The Next Stamina Pedigree Influence

[Java Gold@TFT]

I follow pedigrees a lot even though I am no expert on it. The next pedigrre sire for stamina - Dynaformer.

7. Dynaformer may someday be known as the best steeplechase sire in history. The Kentucky stallion produced Far Hills winners Left Unsaid and Ambersham, who combined to earn $130,000. In other acton at Far Hills, Tax Ruling finished third in the Grand National and Dynaskill placed second in the Peapack. Sire of Kentucky Derby winner Barbaro and a host of flat stars, Dynafomer puts stamina – and an affinity for demanding soft turf – into his progeny. Through October 23, the NSA top 10 includes three sons of Dynaformer (Left Unsaid, Tax Ruling and Dynaski).

From Joe Clancy at Steeplechase Times

http://www.st-publishing.com/cms/ind...1043&Itemid=73

Joe and his brother Sean have lived their whole lives around steeplechasers as jockeys before becoming commentators. The Dynaformers have been great at distances. Take a second look at them when you see a first timer going two turns whether on dirt or turf. Personally I haven't noticed this type of stamina influence since El Prado and now we have Birdstone to watch also.

[Dick Powell]

I would add Tiznow and Street Cry to the list of sires that add stamina to a pedigree - especially on dirt.

[46zilzal]

It is about time, Who was the last one Run the Gauntlet?

Breed speed to speed, DON'T offer ANY graded stamina contests on dirt, and it disappears. Not too bright

[Cratos]

Originally Posted by Dick Powell

I would add Tiznow and Street Cry to the list of sires that add stamina to a pedigree - especially on dirt.

You are right and should we add Birdstone or is it too early?

[Horseplayersbet.com]

Dynaformer did race 30 times. Went to stud as a 5 year old.

[joanied]

Pleasant Colony is another stamina stallion...wish I had time to look up some info about this...
and let's not forget the mare can influence stamina to a great degree.
Interesting topic.

[Steve R]

Among sires active at the beginning of 2009 and whose progeny have won at least 50 North American open stakes races, these are the 10 with the longest average winning distance (in decreasing order):

Theatrical
With Approval
Kingmambo
Thunder Gulch
A.P. Indy
Giant's Causeway
Langfuhr
Dynaformer
Red Ransom
Awesome Again

[46zilzal]

We have a good AP Indy here that just won at 1 1/2 on the main track: Numaany

[Java Gold@TFT]

Originally Posted by Steve R

Among sires active at the beginning of 2009 and whose progeny have won at least 50 North American open stakes races, these are the 10 with the longest average winning distance (in decreasing order):

Theatrical
With Approval
Kingmambo
Thunder Gulch
A.P. Indy
Giant's Causeway
Langfuhr
Dynaformer
Red Ransom
Awesome Again

Thanks for that list. The only two surprises to me are Langfur and Red Ransom. I enjoyed both while they were racing but also considerred both of them as solid producers of milers. Maybe they have so many winners at 8-9F that it drags their AWD up. I hate to see an AWD in the 6 range for any sire who has been bred for at least 3 years. It's also great that the list has so many turf horses. I wouldn't be surprised one bit to see Kitten's Joy show up on the same list 2 or 3 years from now.

[Bochall]

Originally Posted by Cratos

You are right and should we add Birdstone or is it too early?

I think we must include him. Has any other sire gotten two different winners of a Triple Crown race in the same year? Someone out there knows...please tell me. Tiznow is another favorite, as mentioned by someone earlier.

[juanepstein]

australians love MORE THAN READY.

http://www.racenet.com.au/stats/WetSires.asp

3200 RUNS- 488 WINS- 15.2%

STREET CRY is 18th on the wet track sire list.

28 wins from 168 starts- 16.7%

[WinterTriangle]

The leading first crop sire right now is Roman Ruler (Homeboykris, Roman Invasion) Roman Ruler himself is from the first crop of Fusaichi Pegasus.
Roman Ruler's 1/2 brother, El Corredor, has sired G1 winners on all 3 surfaces.
Roman Ruler's and El Corredor's other 1/2 brother is Maimonedes, so they are saying keep an eye on that one when he starts breeding.

Originally Posted by joanied

and let's not forget the mare can influence stamina to a great degree.

and broodmare sires.

Sire stamina is only a fractional part of the whole picture, people who do a decent pedigree analysis do it for 5 generations +, outcrosses, duplications, and include the broodmare sires, etc.

To look only at sire stamina is piecemeal.


Dr. Roman lists the stamina broodmare sires as Turkoman, Theatrical, Minnesota Mac, Diesis as strongest dominant stamina. He also has Sire vs. Broodmare Sire Aptitudinal Influence 2009 up on now.

Abbreviations: you could look for sires under Professional category for stamina/distance, a dosage index under 4.00. Center of distribution (CD) value of 0 would be theoretically perfect, and a -2.00 would be pure professional (stamina)...

Can also use top sire at >9F on dirt:
http://www.breedingwinners.com/aspsp...esGT9FDirt.PDF


To make is really simple, I just look at Average Winning Distance (AWD) of 8 furlongs +....(what I was trying to tell my friend last year who was SURE Gayego would win ).


I fantasize about who I would breed to if I had a great mare, Read here and you'll see the expensive ones at the bottom of the page, which includes dynaformer :
http://www.thoroughbredreview.com/StallionWatch.htm

[WinterTriangle]

wow. how wierd is this? As you can see, my post did not show up. I wrote this long post that I have to write all over again!

[WinterTriangle]

Eh, I'm not even gonna try to write it all out again.

The leading first crop sire right now is Roman Ruler. (homeboykris, roman invasion). He's 1/2 bro to El Corredor, who has produced G1 winners now on all 3 surfaces.

Their other 1/2 bro is Maimonedes, who is also a grandson of Seattle Slew, is standing at the Vinery now. I would watch him closely.

[pedigreeman]

4. Tesio did not patronize pure sprinters as sires. You will look in vain for crosses of sprinting sires, such as Tetratema, Panorama, etc., in the Tesio pedigrees. Tesio did not despise speed; indeed, he was fond of saying that in the pedigrees of nearly all high-class racers, one could find animals of ex ceptional speed fairly close up.
5. His favorite strain was that of St. Simon (Tesio said he had curby hocks), and he tried to pile up as much St. Simon in his pedigrees as he could get, but, as he said, “not close up.” Inasmuch as we were talking in 1938 and St. Simon had been foaled in 1881, it already was a little hard to get the name “close up.”
What he was thinking of may be illustrated in the pedigree of Nearco. Pharos, sire of Nearco, was inbred to St. Simon with three free generations; his maternal grandsire, Havresac II, was inbred to St. Simon with one free generation and had two additional crosses of Galopin, the sire of St. Simon.
6. Tesio relied almost entirely on British strains for the introduction of new blood into his stud, but he did not mind American blood. Nearco himself traced in tail female to Maiden (by Lexington), a winner of the Travers.
7. In contrast to the Aga Khan, who believed that you could breed stoutness on the basis of speed, Tesio apparently never bought animals with pure speed pedigrees. He seemed to believe that one could evolve speed out of a stout base. This may have been due in part to his criteria for the sires he used. His general policy was to limit himself to stallions that had been very good 2.year’olds and then could go on with success at the classic distances as 3-year-olds. The fact that they had been high-class 2-year-olds gave him a source of early maturity and good speed. He did not absolutely insist that a sire had to be a Derby winner; he used Pharos (second by a length in the Derby) as a mate for Nogara, to produce Nearco.