a-glance summary, which is bad-a$$ for us regular-guy handicappers.

I've e-mailed the proprietor of this program, told him of the interest in his tweaking module (I was hesitant to provide his link since he isn't a paid advertiser--it's already up, so what the heck) He hasn't gotten back to me yet--You can always e-mail Mike at the website.
If anyone does TWEAK this program---and wants to explain it---go for it. You have the floor...
There's no racing today, it's after midnite here in Oakland, Ca...I'm gonna mess with this program and come up with a $$$ spot play. I'll post later on.

Thanks for the feedback partsnut--info on the $5 coupon, please?

Merry Christmas All

-NCG☮

[IrishRail76]

I have written hardcopy reviews for ten years and two books of my own along the way, including one that wins the Pick 3 over 57% of the time.

I remember "Thee Top Three" for two reasons: I had watched the author of the program and the program itself "grow" through years of improvement, including two versions; and, on top of getting more accurate, the author was a great guy to work with and his product continued to pay off.

As aforementioned in this thread, the price is very, very reasonable, whether you use the program as a quick way to grab contenders, or as a quick way to check out an angle play. It also responds well to tweaking.

As we all know, some software is more accurate at particular tracks. Once you find the tracks that work best for you, just break them down into their best performing races, for example three year olds on dirt at 6f. Find what works for you (playing on paper), then keep tweaking.

Also, at the time, developers were beginning to write for Windows 7 and up, which made the software easy to use, plus able to move into the future easier. This makes it a good "long-term player" for the user.

Giving it a "strong 8" in a 1 - 9 scale was a strong endorsement, but the software and author earned it honestly and through hard work.

Just wanted to chime in. Please enjoy a safe and wonderful holiday season.

[upthecreek]

attn Nutz.. right off the Jim Robins review onsite: "future upgrades are free"

info@TheeTopThree.Com

Merry Christmas

Good Luck

-NCG☮
I received the upgrade including the new track abbreviations ,last year on a CD sent without even asking!

[mikesal57]

I have written hardcopy reviews for ten years and two books of my own along the way, including one that wins the Pick 3 over 57% of the time.

I remember "Thee Top Three" for two reasons: I had watched the author of the program and the program itself "grow" through years of improvement, including two versions; and, on top of getting more accurate, the author was a great guy to work with and his product continued to pay off.

As aforementioned in this thread, the price is very, very reasonable, whether you use the program as a quick way to grab contenders, or as a quick way to check out an angle play. It also responds well to tweaking.

As we all know, some software is more accurate at particular tracks. Once you find the tracks that work best for you, just break them down into their best performing races, for example three year olds on dirt at 6f. Find what works for you (playing on paper), then keep tweaking.

Also, at the time, developers were beginning to write for Windows 7 and up, which made the software easy to use, plus able to move into the future easier. This makes it a good "long-term player" for the user.

Giving it a "strong 8" in a 1 - 9 scale was a strong endorsement, but the software and author earned it honestly and through hard work.

Just wanted to chime in. Please enjoy a safe and wonderful holiday season.


Thxs for the review...If you can remember, how is the tweaking part of this program..like what is tweak able...??

mike

[upthecreek]

Thxs for the review...If you can remember, how is the tweaking part of this program..like what is tweak able...??

mike
There no settings that can be changed for the automatic part of the program that I know of
There is manual data entry available, but most or all of that is in the Bris file, so I'm lost on tweaking

[Partsnut]

Here's a link to the one and only track that i looked at:

If you will notice the top 4 contenders and the order of finish
For each individual race.

Here is the race day summary file
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bz7vLz2UR1KvV2lMNjlEZHFFY28/view?usp=docslist_api

Characteristically, FLX is a chalk track.
This file was no exception.

[NorCalGreg]

I have written hardcopy reviews for ten years and two books of my own along the way, including one that wins the Pick 3 over 57% of the time.

I remember "Thee Top Three" for two reasons: I had watched the author of the program and the program itself "grow" through years of improvement, including two versions; and, on top of getting more accurate, the author was a great guy to work with and his product continued to pay off.

As aforementioned in this thread, the price is very, very reasonable, whether you use the program as a quick way to grab contenders, or as a quick way to check out an angle play. It also responds well to tweaking.

As we all know, some software is more accurate at particular tracks. Once you find the tracks that work best for you, just break them down into their best performing races, for example three year olds on dirt at 6f. Find what works for you (playing on paper), then keep tweaking.

Also, at the time, developers were beginning to write for Windows 7 and up, which made the software easy to use, plus able to move into the future easier. This makes it a good "long-term player" for the user.

Giving it a "strong 8" in a 1 - 9 scale was a strong endorsement, but the software and author earned it honestly and through hard work.

Just wanted to chime in. Please enjoy a safe and wonderful holiday season.

Curious Irish about the name of your Pic 3 book---I'm a sucker for any book that claims to "win the Pick 3 over 57% of the time" seriously wanna know more

**Also---I have the THEE TOP THREE spot play...it's for AQ--I gotta run right now, but will post when I get back.
Have a good one yall
-NCG

[NorCalGreg]

This spot play is to be used with THEE TOP THREE software program, at Aqueduct. It doesn't win everday, and there isn't a play everday. You can loosen it up if you prefer--I've got it as loose as I care to go, right now....sure, there will be more "action" if you want to adjust the rules, but also the ROI will take a hit.
I have Bris files from the last 7 racing days, so will give the rules first, then the plays. Then we'll take a look at the Spot Plays for Saturday's AQ card

*Big Winner Spot Play*

--In the SUMMARY SECTION sort the WINS, so you have the horse with most WINS per race on top--at least 3, or pass race- do not go to next horse
-Trainer OR Jockey must have 15% wins on year, & combo total 25%
-ML must be 5/2+ or pass
-In the event more than 1 contender tied in wins, meets the T/J screen &ML screen, take the highest TTT rated horse as your selection.
-At least 5 horses must be rated for the race to be playable--usually means
fts, overseas, distances, whatever, something we don't need to waste time looking at---less than 5--skip it.

Here are the plays

12/12
8th :5: SMITTEN BY GOLD 15-1 TRAINER 26% JOCKEY 22% WINS 9 FIN OUT
12/13
6TH :8: LOTSA NOODLES 5/2 T-20% J-19% 10WINS FIN 2ND
7TH :7: BIG DELUXE 3-1 T-20% J-17% 11 WINS $4.10
8TH :4: PERFECT FREUD 12-1 J-17% T-8% 4WINS $22.00

Let me stop here--you probably are thinking "way to make your spot play fit PERFECT FREUD" Yeah but if you'll notice, Freud's jockey has twice the win % of his 8% trainer, nothing to scoff at... EPS is decent, no one has a better recency score, so at 12-1 ML...a good bet. Although this is a mechanical spot play, a little quick 'capping never hurts. This one DOES fit on the 15% t/j rule perfectly.

12/16
5th :1: BUG JUICE 6-1 T-15% J-18% 13WINS $18.80
7TH :2: RICO CAPOTE 5/2 T-23% J-18% 10WINS $6.10

12/17
6TH :7: SACRED SUCCESS 5/2 T-11% J-15% WINS 7 FIN OUT
7TH :1: SUN AND MOON 6-1 T-23% J-20% 6 WINS FIN OUT

12/18
2ND :5: SWAKOPMUND 6-1 T-11% J-15% 6WINS FIN OUT
7TH :3: CHAIRMAN NOW 10-1 T-23% J-18% 14WINS $11.20

12/19
3RD :3: DRUMROLL 20-1 T-23% J-10% WINS43RD $10.00 SHOW

12/20
2ND :4: FRAZIL 8-1 T-18% J-17% 18WINS FIN 3RD
8TH :3: BOND VIGILANTE 10-1 T-14% J-17% 6WINS $19.40*

Another interesting race....3 horses tied with 6 wins, all 3 met the T/J req, all 3 met the ML req--so we went to the final tiebreaker once again--the TTT highest rating--BOND VIGILANTE easily was tops, and scored a nice $19.40 payoff.

As I mentioned, this is a mechanical spot play, but never hurts to do a little 'capping while you're looking anyway.

Here's Saturday's Spot Plays for AQ just to get you up to speed, and make sure you understand the method:

4TH :1: NON STOP 15-1 T-18% J-21% 10WINS If you're capping TTT style, you'll see this one's the top class horse & has 5 recency points.

6th :7: STREET SHARK 5-1 T-9% J-15% 8WINS Hi TTT rating, way hi class points, good wager if that ML holds

7th :3: SUPER NICKY 6-1 T-23% J-13% 5WINS In here because it fits the method, lawdy daaa.

8th One glance & can see 1 horse is a millionaire--"our" kind of 'capping doesn't work w/ millionaires :lol:
Good Luck today

-NCG

[Jingle]

I'm rooting for you Greg. Good Luck.

Any idea how Daddy's Thief in the 7th scored with your spot play? My neighbor owns him. ML 9-5.

[NorCalGreg]

I'm rooting for you Greg. Good Luck.

Any idea how Daddy's Thief in the 7th scored with your spot play? My neighbor owns him. ML 9-5.

TY jingle....Daddy's Thief is maybe the main reason I was a little blaise' about the spot-play qualifier, :3: Super Nicky's chances. Thief' appears to be the one to beat, tops on TTT, prime power, and speed points. He does have some red flags from a betting standpoint, so your owner friend should know more after this race.

Good luck

-NCG

[mikesal57]

In the 7th Race.....I know J&T numbers are good...
But do you think its stretching it , going down to a horse in 5TH position??
I had someone run this for me but you have been working with this for a while...
How often does a horse out of the Top Three win?

thxs
Mike

[upthecreek]

#3 comes up my top Tips play if that means anything :lol:

[mikesal57]

Might as well...Handifast

[Jingle]

My MPH Program gets them pretty close as Native, Super, and Daddy's Thief.

[barshoe]

7 NEVERINDICTED 12.0 RODRIGUEZ J. TEBBUTT J.
11 DADDYS THIEF 1.8 NAVARRO J. ARO M. C.
3 SUPER NICKY 6.0 FRANCO M. ENGLEHART C. J.
4 CHIEF ASSIGNMENT 15.0 HERNANDEZ H. FRIEDMAN M. E.
6 BROADWAY BAY 10.0 VELASQUEZ C. H. BROWN B. R.
1 NORM THE GIANT 12.0 CARMOUCHE K. RYERSON J. T.
8 COPERNICUS 12.0 CRUZ A. MIRANDA L. A.
2 ADAMS NOTE 5.0 DECARLO C. P. DILGER M.
5 NATIVE GEORGE 8.0 DAVIS J. A. GRUSMARK K. M.
10 HERES SPARTACUS 12.0 ARROYO A. S. CHATTERPAUL N.
9 THIRTY PERCENT 30.0 SUAREZ A. TASSO M. L.

[chrisl]

Is this program downloadable

[NorCalGreg]

Is this program downloadable

I don't think so, Chris....but you're welcome to take a look

info@theetopthree.com

looks like everyone's software had this race about the same

[chrisl]

Thanks Greg

[Speed Figure]

How my program has it.

[JimG]

How my program has it.

That was pretty darn good Speed. Nothing like proprietary software, for sure.

Jim

[NorCalGreg]

Was pretty cool the way everbody sorta chimed in with their own software's picks---in the end, 'Thief scored a Power win.

To answer your question about the TOP THREE mike...the top 3 Prime Power or Profit Line are just as good for contender selection.

This was fun---what do you say we do this again tomorrow?

12/27 -AQUEDUCT 7TH RACE 6F ALLOWANCE There are 6 horses almost impossible to separate at first glance--so some real software intelligence, or 'capping skill is necessary. I have no spot-play selection, so I'll 'cap without benefit of pp's--just TTT.

Just post your Software, and it's pick...not a contest or anything :)

[NorCalGreg]

Top TTT & top Prime Power Rating :10: WOMEN WIN @ 3-1

However since this is a sprint, Top Speed Points Big TTT adv goes to

:11: GOLDEN GEM a 5-1 shot..my personal longshot is

:6: ROMAN REIGN 15-1

so, :10: win & :10: keyed to :11: & :6: in ex is my software 7th race play

[Speed Figure]

That was pretty darn good Speed. Nothing like proprietary software, for sure.

JimThanks Jim! The :11: had a huge gap in most of the ratings and a huge gap in odds at 2-1 with the next horse at 7-1. These are the type I try and single unless another horse is rank 1st in PLF = Projected Last Fraction.

[Partsnut]

Spot plays are always interesting and I applaud the effort but I believe that good handicapping will give one more consistent and profitable results if they are able to use the correct tools to analyze a race.
I have prepared a folder with yesterdays 7th race at Aqueduct.
This is the way I would approach a race. These seem to be the right tools (at least for me).
1 -Theetopthree
2- PaceAppraiser

Please see files at the link below.
https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0Bz7vLz2UR1KvLVlzVmc4azJmV0E&usp=sharing

[green80]

Does TTT indicate it's spot plays in the program or do you have to decipher them by applying some rules to the printout?

[NorCalGreg]

Top TTT & top Prime Power Rating :10: WOMEN WIN @ 3-1

However since this is a sprint, Top Speed Points Big TTT adv goes to

:11: GOLDEN GEM a 5-1 shot..my personal longshot is

:6: ROMAN REIGN 15-1

so, :10: win & :10: keyed to :11: & :6: in ex is my software 7th race play

TTT had
WOMEN WIN on top, w/an EX of that one over GOLDEN GEM--
ROMAN REIGN was scratched. The results:

10 -WOMEN WIN 4.90 3.00 2.60
11 -GOLDEN GEM 3.70 2.90

$2 EXACTA 10-11 PAID $14.40

BTW Jim....all software is "proprietary"...think you meant "homegrown"?
I'll be back with another review--there's been some requests for WAGERMATE...hit me up if you'd like to see something else reviewed--other than DIAMOND software, Racey :D .
later
-NCG☮

[NorCalGreg]

Does TTT indicate it's spot plays in the program or do you have to decipher them by applying some rules to the printout?

Sorry didn't see you up there greenie....no, you make up your own spot plays--that's part of the fun of the program. You may notice more than a few longshots are coming in, with top class, top earnings per start, going off at 5-1 +. Now your job is to further refine this, and make a profitable spot play, if possible.
The Data processing guys, spreadsheet jockeys, are willing to forgo the pleasure of this work, in favor of the instant gratification of running 10,000 simulated or real-time races--to discover the stark, cold facts of all-encompassing numbers,
Did they learn anything? Yeah. Did they have any fun? Doubt it.

[appistappis]

IT WOULD BE INTERESTING to see all the numbers for the last at hawthorne on wednesday as there is a must go super high5 carryover.

[NorCalGreg]

IT WOULD BE INTERESTING to see all the numbers for the last at hawthorne on wednesday as there is a must go super high5 carryover.

appi....I'm working on getting you you that report if I can--give me a minute

[NorCalGreg]

okay ---this is all I can fit on this screen--this is most of the important stuff

[Speed Figure]

This race comes up with a lot of prices! I may be doing a lot of boxing...:faint:

[NorCalGreg]

Interesting, SF...with my program DONTFORGETTOFLOSS is a definite win bet-and spot-play qualifier -yours, not so much. We'll just have to see how it plays out. Good luck.

PS:....Are you really from Compton?
-or like Weird Al--straight outta Lynwood? :D

[upthecreek]

9-1-5-3-10
.20 cent paid $1201

[lawmaker1]

Interesting, SF...with my program DONTFORGETTOFLOSS is a definite win bet-and spot-play qualifier -yours, not so much. We'll just have to see how it plays out. Good luck.

PS:....Are you really from Compton?
-or like Weird Al--straight outta Lynwood? :D


I'm curious as to what other program you use the Bris $1 downloads for.

Bob

[NorCalGreg]

I'm curious as to what other program you use the Bris $1 downloads for.

Bob

Mainly the Tom Worth TIPS Program, Bob.

[Speed Figure]

Interesting, SF...with my program DONTFORGETTOFLOSS is a definite win bet-and spot-play qualifier -yours, not so much. We'll just have to see how it plays out. Good luck.

PS:....Are you really from Compton?
-or like Weird Al--straight outta Lynwood? :DYes, I'm really from Compton! I think the #8 was overrated by his last race. After all he was 2 for 32 going in. The #4 & #1 are highlighted possible overlays. The #1 was much higher at 30/1 as the #4 was only 19/1.

[lawmaker1]

Mainly the Tom Worth TIPS Program, Bob.

Do you use the TIPS program sold by RPM? I know Tom has his own software about 10 years ago but pulled it from the market.

[NorCalGreg]

Do you use the TIPS program sold by RPM? I know Tom has his own software about 10 years ago but pulled it from the market.

Yep, the TIPS program sold by RPM. I'm not sure, but maybe son Jon had to sign off on this version-that being the main reason this program is actually decent, compared to everything else I've seen come out of RPM.
I also used Taulbot's Pace program--just couldn't figure out where it could be useful, in the one area you need a software program to be useful---help point the way to the winner.

[upthecreek]

Yep, the TIPS program sold by RPM. I'm not sure, but maybe son Jon had to sign off on this version-that being the main reason this program is actually decent, compared to everything else I've seen come out of RPM.
I also used Taulbot's Pace program--just couldn't figure out where it could be useful, in the one area you need a software program to be useful---help point the way to the winner.
You should really take a look @ Handifast,doing quite well @ Tampa Yesterday 6 top winners,8/10 in top 4, 6 Exactas and 3 tri's-coming up with a wagering strategy is the key which I haven't yet!Lol

[Secondbest]

How is it going for the meet?

[Secondbest]

How is it going for the meet?
That should read how is handifast doing for the meet at Tampa?

[upthecreek]

That should read how is handifast doing for the meet at Tampa?

I need to update the stats I will after this weekend of racing and report back The winner is in the top4 nearly 80% of the time I also keep track of top pick, exacta's tri's and supers I still havent figured out a profitable wagering strategy.

[cloud9]

I need to update the stats I will after this weekend of racing and report back The winner is in the top4 nearly 80% of the time I also keep track of top pick, exacta's tri's and supers I still havent figured out a profitable wagering strategy.Do you score each catacgory in Handifast with your own numbers or do you use the programs default scoring ?

[Partsnut]

AQU010116 R2 Using Thee Top Three And PaceAppraiser

I have it narrowed down to 3 contenders.
The 6 & 2 are coming down in company.
However, the 6 looks like the fastest horse.

Contenders = 6, 2, 9
The 6 would be my choice but offers little value.

Please see TTT summary file for Race 2 at the link below
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bz7vLz2UR1KvdUNKOFNQS2cyWmc/view?usp=sharing

[upthecreek]

AQU010116 R2 Using Thee Top Three And PaceAppraiser

I have it narrowed down to 3 contenders.
The 6 & 2 are coming down in company.
However, the 6 looks like the fastest horse.

Contenders = 6, 2, 9
The 6 would be my choice but offers little value.

Please see TTT summary file for Race 2 at the link below
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bz7vLz2UR1KvdUNKOFNQS2cyWmc/view?usp=sharing



SCRATCHES
Race Program # Horse Reason Notes
2 2 She's All Even Early--Veterinarian
6 My Super Nova Early--Veterinarian

[Partsnut]

SCRATCHES
Race Program # Horse Reason Notes
2 2 She's All Even Early--Veterinarian
6 My Super Nova Early--Veterinarian
----------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for the update:
I guess it's a no brainer (#9) :bang:

Happy New Year to all.

[NorCalGreg]

One final word about THEE TOP THREE--then I'm done with it.

I use these programs to save time--I can't possibly go side to side, up and down, through PP's all night long....for more than one track. Being an angle player...I need help finding these angles and plays, plus I get enjoyment out of testing methods.
TTT has a lot of info packed into it. I was asked if it was good for contender selecting. And people that really hadn't used the program, told me it was great for contender selection. Well....Prime Power, Profit Line, or just the Last Top 3 BeyerBris/Eq/TF Speed Ratings will get you at least as good contenders.
Okay--it's a good little program, we all know that.
I have been using the prog in the RDSS Pick-4 contest here on site---doing okay and having fun with it. Spending maybe 30-45 minutes with the ABC method, THEN deciding early or late.

Okay I know this is dragging on...I went with the late 4 yesterday...didn't win, looked over what won--compared them with mine--and was startled to find the winner of the 6th wasn't even shown on TTT. It was a MD CL--the horse had never run a Route--so wasn't listed. This horse HAD class ratings, SPEED ratings, A MAJOR angle....the author of this software chose to simply ignore.

For some unknown reason--I assumed if a horse wasn't rated and had no info--it wasn't a contender at all--and could be dismissed. Hell Bris Summary doesn't give a horse an AVG RATING DIST/SURF--because it can't--but it shows what info it can. I doesn't just delete the horse.

I invited the author to log in here and answer any questions--guess he was busy. I saw EMD and others had the winner of that race on their tickets---several times over--it was no lucky pick. There were serious angles...main one being Maiden 3rd LT race, switch to $ rider, SPRINT-SPRINT-ROUTE TODAY. TTT users didn't have a chance to know any of this info.

If you're thinking I was just too lazy to do the real work it took to find that winner---yeah, you got me there, too.
But, I can't endorse TTT as a serious 'capping tool, since the program deletes viable contenders, instead of finding a way to rate them.
good luck
-NCG☮

these are the only horses a TTT user was able to 'cap in the 6th

[Dr Gonzo]

One final word about THEE TOP THREE--then I'm done with it.

I've only used TTT for one card at Gulfstream and it was a free sample from the author. I noticed the same "missing contender" problem on that card.

TTT is a nice, reasonably priced program but I couldn't recommend it for serious handicapping.

Fortunately, the author will provide you with a free sample report at the date and track of your choosing. You can then decide if buying the program would benefit you.

Doc

[incoming]

The TTT owner told me that 3 pace lines from a North American track was necessary to receive a ranking in TTT. Seems reasonable to me using a mechanical system and the factors he has chosen to model.

[green80]

The TTT owner told me that 3 pace lines from a North American track was necessary to receive a ranking in TTT. Seems reasonable to me using a mechanical system and the factors he has chosen to model.

All software must have enough data to form a model for the race.
Just use TTT on races where there is enough data to model all the horses in the race.

As with any software, just use it on the races it's good at.

[NorCalGreg]

Karma, Mojo, Juju, whatever you want to call the force that governs wagering in general, and horseracing in particular, is something we must acknowledge, know of it's existence, daily.
For example...you make a ridiculous bet....and quickly lose. You tilt-out and chase that bad bet with an even worse bet---wagering karma will absolutely NOT bail you out. You are owed nothing. When you DO get that miracle hit from out of nowhere...it's not really karma. It's SERENDIPITY--look it up

Anyway...my final point about TTT...here I was saying the program wasn't really useful for horizontals--since it doesn't rate any horses that havent run at todays distance.
Okay...here's where the Karma part comes in. I played the LATE pick-4 in the RDSS contest today--once again the program didn't provide picks for the 6th race. I had been using TTT top 2, top prime if different, and my own selection...but today I shut the program down, used other 'capping methods.

One race--the 8th--had a longshot winner 14 Daisy Cutter $30.80
and separated the winners from also rans. Unfortunately I was not a winner. 6th race was easily picked by conventional 'capping, 7th no sweat, 9th every Jets fan Staten Island had it....that only left the 8th with any mystery.--- Karma anyone? *1st col TTT rating--*2nd ML--*3rd col Prime Power

[lawmaker1]

You gave such a rave review at first for TTT that I ordered it. Now, a few days later, you are practically calling it worthless? Do I just add to my pile of worthless software programs?

[green80]

You gave such a rave review at first for TTT that I ordered it. Now, a few days later, you are practically calling it worthless? Do I just add to my pile of worthless software programs?

I wouldn't just toss it yet. Just track it for a while and compare it to what you are using now. See what program gives you the most winners or the most winners in their top 3 selections and compare ROI. Also try his bet bet and spot play methods. I find it most efficient for spot play methods.

[ebcorde]

Karma, Mojo, Juju, whatever you want to call the force that governs wagering in general, and horseracing in particular, is something we must acknowledge, know of it's existence, daily.
For example...you make a ridiculous bet....and quickly lose. You tilt-out and chase that bad bet with an even worse bet---wagering karma will absolutely NOT bail you out. You are owed nothing. When you DO get that miracle hit from out of nowhere...it's not really karma. It's SERENDIPITY--look it up

Anyway...my final point about TTT...here I was saying the program wasn't really useful for horizontals--since it doesn't rate any horses that havent run at todays distance.
Okay...here's where the Karma part comes in. I played the LATE pick-4 in the RDSS contest today--once again the program didn't provide picks for the 6th race. I had been using TTT top 2, top prime if different, and my own selection...but today I shut the program down, used other 'capping methods.

One race--the 8th--had a longshot winner 14 Daisy Cutter $30.80
and separated the winners from also rans. Unfortunately I was not a winner. 6th race was easily picked by conventional 'capping, 7th no sweat, 9th every Jets fan Staten Island had it....that only left the 8th with any mystery.--- Karma anyone? *1st col TTT rating--*2nd ML--*3rd col Prime Power


I spent a good deal of time over the holidays working on improving class.
I currently use 2 class figs. one for J/T , one for the Horse. The 14 was a top class horse. Most of the bombs I'm seeing are in the top 4 in my class categories. Speed/Pace didn't look at. I'll try to post my class picks, my son and I are debating what are the cutoff odds, 8-1,15-1, just be patient and go fishing.


as far as the 2-1/3-1 choices I can get that at Hialeah and Los Al quarter horses all day long.

one more thing this is a sucker's game IF.... what is the win percentage of horse with odds between 1-5 and 1-1? I would bet extremely low yet everyday you see it. Put 2 bombs together on top a exacta/trifecta/superfecta.

[NorCalGreg]

You gave such a rave review at first for TTT that I ordered it. Now, a few days later, you are practically calling it worthless? Do I just add to my pile of worthless software programs?

Really an immature response, "lawmaker"....you're already placing blame, and haven't really even tried the damn thing yet? Who did you blame your pile of worthless software programs on?
Did you even bother to read my last post?

Green80...earlier in the review--you asked me what my ROI with the program is....you've appointed yourself software expert, dispensing knowledge to the reviewer, and crybabies alike-----what's your ROI? What distances/class/levels does this program perform best at? Are horses rated on top by a large gap really good, solid wagers? Have you really actually profited from the program? If I order this program, I should make money then......that's what you're saying, right?

Just giving you a sample of what it's like to do something simple---like review a horseracing software program, green80. I've done them before, but not in this format--I wrote the review--and that was that. I took no questions, answered no comments, let the "experts" (who refused to ever review anything themselves) ---dictate the way the review should have been.
The next review will be in this format. It's for a prog a member "upthecreek" mentioned, called "INCLOVER". It costs $10 more than TTT.

-Check it out, and review it if you'd care to.

Sorry if I wasn't very friendly--

-NCG

[ebcorde]

Really an immature response, "lawmaker"....you're already placing blame, and haven't really even tried the damn thing yet? Who did you blame your pile of worthless software programs on?
Did you even bother to read my last post?

Green80...earlier in the review--you asked me what my ROI with the program is....you've appointed yourself software expert, dispensing knowledge to the reviewer, and crybabies alike-----what's your ROI? What distances/class/levels does this program perform best at? Are horses rated on top by a large gap really good, solid wagers? Have you really actually profited from the program? If I order this program, I should make money then......that's what you're saying, right?

Just giving you a sample of what it's like to do something simple---like review a horseracing software program, green80. I've done them before, but not in this format--I wrote the review--and that was that. I took no questions, answered no comments, let the "experts" (who refused to ever review anything themselves) ---dictate the way the review should have been.
The next review will be in this format. It's for a prog a member "upthecreek" mentioned, called "INCLOVER". It costs $10 more than TTT.

-Check it out, and review it if you'd care to.

Sorry if I wasn't very friendly--

-NCG

yo , NorCal? Did you check out thorograph? they were free 12/26-12/31. did nothing for me.

[NorCalGreg]

yo , NorCal? Did you check out thorograph? they were free 12/26-12/31. did nothing for me.

I did, eb....they aren't something you can just glance at, are they? I didn't really have the time to get into it, probably like yourself.
Those that have spent the time--swear by thorograph. Guess it's a matter of commiting to a handicapping program, aid, style, niche, etc

[green80]

Green80...earlier in the review--you asked me what my ROI with the program is....you've appointed yourself software expert, dispensing knowledge to the reviewer, and crybabies alike-----what's your ROI? What distances/class/levels does this program perform best at? Are horses rated on top by a large gap really good, solid wagers? Have you really actually profited from the program? If I order this program, I should make money then......that's what you're saying, right?

Just giving you a sample of what it's like to do something simple---like review a horseracing software program, green80. I've done them before, but not in this format--I wrote the review--and that was that. I took no questions, answered no comments, let the "experts" (who refused to ever review anything themselves) ---dictate the way the review should have been.


-Check it out, and review it if you'd care to.

Sorry if I wasn't very friendly--

-NCG[/QUOTE]

ok, I'll give you my results to answer your questions although it is nowhere near enough races to form a valid opinion of the software.

Races bet =40, Wins =15 (37.5%) ROI -14%

Top rated horses by 5 pts or more =13, Wins 8 ROI +3.8%

[green80]

races bet=78 wins=25 (32%) ROI -24%

top rated horses by 5 pts. or more =15 wins= 8 ROI -10%

[NorCalGreg]

races bet=78 wins=25 (32%) ROI -24%

top rated horses by 5 pts. or more =15 wins= 8 ROI -10%

You're not using just top rated--what parameters are you using for betting, and which tracks?

[green80]

You're not using just top rated--what parameters are you using for betting, and which tracks?

The first set of figures is betting $2 win on every highest rated horse, the second set is only betting on horses top rated by 5 points or more. Only playing one track now, Delta Downs.

[NorCalGreg]

The first set of figures is betting $2 win on every highest rated horse, the second set is only betting on horses top rated by 5 points or more. Only playing one track now, Delta Downs.

I found something interesting, green...which was the reason for my "parameters & tracks" question.

Started with TTT just before Christmas (I mentioned I'd had it already, didn't get into it for awhile) --- Here is the generic filter I use on all software that isnt hugely technical:
I take the top rated/ranked/picked horse...require Trainer to have min 15% win for the year--thats it. Gives me a feel for the program--I can usually tell from that, whether the program is going to have any value.
I haven't looked @ Delta...but for a righteous speed track like TUP--adding in the SPEED POINTS is very good--but far too often at this track, gives you the $3.00 winner. Good win%..horrible ROI.

My initial "filter" of TOP RANKED/15% TRAINER--has completely bombed @ Santa Anita. I also started @ AQ....and strangely enough, noticed it was scoring with some regularity. There's one other obvious filter--minimum of 5 horses must be rated by TTT.
I don't keep my Bris files for more than a couple weeks, but will find somewhere to store them now. I do have everything from Jan 1st of this year on. I went through SA--like I said--NADA.
Now here are my results of my simple "screen" @ Aqueduct:

- JAN 1 THRU JAN 10 AQUEDUCT

- THEE TOP THREE -TOP RATED / TRAINER MIN 15% WIN YR

*PLAYABLE RACES = 35 - WINS = 16 - WIN = 45%

*WAGERED = $70.00 RETURNED = $124.90

*ROI = $1.78 AVG MUTUAL = $7.80

There was a $30 winner, $17, $11.80, $8.40, $8.30, $8.10....also six winners under $4.00.

My only real point here is--

#1--like every method, be it paper and pencil--simple software, or the most bad-ass DEEP BLUE, HAL, WATSON, ARIMAA....nothing even comes CLOSE to working at every track.

#2--I plan to continue this method (with conditional betting) on a week-by-week basis, until it's profitability ceases.

#3--I've found that the more "filters" one adds--the closer you get to the favorite. The only other filter I would recommend is an Odds filter.
Wish I could sit and look at tote-boards all day--but you can make conditional bets. 2-1 @ 0 MTP seems like a good place to start--10 of the 16 winners paid $5.00+. Wish I had kept track of EVERY selection--not just the winners---that way I could get a quick glimpse of AVG LOSER'S ODDS,ETC. Yeah, I know there's a long way to get this info ...I want the quick way :D

I'll report back at the end of the week. Green, or anyone else care to give this a try at your home track and report--please do

-NCG

[green80]

I found something interesting, green...which was the reason for my "parameters & tracks" question.

Started with TTT just before Christmas (I mentioned I'd had it already, didn't get into it for awhile) --- Here is the generic filter I use on all software that isnt hugely technical:
I take the top rated/ranked/picked horse...require Trainer to have min 15% win for the year--thats it. Gives me a feel for the program--I can usually tell from that, whether the program is going to have any value.
I haven't looked @ Delta...but for a righteous speed track like TUP--adding in the SPEED POINTS is very good--but far too often at this track, gives you the $3.00 winner. Good win%..horrible ROI.

My initial "filter" of TOP RANKED/15% TRAINER--has completely bombed @ Santa Anita. I also started @ AQ....and strangely enough, noticed it was scoring with some regularity. There's one other obvious filter--minimum of 5 horses must be rated by TTT.
I don't keep my Bris files for more than a couple weeks, but will find somewhere to store them now. I do have everything from Jan 1st of this year on. I went through SA--like I said--NADA.
Now here are my results of my simple "screen" @ Aqueduct:

- JAN 1 THRU JAN 10 AQUEDUCT

- THEE TOP THREE -TOP RATED / TRAINER MIN 15% WIN YR

*PLAYABLE RACES = 35 - WINS = 16 - WIN = 45%

*WAGERED = $70.00 RETURNED = $124.90

*ROI = $1.78 AVG MUTUAL = $7.80

There was a $30 winner, $17, $11.80, $8.40, $8.30, $8.10....also six winners under $4.00.

My only real point here is--

#1--like every method, be it paper and pencil--simple software, or the most bad-ass DEEP BLUE, HAL, WATSON, ARIMAA....nothing even comes CLOSE to working at every track.

#2--I plan to continue this method (with conditional betting) on a week-by-week basis, until it's profitability ceases.

#3--I've found that the more "filters" one adds--the closer you get to the favorite. The only other filter I would recommend is an Odds filter.
Wish I could sit and look at tote-boards all day--but you can make conditional bets. 2-1 @ 0 MTP seems like a good place to start--10 of the 16 winners paid $5.00+. Wish I had kept track of EVERY selection--not just the winners---that way I could get a quick glimpse of AVG LOSER'S ODDS,ETC. Yeah, I know there's a long way to get this info ...I want the quick way :D

I'll report back at the end of the week. Green, or anyone else care to give this a try at your home track and report--please do

-NCG

Are you just using the top horse or using a horse rated on top by a certain margin (ie 5 points or more). I will try it and report.

[green80]

I will say all 25 winners were conditioned races, Mdn, nw2, nw3, nw4

[NorCalGreg]

Are you just using the top horse or using a horse rated on top by a certain margin (ie 5 points or more). I will try it and report.

Just the Top Rated horse, green-- with the Trainer filter....nothing else. I did notice, after the fact, I tossed a nice winner because of the 5-horse rating requirement. There were initially 5 rated horses--one was scratched--so by the letter of the rule, passed the race. What I also noted, there were very few--to none--winners tossed whose Trainers didn't meet the 15% filter.

Your track may be different---some tracks ,sometimes hard to find any trainers with what's considered a gaudy D Wayne Lucas-like 15%+ win record.

At Aqueduct--you can't swing a dead cat without hitting a 15% trainer.

later
-NCG

[green80]

ok, I ran Delta from 1/1 and the results are as follows

JAN 1 THRU JAN 13 Delta

- THEE TOP THREE -TOP RATED / TRAINER MIN 15% WIN YR

*PLAYABLE RACES = 42 - WINS = 16 - WIN = 38%

*WAGERED = $84.00 RETURNED = $77.60

*ROI = $0.92 AVG MUTUAL = $4.85

with 2 to 1 minimum odds:
15 horses out of the 45 plays went off at 2/1 or better, 3 wins for $30.00

I will update when I get a bigger sample.

[NorCalGreg]

Yeah I actually ran a couple Delta days from Dec Bris files I still had--in those 2 days could see the "Bro" was in full effect. In those 2 days, I found 11 plays, 4 wins as follows

Dec 22
2ND :10: XXX
5TH :3: $5.00
6TH :1: XXX
7TH :5: $6.80
8TH :7: $3.80
9TH :5: XXX

Dec 23

2ND :8: $3.80
6TH :10: XXX
7TH :1: XXX
8TH :7: XXX
9TH :10: XXX

I had to leave for a bit after that, but I could see where it was going. About 35% winners, and a small loss. Eliminating the short prices @ Delta would probably mean passing most of the races KB dominates, you think?

You plan on looking at AQ for awhile, green? If so, here are the plays for tomorrow I have, of course you may play a little differently. I'm still planning on putting a condition--but will go with 8/5 @ 0 MTP, and see if ROI improves any. I'll touch bases with you later--

5TH :1a: GUYANA 4-1
7TH :7: POWERNAP 3-1
8TH :5: CLOTHES FALL OFF 8/5
9TH :10: RICH DALONE 7/2

-NCG

[green80]

5TH GUYANA 4-1 ………………3rd
7TH POWERNAP 3-1…………….5.70 win
8TH CLOTHES FALL OFF 8/5…..3.80 win
9TH RICH DALONE 7/2………….2nd beaten by an 85/1 shot

still making money, I may have to start betting AQU

[NorCalGreg]

I don't like the looks of today's AQ play--all CHALK.

-- here goes:

2ND :5: JADE MAGIC 6/5

4TH :7: MIDNITE CHAMPAGNE 8/5

5TH :5: ALLITERATION 2-1

7TH :5: FRANKY AND JANE 8/5

8TH :2: SWELL 8/5

Was looking at some screens and other spot plays etc, in an effort to find the strongest plays. I'll explain more later...but with what little research I did on this tonight-- ALLITERATION looks to be the strongest bet of the bunch--be even better @ 5-1.
We'll see
-NCG

[green80]

I don't like the looks of today's AQ play--all CHALK.

-- here goes:

2ND :5: JADE MAGIC 6/5

4TH :7: MIDNITE CHAMPAGNE 8/5

5TH :5: ALLITERATION 2-1

7TH :5: FRANKY AND JANE 8/5

8TH :2: SWELL 8/5

Was looking at some screens and other spot plays etc, in an effort to find the strongest plays. I'll explain more later...but with what little research I did on this tonight-- ALLITERATION looks to be the strongest bet of the bunch--be even better @ 5-1.
We'll see
-NCG


Just about doubled your money today, not a bad day. Usually happens when you don't like the card.

[NorCalGreg]

2ND :1: UPGRADE 6-1

3RD :5: ROYAL POSSE 8/5

7TH :5: SON OF A GENERAL 6-1

9TH :9: STORM PURSUIT 5/2

[NorCalGreg]

Still using THEE TOP THREE --so thought you would like an update, as I've gotten a few pm's about the program. I did a "live" demo on the HTW thread today (2/21) of the program--betting actual money. Had 3 winners in 5-6 races, and one $5 exacta. Made a good profit

Here's the method I use for everyday playing the races "live".....look at the top rated horses, then look to see which ones are going DOWN in class. Then check, in this order--if there is a large gap in the rating, from #1 to #2, Trainer/jockey combo, whether your horse is top-prime power, top speed points, and top EPS. If near the top on those--you have a bet. It's a judgement call--if the horse is top EPS by alot, or has a huge gap to the 2nd horse in TTT rating, or a big gap in speed points--all these are positives and can lead to a good bet. You just need to get familiar with what a good looking TTT horse looks like. With a little practice, you'll see it at a glance.

Go take a look at today's Oaklawn activities on the HTW thread. It's hard to pick horses in advance--trust me on that--much easier when you can see the betting, etc.

One last thing---when purchasing ANY software--if the proprietor won't send you a sample printout from the track of your choice--won't let you "try it before you buy it", etc....there is a reason. That reason is usually because if you tried it---you WOULDN'T BUY IT.

I recently fell for one of these clowns' crappy program----it's called HORSENSE...from some guy named Joe Mainardi. He had a glowing report from some paid shill, in the PRN newsletter. It's an old DOS based program, from the 90's it appears. The guy says he's constantly updating, yet upon installation- the first thing you get is an error message.
Check his little pamphlet---it's actually explained how to work around that error.
The man has YEARS to fix this! He offers a refund if you can prove to him, with an extensive documented workout--the program wasn't a winner. He will then go over your workout, and if he agrees--he will refund your money. That's what he says, anyway.

I didn't like this program at all---from the installation on. I just deleted it and took it as a lesson learned.
Thanks Joe---for the lesson in buying software. Hope you enjoy the money you got from me. By the way, I got it at the "deeply discounted" price of $69--hahahahaha...$9 dollars is what it's worth.

In my opinion--this is junk--DO NOT BUT THIS AT ANY PRICE. If anyone else bought this--and was in some way happy with it---please respond. Joe--just continue hiding out and do what you do, selling crap . You wouldnt dare come on here to rebut this.

other than that--everything's just ducky :)

-NCG

[green80]

I too tried horsesense a while back. In most races it would not even generate a play.

[green80]

Hey NorCalGreg, how about a review of the pops/tips software you use. I have heard about it for years but have never seen a review.
(http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/member.php?u=206610)

[ebcorde]

I too tried horsesense a while back. In most races it would not even generate a play.

I think I went to a seminar of his about 10-12 years ago at Del mar.

[NorCalGreg]

Hey NorCalGreg, how about a review of the pops/tips software you use. I have heard about it for years but have never seen a review.
(http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/member.php?u=206610)


Here's the deal with the TIPS program ---it's only available through RPM, at the ridiculous price of $300.00. That is what I paid, because I really wanted the TIPS methodology on software, after basically learning how to handicap with the paper/pencil method.
I did a search long time ago--on TIPS software, and believe it or not, lead me to this very site. The time was around 2005, I think. The programmer, Len C, was here on site answering questions. Do a search & check it out.

Another reason for the non-review...if you don't already know the methodology and concept--the software is a big fat waste of time (and money)

You can order the p&p method for $60.00 from the late creator's son, Jon Worth, he's got a site up.

http://www.worthhandicapping.com/Tom_Worth_Publishing_Co_Handicapping_Horse_Races.h tml

EDIT: One thing I didn't mention about TIPS--you can do endless research on angles, spot plays, etc. I'm currently researching horses that have a tip called FAST HIDDEN WORK OUT. It can alert you to horses that ran a sub 24 second last quarter. A $48 horse popped up @ GGF yesterday, with this tip.

-NCG

[dartman51]

Here's the deal with the TIPS program ---it's only available through RPM, at the ridiculous price of $300.00. That is what I paid, because I really wanted the TIPS methodology on software, after basically learning how to handicap with the paper/pencil method.
I did a search long time ago--on TIPS software, and believe it or not, lead me to this very site. The time was around 2005, I think. The programmer, Len C, was here on site answering questions. Do a search & check it out.

Another reason for the non-review...if you don't already know the methodology and concept--the software is a big fat waste of time (and money)

You can order the p&p method for $60.00 from the late creator's son, Jon Worth, he's got a site up.

http://www.worthhandicapping.com/Tom_Worth_Publishing_Co_Handicapping_Horse_Races.h tml

EDIT: One thing I didn't mention about TIPS--you can do endless research on angles, spot plays, etc. I'm currently researching horses that have a tip called FAST HIDDEN WORK OUT. It can alert you to horses that ran a sub 24 second last quarter. A $48 horse popped up @ GGF yesterday, with this tip.

-NCG

As a matter of fact, there were two horses in that race with the HWO tip, the :3: and the :4: , they finished 1, 2. The exacta paid $211.40 :cool:

[dartman51]

As a matter of fact, there were two horses in that race with the HWO tip, the :3: and the :4: , they finished 1, 2. The exacta paid $211.40 :cool:

I'm sorry, got ahead of myself. Only 1 FHWO, that was the 3. But the 3 and the 4 had the HWO tip.

[NorCalGreg]

As a matter of fact, there were two horses in that race with the HWO tip, the :3: and the :4: , they finished 1, 2. The exacta paid $211.40 :cool:

Good lookin' out, dart---didn't know you were a tips man :ThmbUp:

[dartman51]

Good lookin' out, dart---didn't know you were a tips man :ThmbUp:


When I'm not too busy, I pull up the software and, like you, I look for certain TIPS. Mostly, races with just 1 or 2 HWO horses, preferably just 1. And look for the FHWO horse, which, as you know, aren't that plentiful. I agree with you, if you tried to play the software's selections, you would go broke. When I first got the program, I spent a lot of time with it and tweaked the values of the TIPS, and got it to work pretty good at TAMPA, for 1 meet, and part of the way through another, before it went south. It was too labor intensive to research and tweak the TIPS, so I just found 2 or 3 that I can use for spots. :ThmbUp:

[dartman51]

You can catch some nice prices with the N-UDB TIP, also. :ThmbUp:

[ebcorde]

Here's the deal with the TIPS program ---it's only available through RPM, at the ridiculous price of $300.00. That is what I paid, because I really wanted the TIPS methodology on software, after basically learning how to handicap with the paper/pencil method.
I did a search long time ago--on TIPS software, and believe it or not, lead me to this very site. The time was around 2005, I think. The programmer, Len C, was here on site answering questions. Do a search & check it out.

Another reason for the non-review...if you don't already know the methodology and concept--the software is a big fat waste of time (and money)

You can order the p&p method for $60.00 from the late creator's son, Jon Worth, he's got a site up.

http://www.worthhandicapping.com/Tom_Worth_Publishing_Co_Handicapping_Horse_Races.h tml

EDIT: One thing I didn't mention about TIPS--you can do endless research on angles, spot plays, etc. I'm currently researching horses that have a tip called FAST HIDDEN WORK OUT. It can alert you to horses that ran a sub 24 second last quarter. A $48 horse popped up @ GGF yesterday, with this tip.

-NCG

It can alert you to horses that ran a sub 24 second last quarter.

This got me thinking on a idea I tried last year that did not pan out, came out at it from a different angle and you may be right. Only 1/2 day of testing (1am to now) and it's A-Okay so far. Good for selecting singles and throw outs. I'm not doing the FAST HIDDEN WORK OUT YET, I apply it to races at each call. So far it SEEMS to reveal whose most likely to win at the distance or who to throw out. Great for a snapshot look instead of looking at each call time.

I also use BRIS $1. I found a another BRIS bug, took 1 hour to find a workaround. That's 3 bugs found so far and they'll never fix it. I stopped calling them about it.


Back to testing.

[upthecreek]

When I'm not too busy, I pull up the software and, like you, I look for certain TIPS. Mostly, races with just 1 or 2 HWO horses, preferably just 1. And look for the FHWO horse, which, as you know, aren't that plentiful. I agree with you, if you tried to play the software's selections, you would go broke. When I first got the program, I spent a lot of time with it and tweaked the values of the TIPS, and got it to work pretty good at TAMPA, for 1 meet, and part of the way through another, before it went south. It was too labor intensive to research and tweak the TIPS, so I just found 2 or 3 that I can use for spots. :ThmbUp:
2 seasons ago @Tam I did a 200+ race study I lumped together the FWO,F-10 & FHWO tips together and only found the winner had the tip 22% of the time,whereas it had the IA tip 46% and the NNSL/NSL tip 43% of the time

[NorCalGreg]

It can alert you to horses that ran a sub 24 second last quarter.

This got me thinking on a idea I tried last year that did not pan out, came out at it from a different angle and you may be right. Only 1/2 day of testing (1am to now) and it's A-Okay so far. Good for selecting singles and throw outs. I'm not doing the FAST HIDDEN WORK OUT YET, I apply it to races at each call. So far it SEEMS to reveal whose most likely to win at the distance or who to throw out. Great for a snapshot look instead of looking at each call time.

I also use BRIS $1. I found a another BRIS bug, took 1 hour to find a workaround. That's 3 bugs found so far and they'll never fix it. I stopped calling them about it.


Back to testing.

You have more patience than I, eb......I gave up trying to call Bris about ANYTHING.
They're a perfect example of complacency in a company that's on top--and sees no reason to update, improve, and STAY ON TOP.

One day soon, a smaller, more dynamic company will take them on--and Bris will become K-MART.

For proof, just look at their 1990's era website---old information, dead links, failure to upgrade even the simplest areas.

Rest on your laurels if you insist, Bris---but keep an eye on your rear-view mirror.

[NorCalGreg]

2 seasons ago @Tam I did a 200+ race study I lumped together the FWO,F-10 & FHWO tips together and only found the winner had the tip 22% of the time,whereas it had the IA tip 46% and the NNSL/NSL tip 43% of the time

Here's something I came up with---knowing the tips that should show a top effort is imminent (NSL, FWO, IA, FH+)--they usually find a well-meant, well-bet horse.

The real value was in finding horses that scored highly--but ran up the track. It doesn't add up--something's amiss.....that horse should have run better.

So adding these "suspicious" efforts to my stable mail--and there are a ton of them..has proven to be very interesting. More than one has come back and RUN THE RACE THEY SHOULD HAVE RUN PREVIOUSLY.

Just something to think about, 'creek.

[ebcorde]

You have more patience than I, eb......I gave up trying to call Bris about ANYTHING.
They're a perfect example of complacency in a company that's on top--and sees no reason to update, improve, and STAY ON TOP.

One day soon, a smaller, more dynamic company will take them on--and Bris will become K-MART.

For proof, just look at their 1990's era website---old information, dead links, failure to upgrade even the simplest areas.

Rest on your laurels if you insist, Bris---but keep an eye on your rear-view mirror.

I'm not patient at all. I tried this idea out and it's working caught the 7 at MVC in R4, 8 in R#, and two seconds. Now I played this 1 in R6.

PS HOLY FOOGING SHEET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THE 1 WON. 3 WAS MY SECOND CHOICE TOO.

THANKS MAN, YOU DID THAT BY POSTING I TOOK THAT WORKOUT 24 SECOND AND APPLIED IT TO THE 3 CALL TIMES. SUBTRACT 3 FORM 2 , AND 2 FROM 1 TO GET THE DIFF. MY FASTEST BETWEEN 4F-2F WAS 1-3-8-12. i BET 1,3

[upthecreek]

You have more patience than I, eb......I gave up trying to call Bris about ANYTHING.
They're a perfect example of complacency in a company that's on top--and sees no reason to update, improve, and STAY ON TOP.

One day soon, a smaller, more dynamic company will take them on--and Bris will become K-MART.

For proof, just look at their 1990's era website---old information, dead links, failure to upgrade even the simplest areas.

Rest on your laurels if you insist, Bris---but keep an eye on your rear-view mirror.
I doubt if it will happen anytime soon,at least for data files I've been bitching for years to TM,they won't put saddle cloth #'s in their data files and so most of my software considers all the horses scratched

[NorCalGreg]

I'm not patient at all. I tried this idea out and it's working caught the 7 at MVC in R4, 8 in R#, and two seconds. Now I played this 1 in R6.

PS HOLY FOOGING SHEET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THE 1 WON. 3 WAS MY SECOND CHOICE TOO.

THANKS MAN, YOU DID THAT BY POSTING I TOOK THAT WORKOUT 24 SECOND AND APPLIED IT TO THE 3 CALL TIMES. SUBTRACT 3 FORM 2 , AND 2 FROM 1 TO GET THE DIFF. MY FASTEST BETWEEN 4F-2F WAS 1-3-8-12. i BET 1,3


Great. eb! I'm really just recently heavily into studying the "sub .24 second" phenomenon (if you can call it that)...and finding some very promising results as well. It's almost an entirely new handicapping genre, or subset.

[NorCalGreg]

Great. eb! I'm really just recently heavily into studying the "sub .24 second" phenomenon (if you can call it that)...and finding some very promising results as well. It's almost an entirely new handicapping genre, or subset.


The "sub .24 second" Tip continues to rock on--you don't need the TIPS program to find these---just look at the quarter-splits--or last furlong-- in any race, take the lengths the horse closed (1/5th second = 1 length) and find your sub s4 second closer....I realize this thread has gone way off track---so I'll post the plays on the HTW thread ..a couple winners already today

[ebcorde]

The "sub .24 second" Tip continues to rock on--you don't need the TIPS program to find these---just look at the quarter-splits--or last furlong-- in any race, take the lengths the horse closed (1/5th second = 1 length) and find your sub s4 second closer....I realize this thread has gone way off track---so I'll post the plays on the HTW thread ..a couple winners already today

did you see that Last race at MVC. and did you get my message?

[Red Knave]

I recently fell for one of these clowns' crappy program----it's called HORSENSE...from some guy named Joe Mainardi.
I didn't like this program at all---from the installation on. I just deleted it and took it as a lesson learned.
He has posted here on PA as Mainardi. You might want to pm him if you have an issue with his software.

[mikesal57]

He has posted here on PA as Mainardi. You might want to pm him if you have an issue with his software.

3 posts in 6 years...I'm sure he's waiting for a PM... :lol:

[NorCalGreg]

3 posts in 6 years...I'm sure he's waiting for a PM... :lol:

Hey.....I pm'ed this guy every day for 6 years--now it says his mailbox is full!

Okay, I'm making up stories, now.....Joe Mainardi---if you can hear me (hear me?)....I didn't much care for your program--and furthermore, your refund policy doesn't install confidence in you, or your company (btw---you're business license has expired--according to public records)

This is my opinion only--which as a free, taxpaying American--I have that right.

You, sir....are free to offer a rebuttal. If you'd rather not, I understand. I've heard from 2 people about HORSESENSE..this was their opinion :ThmbDown:

Other than that---enjoy your evening :)

-NCG

[mikesal57]

Hey.....I pm'ed this guy every day for 6 years--now it says his mailbox is full!

Okay, I'm making up stories, now.....Joe Mainardi---if you can hear me (hear me?)....I didn't much care for your program--and furthermore, your refund policy doesn't install confidence in you, or your company (btw---you're business license has expired--according to public records)

This is my opinion only--which as a free, taxpaying American--I have that right.

You, sir....are free to offer a rebuttal. If you'd rather not, I understand. I've heard from 2 people about HORSESENSE..this was their opinion :ThmbDown:

Other than that---enjoy your evening :)

-NCG

3 posts in 6 years...I'm sure he's going to answer this one too... :lol:

[ReplayRandall]

3 posts in 6 years...I'm sure he's going to answer this one too... :lol:

He's eating $69 worth of pizza and beer, while lurking at NCG's rants.... :lol:

Sorry Greg, I just couldn't resist since I know you paid the "discounted" price.

[mikesal57]

Just to let you guys know Handifast is still going strong...

Race 4...#7 $33.60
Race 5...#7 $21.00
Race 7...#6 $12.60

[NorCalGreg]

Just to let you guys know Handifast is still going strong...

Race 4...#7 $33.60
Race 5...#7 $21.00
Race 7...#6 $12.60


Handifast? That still around? :D

[plainolebill]

Greg, In your experience would TTT be useful for finding contenders to go against? For instance if a favorite comes up weaker than it should be or absent altogether from Thee Top Three list. In other words using the program to eliminate low priced horses and looking for longshots.

I bought TTT but haven't fired it up yet.

I also bought Mainardi's program but having read the a thread or two about it and understanding the user interface was seriously clunky before ordering it, I have no one to blame but myself.

Bill

[NorCalGreg]

Greg, In your experience would TTT be useful for finding contenders to go against? For instance if a favorite comes up weaker than it should be or absent altogether from Thee Top Three list. In other words using the program to eliminate low priced horses and looking for longshots.

I bought TTT but haven't fired it up yet.

I also bought Mainardi's program but having read the a thread or two about it and understanding the user interface was seriously clunky before ordering it, I have no one to blame but myself.

Bill

Yep, bill--only ourselves to blame for ordering it. :(

As far as TTT...there are 7-8 important categories I look at---don't really see any auto-toss outs, except the obvious that comes with your normal handicapping. Here's a good tip--look for horses with a GAP of 3-5 pts in TTT rating, to the 2nd horse---that's an obvious given. Now also--look at EARNINGS PER START and SPEED POINTS, for a large gap.
I happened to spot SECRET WISHES-turf paradise Sat--that had about a 4pt gap. She had some other positives, of course--but it was a pretty easy pick for an $8.00 payoff.

Good luck bill

-NCG

[green80]

I have found that I get better results at some tracks using the top horse in the Prime Power column instead of the TTT rating. Every now and then you can catch a bomb using PP. You just have to try to see what is working at the track you are playing now.

TTT is worth the money to me if only for the view card page where you can sort the races by what ever values you choose. The entire card at a glance.

[ReplayRandall]

Now also--look at EARNINGS PER START and SPEED POINTS, for a large gap.-NCG

I don't use the programs you are using, but you should look at earnings per start at today's TRACK, also EPS at today's distance.....BTW, watch replays of the those races(track+distance) for further clarity.

[NorCalGreg]

I don't use the programs you are using, but you should look at earnings per start at today's TRACK, also EPS at today's distance.....BTW, watch replays of the those races(track+distance) for further clarity.

Unfortunately, this program doesn't calculate EPS-TODAY'S DISTANCE. I try to stay away from 7F races, just for that reason. You bring up a good longshot angle, Randall.....horses that look to be in poor form, suddenly entered in a 7F race---and lo and behold, they show a sparkling EPS @ 7F.

For TTT newbies, some picks I came up with, using TTT- for today:

DELTA
7TH-- :8: SWEET RICHTER 4-1
8TH-- :3: :5: EXACTA BOX

--GPX--4TH 2-1 STRAIGHT EXACTA

--PENN
1ST :4: OUR LOVE AFFAIR 4-1
2ND :6: METTEMARLAMELVA 9/2
5TH :7: KID ROLLINS 6-1
8TH :1: SPEEDING TRAIN 4-1

--TAMPA 3RD :5: SHE'S COOL 5/2

[green80]

Unfortunately, this program doesn't calculate EPS-TODAY'S DISTANCE. I try to stay away from 7F races, just for that reason. You bring up a good longshot angle, Randall.....horses that look to be in poor form, suddenly entered in a 7F race---and lo and behold, they show a sparkling EPS @ 7F.

For TTT newbies, some picks I came up with, using TTT- for today:

DELTA
7TH-- :8: SWEET RICHTER 4-1
8TH-- :3: :5: EXACTA BOX

--GPX--4TH 2-1 STRAIGHT EXACTA

--PENN
1ST :4: OUR LOVE AFFAIR 4-1
2ND :6: METTEMARLAMELVA 9/2
5TH :7: KID ROLLINS 6-1
8TH :1: SPEEDING TRAIN 4-1

--TAMPA 3RD :5: SHE'S COOL 5/2

nothing works at Delta

[NorCalGreg]

nothing works at Delta


Oh I'm working on a method as we speak, that will BURN DELTA DOWN!

Okay....I tend to embellish a little--the method's looking good in testing, so far--hit a nice winner @ Delta.

It's not TTT-related, so check the HTW board if interested.

later

-NCG

[green80]

are tonights Delta picks the new method?

[NorCalGreg]

Dont know if this is gonna come correctly--but I scanned the 7th @ TUP to show TTT doesn't just nail favorites. SHEZAMOVER was a 10 pt gap in TTT Rating--was 10-1 ML, 22% Trainer, Top EPS---an AUTO-SELECTION. They don't always win--but the rare times you see something like this--you gotta try to crush it. If $10 is your PRIME BET ...this is prime bet material


3 -SHEZAMOVER $37.40 $10.20 $7.00
7 -MARCENIA $4.60 $4.80
1 -STRICTLY CLASSY $4.20

[NorCalGreg]

HOUSTON

6TH :3: MACH FIVE 6-1

9TH :9: MINI MINE MO 9/2

MVR

4TH ABRA 5-1

PARX

3RD :5: CONSUELA 8/5

6TH :1: YOLO MON 3-1

ALSO--EXACTA :1: OVER :7: , :2:

good luck

🎲NCG

[NorCalGreg]

I've never really paid much attention to the column: "TRACK POINTS" . I just assumed it was a "Horse-for-course" kind of rating---was actually thinking a "HORSES FOR DISTANCE" or a distance specialist rating--would be of more use.

Anyway...noticed a while back that a lot of horses seemed to win--that were high up in track points. So I've been keeping an eye on it, and yesterday @ Parx the top rated TRACK POINTS horses went on a longshot binge.

Even though some were ignored by bettors--they still weren't without some positives. But just wanted to say--when you go about your capping---take a look at that rating--if the horse is on top, and figures with some basic handicapping--you may have a sweet play.

Just for the heck of it today--I went back to Parx--found a horse @ 10-1 that topped the track points--and figured to have a decent chance on basic handicapping.
That horse was FORTY NINE WATTS---SHE PAID $18.00

The others are below. I just got off the phone with Mike, the TTT proprietor--he says he has an update just about to go out to everyone--so make sure he has your correct e-mail address.

He would rather you e-mail if possible, instead of calling..but he'll still take your call if it can't wait.--NCG

info@theetopthree.com

EDIT: Forgot to mention--the reason I called Mike was to clarify what "track points" are---he said they indicate a horse that has been competing @ a higher lever track, than todays. They get a lot of shippers from NY, so that sounds like a logical reason. Some tracks, I've noticed --have almost NO variation in track points--NCG

[NorCalGreg]

Running out of room here--forgot this little gem @ Indiana.

Wasn't just top track points...was top TTT rated, and top speed points.

Amaoldfashiondgirl paid $54.60 to win.

[NorCalGreg]

KEEN 3RD #4 RUSTICANA 10-1 --Top Rated, Top Track Points

KEEN 8TH #7 LILLY'S DREAM 12-1 Top-3 rated, highest track points, only horse in the race w/ 5 recency points, 2nd EPS, decent connections

TAMP 8TH :6: - :1: cold exacta

TAMP 9TH #3 VERGER 8-1 top ranked, top EPS, top track points.


good luck


-NCG

[mikesal57]

KEEN 3RD #4 RUSTICANA 10-1 --Top Rated, Top Track Points

KEEN 8TH #7 LILLY'S DREAM 12-1 Top-3 rated, highest track points, only horse in the race w/ 5 recency points, 2nd EPS, decent connections

TAMP 8TH :6: - :1: cold exacta

TAMP 9TH #3 VERGER 8-1 top ranked, top EPS, top track points.


good luck


-NCG



Dam Greg....everywhere I look I see your posts...

I think its time to change the name of PA to...Gregs Place :lol:

Anyway, most people get excited when they think they found an edge...GL this time

[NorCalGreg]

When you TTT users get the new update---just click on it---it's already programmed to go right into the TTT program.

The new IMPROVING box is a nice addition...especially when you have a horse dropping in class---AND IMPROVING.

Also...one of Mike's best spot play is noted for you--with an asterisk next to the name--as in the horse below GIVEITMYBESTSHOT

I circled the asterisk so you can see it--you have to be in print mode to see it. You don't have to print it--just go to print mode.

The next one--since I'm such a know it all---is MY best TTT bet for the day--BEAR LINFINI

These are both from today's Mountaineer card.

So there you have it--two solid best bets free of charge.

Your TTT update is coming soon, if you don't already have it.

NCG☮

[Dave Schwartz]

NCG,

Do I understand correctly that "Review of The Top Three Software" is YOUR review of the software YOU produced?

[mikesal57]

NCG,

Do I understand correctly that "Review of The Top Three Software" is YOUR review of the software YOU produced?


Greg pulled this one out of his bag of sh*t to review Dave..he did not produce it..

TheeTopThree.Com

[Flysofree]

Greg or anyone familiar with this program..What does it tend to "key" off of?
Spreed figures, Prime Power or Bris Class figures or can you tell what the default is weighted to mostly?
I haven't used TTT, but have noticed with software sometimes I can see, after using it forawhile, what it considers the most important.

[NorCalGreg]

NCG,

Do I understand correctly that "Review of The Top Three Software" is YOUR review of the software YOU produced?

You've now addressed me twice recently (and I wouldn't call it "friendly")...about my posts on this board concerning software that, quite frankly isn't yours.

I have software I've produced---this is not it. There are quite a few members of this board who use this program, myself included. I know the program proprietor...he actually is a member here and participated in the Derby Wars contest this past weekend. I'm not a "shill" and the owner has never even posted here.



Any further questions....see my attorney mikesal

[NorCalGreg]

Greg or anyone familiar with this program..What does it tend to "key" off of?
Spreed figures, Prime Power or Bris Class figures or can you tell what the default is weighted to mostly?
I haven't used TTT, but have noticed with software sometimes I can see, after using it forawhile, what it considers the most important.

No, it's not a speed or class or pace program, although it has ratings for all that. Probably the best thing about it....it has it's own rating total. Everyone has PrimePower--that's so overbet it's almost worthless. If you find any good rating the general public doesn't have--you may have an edge. I use the TTT rating to make a value line.

*One other thing, FlysoFree....the program costs less than $40

-NCG

[Flysofree]

No, it's not a speed or class or pace program, although it has ratings for all that. Probably the best thing about it....it has it's own rating total. Everyone has PrimePower--that's so overbet it's almost worthless. If you find any good rating the general public doesn't have--you may have an edge. I use the TTT rating to make a value line.

*One other thing, FlysoFree....the program costs less than $40

-NCG

Thanks..One final question: Can you scratch a horse and get an updated Rating?

[NorCalGreg]

Thanks..One final question: Can you scratch a horse and get an updated Rating?

Nope....that's one thing you can't do.

[Speed Figure]

Nope....that's one thing you can't do.
The software won't let you scratch horses?

[NorCalGreg]

The software won't let you scratch horses?

No....we just got updates but if you can now scratch a horse--I haven't found out how. Maybe that's next.

LOL...I had a different software program--don't even remember what it was called.

I couldn't figure out how to scratch a horse--they had a number so I called it....the man said:

"Okay, this is how we handle scratches---after you print it out---find the scratched horse----and draw a line through it"

[Flysofree]

No....we just got updates but if you can now scratch a horse--I haven't found out how. Maybe that's next.

LOL...I had a different software program--don't even remember what it was called.

I couldn't figure out how to scratch a horse--they had a number so I called it....the man said:

"Okay, this is how we handle scratches---after you print it out---find the scratched horse----and draw a line through it"

I was told that same thing on a program that I won't mention. LOL..

[Dave Schwartz]

You've now addressed me twice recently (and I wouldn't call it "friendly")...about my posts on this board concerning software that, quite frankly isn't yours.


It was not meant argumentatively. Sorry that it was received that way.

When I saw your post which included the quote below, I thought it was your software.




Your TTT update is coming soon, if you don't already have it.

NCG☮

[NorCalGreg]

No problem :ThmbUp:

[mikesal57]

Any further questions....see my attorney mikesal


And I'll take this one on for free :lol:

[mikesal57]

Hey Greg...

Why don't you try out Handifast...

Its not a difficult program and you have the files already...

Plus Handi might create a User Group....

Mike

[mikesal57]

O NO...what did I just do :bang:

[green80]

O NO...what did I just do :bang:

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

You've now addressed me twice recently (and I wouldn't call it "friendly")...about my posts on this board concerning software that, quite frankly isn't yours.

I have software I've produced---this is not it. There are quite a few members of this board who use this program, myself included. I know the program proprietor...he actually is a member here and participated in the Derby Wars contest this past weekend. I'm not a "shill" and the owner has never even posted here.



Any further questions....see my attorney mikesalIf you know the program proprietor, then I would kindly ask you to STOP promoting it on this board. Moderators take note please. And yes, you're definitely PROMOTING the software...even going so far as to let people know when updates are rolling out... :rolleyes:

Admitting you know the guy who markets this software was a big mistake. This entire thread now reads as nothing but a GIANT SHILL, which you proclaim NOT to be.... :lol:

I love how you called the thread a "Quick Review" though...truth in advertising.... :faint: :lol:

[mikesal57]

If you know the program proprietor, then I would kindly ask you to STOP promoting it on this board. Moderators take note please. And yes, you're definitely PROMOTING the software...even going so far as to let people know when updates are rolling out... :rolleyes:

Admitting you know the guy who markets this software was a big mistake. This entire thread now reads as nothing but a GIANT SHILL, which you proclaim NOT to be.... :lol:

I love how you called the thread a "Quick Review" though...truth in advertising.... :faint: :lol:


Come on PA....you went a little too far on NCG

We all know how Greg can rant on any subject and when he begins something
it goes on and on and on at any extant....

So he picked up a new toy and started playing with it ..big deal!!!

You called him a shill because he contacted the owner to get ideas and help on the product....So what we all do it ....thats Greg to a tee...he'll talk to anyone and everyone....

In the past I bought New Pace from Dave Schwarts and contacted him and posted stuff on this board....are you going to say that we are best friends and I'm a Shill???

Give him a break

Mike

[PaceAdvantage]

He says he knows the program proprietor.

He posts the price of the program. He touts it...he tells you you're gonna get upgrades soon...the thread went from a quick review to this pretty massive promotional item...

Then he says the owner of the program is a member of this board...really?

Interesting I say.

Listen, I have PAYING advertisers here. I'm sure most of them would like to get someone they know to create huge threads with over 17,000 views for free...touting their program.

What exactly IS the purpose of this thread? Maybe this is just me being my regular old-self dumb ass...so go ahead and school me...

Why has this thread become what it has become...and why is it no longer just a "Quick Review?"

[mikesal57]

What exactly IS the purpose of this thread?
Why has this thread become what it has become...and why is it no longer just a "Quick Review?"

This is the "Software Section" isnt it?

its no different than any other software review thread....

Its past the " Quick Review " because its NCG ...what else can I say...

If someone had a problem with it ( we all know who it is) than tough...

they cant have the lime light all the time... :lol:

Mike

[PaceAdvantage]

This is the "Software Section" isnt it?

its no different than any other software review thread....

Its past the " Quick Review " because its NCG ...what else can I say...

If someone had a problem with it ( we all know who it is) than tough...

they cant have the lime light all the time... :lol:

MikeIn the grand scheme of things, Dave hardly posts, if that's who are referring to...so at least TRY to remain objective.

[NorCalGreg]

In the grand scheme of things, Dave hardly posts, if that's who are referring to...so at least TRY to remain objective.

I think we're trying to remain objective...but you didn't seem to care a whit about this thread, until Dave posted. Now you're all up in arms about it.

Most people don't know I did a review of WAGER-MATE...Dave posted some objection to it, and it was quickly deleted.

I spent two hours on that---two wasted hours it turns out.

Okay message received--this TTT thread is done. As others have said to you recently, PA Mike---if you'd prefer I don't post here, let me know.

-NCG

[mikesal57]

I think we're trying to remain objective...but you didn't seem to care a whit about this thread, until Dave posted. Now you're all up in arms about it.

Most people don't know I did a review of WAGER-MATE...Dave posted some objection to it, and it was quickly deleted.

I spent two hours on that---two wasted hours it turns out.

Okay message received--this TTT thread is done. As others have said to you recently, PA Mike---if you'd prefer I don't post here, let me know.

-NCG


NCG...

You didn't do anything wrong here, you just got bamboozled by the sites most prominent business man ( and now bully) .
Your incites on a particular piece of software had interest by me and more than enough people. All you were doing is what anyone would do, try to make a profit. They took your post and twisted it into something that wasn't true and forced a breech of the boards policy on you. What a shame.

I'm sorry , and a few others too , that you said you won't post in this thread anymore ...so they won this one???...

My suggestion is to join the Handifast (FREE PROGRAM!!) thread and do your stuff ...

Let's double the views there !!!!

Mike

[Dave Schwartz]

Wow.

I am blown away by this.

Truly, I asked a simple question because I thought it was appropriate to ask. I did not do it because of some hidden motive.

NCG, I am truly sorry that you think I am out to get you but I will take full responsibility for making you feel that way. Nothing could be further from the truth and I truly apologize.

I just do not know how to say it any more clearly.

[mikesal57]

Wow.

I am blown away by this.

Truly, I asked a simple question because I thought it was appropriate to ask. I did not do it because of some hidden motive.

NCG, I am truly sorry that you think I am out to get you but I will take full responsibility for making you feel that way. Nothing could be further from the truth and I truly apologize.

I just do not know how to say it any more clearly.

The damage is done!!! You You You You...MONSTER

:)

[JimG]

FWIW,

I have enjoyed this thread and did not believe that NorCalGreg was shilling for TTT Software. He seemed like a user that thought it brought some promise.

[Flysofree]

I also enjoyed it.

[mikesal57]

I also enjoyed it.


Me too...

Come on all ......lets get him back!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYsKDaQIX54

[green80]

Wow,

All that for reviewing software on the software thread. We all know what the real story is here.

[mikesal57]

Wow,

All that for reviewing software on the software thread. We all know what the real story is here.


OK guys...we got another shill here.... :lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

I think we're trying to remain objective...but you didn't seem to care a whit about this thread, until Dave posted. Now you're all up in arms about it.

Most people don't know I did a review of WAGER-MATE...Dave posted some objection to it, and it was quickly deleted.

I spent two hours on that---two wasted hours it turns out.

Okay message received--this TTT thread is done. As others have said to you recently, PA Mike---if you'd prefer I don't post here, let me know.

-NCGI prefer everyone post here, including you.

I don't recall the Wager-Mate thread or why it was deleted.

Maybe I was a bit too harsh in this thread, and for that I apology. All I ask is that you keep the promotion stuff out of it...you like it, great. You post some winners with it before the races, even better.

But when it starts coming off like an infomercial, I will likely make a comment. I'm sorry I need paying advertisers to keep this place going. When I moved to a dedicated server a few years ago, my monthly costs for this website skyrocketed, so I need sponsors to justify keeping this site going.

When advertisers who pay me, see other vendors getting what is essentially massive free promotion, then they are going to come to me and say WTF...it's a line I have to walk carefully, and again I apologize if I went too far this time.

[DeltaLover]

I actually purchased this program a few months ago, looked it over....and left it alone up until a few weeks ago. It was a snap to install, uses the Bris $1 single data files...which I buy anyway for another software program.

Upon opening the program, you come to a "tweaking" or program module--I simply by pass that, and click "view card".
What that opens is pretty cool---think of the Bris Summary, on steroids.
Appx 25 columns of sortable info such as:

RATING*PRIME*TRAINERWIN%*JOCKEYWIN%*RECENCYPOINTS* CLASSPOINTS
*EARNINGS*SPEEDPOINTS*PACE/SPEED*FINISHSPEED*BLINKERPOINTS

I mentioned I bypass the tweaking part of the program, but of course you're welcome to tweak away. The most important part to me is the ability to make spot plays--and this is where the Program's value lies--the proprietary "RATING". Unlike Prime Power (which is also included in the program)...everyone has it, and frankly it's overbet to death.

Since we have a lot of Aqueduct players...I'll give a couple examples of how THEE TOP THREE went against Prime Power, and scored. (BTW--I haven't done exhausting research--but I restrict my wagering on this spot play to sprints)
Sunday 12-20
5th RACE 6F CL
6-1 ML TTT HI RATED +3 PERFECT DISCO
$11.40

Can also find exacta plays when 2 horses are rated way higher than any others. A $2 box only costs $4, and sometimes can pay pretty well.
From that same day @ AQ

8TH RACE 6F ALLOW

:5: CAPTAIN SERIOUS 121 1-1
:3: BOND VIGILANTE 121 10-1
:4: JOKING 113 5-1

It's clear in hindsight the play was BOND VIGILANTE to win, but I played it safe and played a $2 exacta box only, and was rewarded with a $48 payoff.

Obviously these plays don't happen all the time...just showing what's possible. You're going to have to do your homework, play around with the program....see if you can find some spot plays, like I did.

Almost forgot the best part---the entire program---nothing else to buy--(except $1 bris data files) is $37.25!!! I e-mailed the gentleman, Mike Perucci, asking what was the deal with the price--he said he's retired now-- that's all he wants for it. I'm thinking about trying to buy the rights to this program--charge 2 or 3 bills a copy--so I CAN RETIRE!.
theetopthree.com I didn't do an actual link, you'll have to cut and paste. You can get a sample free--he does answer e-mail too.

I stopped the Bris Summary since they don't bother to answer e-mail--going to start a "TTT" spot play instead, since Mike attempts to help & answers e-mail.

This "review" is very shallow and offhand at least.

Generic cliche like the following, belong in advertising context rather than in a critical review:


"What that opens is pretty cool---think of the Bris Summary, on steroids."


As a potential user of this piece of software, I would like to see it in action and understand how it differs from its competitors. A youtube view, some screenshots and also some commentary about its handicapping approach, its openness for customization and overall performance are all missing from this review.

[PaceAdvantage]

Wow,

All that for reviewing software on the software thread. We all know what the real story is here.There is no real story.

Dave never came to me privately. The only comment from Dave on this is what I read here.

And I'll say it again. DAVE IS NOT ONE OF THE PAYING ADVERTISERS HERE...I let him post here essentially free of charge because I have liked the guy since I got into the game and started reading his BrainWaves newsletter decades ago.

So I'm definitely not protecting Dave.

And I talk to thaskalos on the phone more often than I talk to Dave on the phone...and I talk to thaskalos maybe once every few months.

So....for all those who think there is some grand conspiracy or whatever else it is you're thinking, you're way off base, as is usual.

I'm basically a lone wolf here...unfortunately...I WISH someone would come along and join up with me and we could all make a boatload of money on this website.

But the reality is, this website barely covers its costs each month in terms of advertising revenue...which is really sad... :lol:

So if the few advertisers I do have see that they are wasting money when they could just get someone to post about their product or service free of charge, then PaceAdvantage will go bye-bye...

[mikesal57]

There is no real story.

Dave never came to me privately. The only comment from Dave on this is what I read here.

And I'll say it again. DAVE IS NOT ONE OF THE PAYING ADVERTISERS HERE...I let him post here essentially free of charge because I have liked the guy since I got into the game and started reading his BrainWaves newsletter decades ago.

So I'm definitely not protecting Dave.

And I talk to thaskalos on the phone more often than I talk to Dave on the phone...and I talk to thaskalos maybe once every few months.

So....for all those who think there is some grand conspiracy or whatever else it is you're thinking, you're way off base, as is usual.

I'm basically a lone wolf here...unfortunately...I WISH someone would come along and join up with me and we could all make a boatload of money on this website.

But the reality is, this website barely covers its costs each month in terms of advertising revenue...which is really sad... :lol:

So if the few advertisers I do have see that they are wasting money when they could just get someone to post about their product or service free of charge, then PaceAdvantage will go bye-bye...


This is my last post on this as its becoming a Dave basher again....

I'm sure your few advertisers are "class" guys and won't say anything but if I was a contributor I would be asking myself why isn't he (Dave) paying ???
He's the most vocal and must be raking in tons of money , from this site , on his products...Hmmm

DONE!!

[PaceAdvantage]

This is my last post on this as its becoming a Dave basher again....

I'm sure your few advertisers are "class" guys and won't say anything but if I was a contributor I would be asking myself why isn't he (Dave) paying ???
He's the most vocal and must be raking in tons of money , from this site , on his products...Hmmm

DONE!!I've already gone too far in talking about my dealings with Dave. Let's just say we have an informal arrangement because I've known him and respected him for decades.

In any event, I thought my apology would put things to bed here, but I guess some people just can't let things go so easily.

[keenang]

P.A.

You hit the nail on the head. You are being your old DUMB ass.
Geno ;)

[porkchop]

Wasn't Swartzs Pace makes the race introduced as free and he wanted imput as to what should be included and then things changed and now it has to be purchased may he should change the name to bait and switch

[mikesal57]

Wasn't Swartzs Pace makes the race introduced as free and he wanted imput as to what should be included and then things changed and now it has to be purchased may he should change the name to bait and switch


yes , we did get the bait and switch here, after many were thrilled about it..

But dont worry ...when the new program comes out....Dave will have a big, big, big, coupon for you guys that cant be matched.... :lol: :lol: :lol:

[green80]

My software pick
Lad 7th #:5: Miss Bonquiqui, will pay chinese money if it wins.

I know this isn't the selection thread but I like to post (shill) on this thread.

[NorCalGreg]

I prefer everyone post here, including you.

I don't recall the Wager-Mate thread or why it was deleted.

Maybe I was a bit too harsh in this thread, and for that I apology. All I ask is that you keep the promotion stuff out of it...you like it, great. You post some winners with it before the races, even better.

But when it starts coming off like an infomercial, I will likely make a comment. I'm sorry I need paying advertisers to keep this place going. When I moved to a dedicated server a few years ago, my monthly costs for this website skyrocketed, so I need sponsors to justify keeping this site going.

When advertisers who pay me, see other vendors getting what is essentially massive free promotion, then they are going to come to me and say WTF...it's a line I have to walk carefully, and again I apologize if I went too far this time.


Since you brought it up, PA Mike.....It's none of my business, I realize, but for a site with a huge amount of page views (yes I looked it up)--a web consultant could monetize this bad boy to the hilt.

[PaceAdvantage]

Since you brought it up, PA Mike.....It's none of my business, I realize, but for a site with a huge amount of page views (yes I looked it up)--a web consultant could monetize this bad boy to the hilt.Anyone looking to make a nice commission on this easy monetization is free to PM me or email me ASAP... :jump:

[PaceAdvantage]

yes , we did get the bait and switch here, after many were thrilled about it..

But dont worry ...when the new program comes out....Dave will have a big, big, big, coupon for you guys that cant be matched.... :lol: :lol: :lol:Bait and switch? How is that even possible when nothing has come out yet? :lol: There's nothing to switch to unless I've missed something.

But thanks for the Dave bashing...it helps.

[Partsnut]

Bait and switch? How is that even possible when nothing has come out yet? :lol: There's nothing to switch to unless I've missed something.

But thanks for the Dave bashing...it helps.
__________________________________________________
Although I've been guilty of bashing in the past, I've found it serves no purpose and is wasted energy.
Everyone is entitled to make a living. No one is twisting anyones arm to buy.
Dave is a great marketer and has come out with some great stuff. He is also an accomplished author.
Cut him some slack. There are those that like his products.

[raybo]

yes , we did get the bait and switch here, after many were thrilled about it..

But dont worry ...when the new program comes out....Dave will have a big, big, big, coupon for you guys that cant be matched.... :lol: :lol: :lol:

Come on man! When we, as developers of racing tools, start projects, we often have no idea of what the journey will be like. Believe me, I've been there and done that. What seems like something fun and rather simple, initially, can quickly become something full of drudgery and complexity. Depending on the time we have available for a project, we may decide to quit it, or decide to continue. If we decide to continue, the time and labor we know will be required must be taken into account. And sometimes, that time and effort is so immense that it's only worth doing if some type of monetary compensation is received.

I'm almost positive that this is exactly what happened regarding Dave's "Pace Makes The Race" project.

[mikesal57]

Guys....

Please stop quoting my comments....
I was asked by PA to ...ZIP IT!!!

Mike

LOL

[NorCalGreg]

The next program I review will one called PACE VIEW.

I plan to give an honest, unbiased report--even though I know the owner personally.

For a sample--this is still in development--but there is a proprietary POWER NUMBER that is already in place. I'll handicap the 2nd race coming up @ Thistledown.

The top 2 selections are boxed in red--TRUE MARCO@ 8-1 is a win bet---with the :2: completing the exacta.

And yes---I will pay for advertising.

[NorCalGreg]

I'll put some other picks on my handicapping thread

-NCG

[Capper Al]

Come on man! When we, as developers of racing tools, start projects, we often have no idea of what the journey will be like. Believe me, I've been there and done that. What seems like something fun and rather simple, initially, can quickly become something full of drudgery and complexity. Depending on the time we have available for a project, we may decide to quit it, or decide to continue. If we decide to continue, the time and labor we know will be required must be taken into account. And sometimes, that time and effort is so immense that it's only worth doing if some type of monetary compensation is received.

I'm almost positive that this is exactly what happened regarding Dave's "Pace Makes The Race" project.

Amen. Just visit the thread "What's up with the Capper?" to get a little peek at the drudgery. I just decided to reformulate my pace figs. After looking at it for about a week in shock, I'm about to start the rewrite of some of the rewrite. It doesn't end.

[NorCalGreg]

"we often have no idea of what the journey will be like"

But you'll still promise a firm completion date?

Perhaps having an idea of what the journey will entail--should come first.

[raybo]

"we often have no idea of what the journey will be like"

But you'll still promise a firm completion date?

Perhaps having an idea of what the journey will entail--should come first.

That makes sense, on the face of it, but when you're talking about a "new idea", one that you have never approached before, what seems like something that should take 2 weeks (the initial projected "completion" date) can quickly become 2 months, 4 months, or more. It's not just the technical stuff that involves added time, but rather the "new ideas" that creeps into the initial "new idea" that can prolong the project.

My current project seemed like a 1 week thing, but as I got into it, new ideas started cropping up, and those new ideas morphed into even newer ideas, etc., etc., etc.. I've been at it for over 3 months now, and it will probably take another month or so just to get the current "new ideas" implemented, not to mention any other ideas that pop up later.

Just saying, it's not always that "cut and dried".

[NorCalGreg]

That makes sense, on the face of it, but when you're talking about a "new idea", one that you have never approached before, what seems like something that should take 2 weeks (the initial projected "completion" date) can quickly become 2 months, 4 months, or more. It's not just the technical stuff that involves added time, but rather the "new ideas" that creeps into the initial "new idea" that can prolong the project.

My current project seemed like a 1 week thing, but as I got into it, new ideas started cropping up, and those new ideas morphed into even newer ideas, etc., etc., etc.. I've been at it for over 3 months now, and it will probably take another month or so just to get the current "new ideas" implemented, not to mention any other ideas that pop up later.

Just saying, it's not always that "cut and dried".


fair enough.


-NCG

[Capper Al]

It isn't like someone is saying this is what to code. One could makeva fair guess at that. Is more like I have this idea on pace, let me figure it out and code it. And no one ever knows if the idea is going to pan out.

[raybo]

It isn't like someone is saying this is what to code. One could makeva fair guess at that. Is more like I have this idea on pace, let me figure it out and code it. And no one ever knows if the idea is going to pan out.

Yup, testing what you have so far can lead you down the road of just trying to get the implementation working properly, and once you get that fixed you can finally get back to testing something else, and on and on. That's why we often invite others to be beta testers, which helps with the testing, but then the problems found still have to be fixed.

For example, I'm currently at a complete standstill in my new project because of a stupid error capture thing (a pop up message box that is activated when a setting is made incorrectly by the user), I've been trying to fix that one little thing for 3 straight days now! :mad:

[Capper Al]

It's always something for the coder sailing in uncharted waters. In my recent case with pace was the code worked but the idea failed. Off to the next pace formulas.

[PaceAdvantage]

The next program I review will one called PACE VIEW.

I plan to give an honest, unbiased report--even though I know the owner personally.

For a sample--this is still in development--but there is a proprietary POWER NUMBER that is already in place. I'll handicap the 2nd race coming up @ Thistledown.

The top 2 selections are boxed in red--TRUE MARCO@ 8-1 is a win bet---with the :2: completing the exacta.

And yes---I will pay for advertising.Well, I just hope our little spat in this thread is now water under the bridge. I apologized for going overboard.

And I've been where you are...coding my own software...marketing my own software (if you can call what I did back in the 90s as marketing...lol)

I remember those days fondly...nothing like coming up with a new idea, spending until the wee hours coding it and debugging it...and then running it on an actual race card. It usually ended in disappointment, but the journey was always really cool... :ThmbUp:

[NorCalGreg]

Well, I just hope our little spat in this thread is now water under the bridge. I apologized for going overboard.

And I've been where you are...coding my own software...marketing my own software (if you can call what I did back in the 90s as marketing...lol)

I remember those days fondly...nothing like coming up with a new idea, spending until the wee hours coding it and debugging it...and then running it on an actual race card. It usually ended in disappointment, but the journey was always really cool... :ThmbUp:

I mentioned this site not being monetized a few days ago...I see it's now MONETIZED. Was hoping to get a good deal on a small piece of this (formerly) unused space---thus the reason for my recent e-mail. I'm sure you're now out of my price range---since my budget is just south of ZERO. :D

good luck

-NCG

[Pensacola Pete]

I've used Hor$ense. Junk imo.


Here's my take on the rest, and it's my opinion, which you can agree or disagree with:

Any software that uses the same information/data that countless others have (i.e. BRIS data files) is going to be massaging overused and overbet data and will be ultimately doomed to failure. If anything useful is found in some subset of this data, others will also find it or something similar-enough to it, and the price will be bet down to below profitability. To make a profit, you have to have something that others don't. You need to roll your own.

[pandy]

I've used Hor$ense. Junk imo.


Here's my take on the rest, and it's my opinion, which you can agree or disagree with:

Any software that uses the same information/data that countless others have (i.e. BRIS data files) is going to be massaging overused and overbet data and will be ultimately doomed to failure. If anything useful is found in some subset of this data, others will also find it or something similar-enough to it, and the price will be bet down to below profitability. To make a profit, you have to have something that others don't. You need to roll your own.


I get what you're saying, and I do disagree with you. The information in the Bris Date files is essentially the same past performance information that's available in every past performance publication or data file. They all use the same information from the same source, Equibase.

If what you're saying is true, the only way to "roll your own" would be to totally ignore the past performances and bet just by watching the races, sort of the way they do it in Europe, no fractions, no running lines, etc. Although you would still be using the same performances that everyone else is. There is no way to avoid using the same information because the information is the same and the only way the information could change would be if you lived in some sort of different world than the rest of us where they ran horse races that only you could see.

There is a lot of information and many different ways of interpreting it. If you find something that's working for you, that does not mean that everyone else is going to find it and ruin your chances of winning. First of all, you're putting horseplayers into a category that few can aspire to. The vast majority of horseplayers are not that good at interpreting the past performances.

[UltimateBetter]

Depending the Tracks your playing and using these files some times you are better off playing
off of angles.

[pandy]

Depending the Tracks your playing and using these files some times you are better off playing
off of angles.


It depends on what angles. Angles that have nothing to do with a horse's ability are, independently, unreliable.

[upthecreek]

It depends on what angles. Angles that have nothing to do with a horse's ability are, independently, unreliable.
I had the winner of the 1st @Mth on Sunday strictly based on angles There was no other way to come up with the horse Take a look and see Some of it had to do with Tips methodology,which NCG knows I'm a fan

[pandy]

I had the winner of the 1st @Mth on Sunday strictly based on angles There was no other way to come up with the horse Take a look and see Some of it had to do with Tips methodology,which NCG knows I'm a fan


The horse was shipping in from Pim, adding blinkers in third lifetime start, good Maryland based trainer. There are certainly things there that could be viewed as a positive, getting off the rail, last race in the mud, adding blinkers. I'm not against angles, blinkers on is one of my favorite angles, and I also have hit many longshot winners making their third career start. I prefer blinkers on early in a horse's career where it can make the most difference. I've noticed that many people pooh pooh blinkers on, because they think that if you can't bet all blinkers on then it is not a good angle. But if you know when to bet blinkers on, it is a very good angle. I included it in my Pace Handicapping Longshots book but you have to know how to use the angle.

Still, angles are more reliable when you're betting a horse that has some sort of proven ability level.

[upthecreek]

The horse was shipping in from Pim, adding blinkers in third lifetime start, good Maryland based trainer. There are certainly things there that could be viewed as a positive, getting off the rail, last race in the mud, adding blinkers. I'm not against angles, blinkers on is one of my favorite angles, and I also have hit many longshot winners making their third career start. I prefer blinkers on early in a horse's career where it can make the most difference. I've noticed that many people pooh pooh blinkers on, because they think that if you can't bet all blinkers on then it is not a good angle. But if you know when to bet blinkers on, it is a very good angle. I included it in my Pace Handicapping Longshots book but you have to know how to use the angle.

Still, angles are more reliable when you're betting a horse that has some sort of proven ability level.
Also 2 nice works,probably with Blinkers on
And I disagree 100% if you wait til a horse has "some proven ability" you won't get 14-1 You have to get out ahead of the curve

[pandy]

Also 2 nice works,probably with Blinkers on
And I disagree 100% if you wait til a horse has "some proven ability" you won't get 14-1 You have to get out ahead of the curve

My idea of proven ability can be something as simple as flashing a bit of early zip. You can get huge payoffs on horses that have actually shown they can run some. This horse at Monmouth had shown nothing in his first two starts, no early, middle, or late speed.

The horse worked 4 furlongs in 48 from the gate prior to its last start. Prior to Sunday's race it had one 4 furlong work in 49, so I can't see how the workouts could have helped unless your got the dates wrong. But I agree with the basic angle, I like to see an improved workout in blinkers, good angle, but this did not apply here, the horse worked better by a full second prior to adding the blinkers.

Trombetta is a good trainer, does well with maidens.

[upthecreek]

My idea of proven ability can be something as simple as flashing a bit of early zip. You can get huge payoffs on horses that have actually shown they can run some. This horse at Monmouth had shown nothing in his first two starts, no early, middle, or late speed.

The horse worked 4 furlongs in 48 from the gate prior to its last start. Prior to Sunday's race it had one 4 furlong work in 49, so I can't see how the workouts could have helped unless your got the dates wrong. But I agree with the basic angle, I like to see an improved workout in blinkers, good angle, but this did not apply here, the horse worked better by a full second prior to adding the blinkers.

Trombetta is a good trainer, does well with maidens.
Worked 4 days prior, out worked 30 horses and prior to that outworked 57 horses I don't care about the "my" race at all And how do you know when the blinkers went on? Could have been earlier work and off for the last or on for both or? Probably experimenting in the AM
My original statement was you couldn't find this horse without angles, whether you agree with mine or not No pace/speed figs were going to find this horse

[pandy]

Worked 4 days prior, out worked 30 horses and prior to that outworked 57 horses I don't care about the "my" race at all And how do you know when the blinkers went on? Could have been earlier work and off for the last or on for both or? Probably experimenting in the AM
My original statement was you couldn't find this horse without angles, whether you agree with mine or not No pace/speed figs were going to find this horse


That's true, but does this angle work long term? That's the problem with angles that don't deal with ability. Are they reliable? I'm writing my new book now and this is one of the things I talk about. I used to bet horses that were bred for turf in their turf debuts and I hit plenty of longshot winners, but then I realized that all I was doing is getting lucky occasionally and that there were much better longshot plays that actually had a good chance of winning.


I do agree with you that some quick workouts are better than slow workouts with horses that don't show much on the form. At least it shows they can run a bit.

[Tony L]

NCG you said "I plan to give an honest, unbiased report--even though I know the owner personally". But you ARE the owner, it's your website, it's your program. Why didn't you just say so?

[jk3521]

NCG you said "I plan to give an honest, unbiased report--even though I know the owner personally". But you ARE the owner, it's your website, it's your program. Why didn't you just say so?
I think he was joking.

[upthecreek]

NCG you said "I plan to give an honest, unbiased report--even though I know the owner personally". But you ARE the owner, it's your website, it's your program. Why didn't you just say so?
His software isn't Thee Top Three if that's what your saying
Sorry my mistake just saw other post Ive done testing for him It performs well:ThmbUp:

[completebill]

I get what you're saying, and I do disagree with you. The information in the Bris Date files is essentially the same past performance information that's available in every past performance publication or data file. They all use the same information from the same source, Equibase.

If what you're saying is true, the only way to "roll your own" would be to totally ignore the past performances and bet just by watching the races, sort of the way they do it in Europe, no fractions, no running lines, etc. Although you would still be using the same performances that everyone else is. There is no way to avoid using the same information because the information is the same and the only way the information could change would be if you lived in some sort of different world than the rest of us where they ran horse races that only you could see.

There is a lot of information and many different ways of interpreting it. If you find something that's working for you, that does not mean that everyone else is going to find it and ruin your chances of winning. First of all, you're putting horseplayers into a category that few can aspire to. The vast majority of horseplayers are not that good at interpreting the past performances.


Pandy---I've bought and used many of your products, and I try to read everything you write. I admire you greatly.

BUT----You are dead WRONG. HDW data files are so superior to anything available that any comparisons aren't even close!

[completebill]

[QUOTE=NorCalGreg]I actually purchased this program a few months ago, looked it over....and left it alone up until a few weeks ago. It was a snap to install, uses the Bris $1 single data files...which I buy anyway for another software program.

Upon opening the program, you come to a "tweaking" or program module--I simply by pass that, and click "view card".
What that opens is pretty cool---think of the Bris Summary, on steroids.
Appx 25 columns of sortable info such as:

RATING*PRIME*TRAINERWIN%*JOCKEYWIN%*RECENCYPOINTS* CLASSPOINTS
*EARNINGS*SPEEDPOINTS*PACE/SPEED*FINISHSPEED*BLINKERPOINTS

Any program that uses "Recency Points" is doomed to fail. "Recency" is an obsolete concept. Research now reveals that, for most horses (Dependent on training methods), the optimum time between races is about 29 days.

Also, good trainer stat will tell you how a trainer actually performs with varying layoff periods.

SAME with "Speed" (final time). EVERYONE has speed figures (some better than others). They're so over-bet as to be useless. MUCH more important is data/information that can predict IMPROVEMENT. E.G.---Trainer changes, jockey changes, "Hot" trainer, workouts, distance changes, equipment changes, etc.

[pandy]

Pandy---I've bought and used many of your products, and I try to read everything you write. I admire you greatly.

BUT----You are dead WRONG. HDW data files are so superior to anything available that any comparisons aren't even close!

Thanks for the compliment, I appreciate it. I'll be honest, I don't use HDW files. I was just making a statement that all files as based on equibase charts.

[chrisl]

Can anyone tell me how to scratch a horse in Thee Top Three software. Thanks

[Southbaygent]

Sorry but it doesn’t support scratches, frustrating but true.

[chrisl]

Look in the other top three thread. Head hawg has a download that works with TTT for scratches. Are you currently using Thee Top Three.

[mikesal57]

Look in the other top three thread. Head hawg has a download that works with TTT for scratches. Are you currently using Thee Top Three.

How is the program Chris?

[chrisl]

How is the program Chris?

Have not had much time to run it through the paces. It did not fair well at GG. I have done some checking at Gulfstream and it did some pretty good hit's there on Saturday. My plan after running a few more cards. I will post the top three in the selection thread.

[mikesal57]

Have not had much time to run it through the paces. It did not fair well at GG. I have done some checking at Gulfstream and it did some pretty good hit's there on Saturday. My plan after running a few more cards. I will post the top three in the selection thread.

Appreciate it...can you post some pix of the GP races...

since the developer opted out ...dont worry about any problems

[chrisl]

27564Appreciate it...can you post some pix of the GP races...

since the developer opted out ...dont worry about any problems

[chrisl]

Night cap at MNR race #8 6/8/20 TTT had the #1 on top paid 32/1

[lawmaker1]

How are you using the Top Three? There are so many charts!

[chrisl]

How are you using the Top Three? There are so many charts!


Download your card, open the program. Click on view race card. That is what I am using. Just click on the view race card at the bottom. I just started last weekend using this program.

[mikesal57]

Night cap at MNR race #8 6/8/20 TTT had the #1 on top paid 32/1

Did you have it?

what files are you using?

Thxs

[chrisl]

Did you have it?

what files are you using?

Thxs

Look at post #209 attachment. I am using Bris $1 files And I had it to I had it to P/S paid $29. I am only making very small bets until I have time to sit down and give the program attention.

27565

[wolsons]

That attachment looks like it's just displaying the horses in post position order, that top listed horse doesn't seem to be the top pick.

[mikesal57]

That attachment looks like it's just displaying the horses in post position order, that top listed horse doesn't seem to be the top pick.

Dont spoil his parade....:lol::lol::lol:

I'm sure he'll figure it out soon....


Hello from NYC too...what part....?.....SI here

Are you Steve from Pops and Tops?

[wolsons]

Nassau here, and no to Pops and Tips, wasn't that Earl Sigiloff and Tom Worth?

[JimG]

Nassau here, and no to Pops and Tips, wasn't that Earl Sigiloff and Tom Worth?


Hi Steve,


Your program (Power Online) was one of the few I never got so I did not get to check it out. I know you no longer sell it but do you still use it?


Jim

[wolsons]

No, haven't had much time for the horses in a long time, family circumstances and all...

[mikesal57]

Nassau here, and no to Pops and Tips, wasn't that Earl Sigiloff and Tom Worth?

Your right...your name was familiar but couldnt put my finger on it...

Are you looking to get back in?

Are you offering your program again?

Would you like me to give it a go?

Thxs

Mike

[chrisl]

Dont spoil his parade....:lol::lol::lol:

I'm sure he'll figure it out soon....


Hello from NYC too...what part....?.....SI here

Are you Steve from Pops and Tops?

Parade?

[crestridge]

Hi Chris

Where did you purchase this program? I thought the originator of this program no longer supports it?

[crestridge]

Please disregard...I saw in another post Chris didn't know when he purchased this program. Sorry my bad, dumb question...

[mikesal57]

Please disregard...I saw in another post Chris didn't know when he purchased this program. Sorry my bad, dumb question...

I remember buying it a number of years ago...

and the author DID retire from supporting it....

[chrisl]

I have 3 programs that I have been using on and off for awhile. For the last three weeks TTT out does them all. How long that will last? I am having a lot of success and enjoying it for once.

[mikesal57]

I have 3 programs that I have been using on and off for awhile. For the last three weeks TTT out does them all. How long that will last? I am having a lot of success and enjoying it for once.

How about some pix of good hits..

[chrisl]

Will do. On vacation in Bend Or. Spending time with my kids and grand babies. Not much time for play right now. Looking at some retirement properties.

[mikesal57]

Will do. On vacation in Bend Or. Spending time with my kids and grand babies. Not much time for play right now. Looking at some retirement properties.

NO TIMESHARES......PLEASE!!!

[HPFridays]

Will do. On vacation in Bend Or. Spending time with my kids and grand babies. Not much time for play right now. Looking at some retirement properties.

We visited Bend about 5 years ago and loved it. If you ever get a chance to visit Pacific City on the coast, I highly recommend it.

Sad that Thee Top Three isn't still supported because it sounds like a decent program at a bargain price.

[chrisl]

I love Bend. What a great town. I am so glad my grand babies will be raised in this area. Looking to settle down here also,

[theetopthree]

GO TO THE RACE CARD ENTRY SCREEN, SELECT THE HORSE FROM THE RIGHT SIDE YOU WANT TO REMOVE, THEN GO TO TRACK CODES AND REMOVE THE TRACKS, THEN CLICK ENTER NEXT HORSE, SAVE TO FILE AND THIS WILL TAKE AWAY THE RATING. YOU CAN ALSO PUT YOUR OWN SPEED AND PACE FIGURES IF SO DESIRE.