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Old 12-20-2017, 12:45 AM   #16
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I tend to agree with this.

I don't agree with everything Trump is doing, but I feel like most things are heading the right direction. The disagreements are about some of the details. While Obama was president I used to think he couldn't be that stupid so he must be actually trying to do damage for some greater insidious political purpose.


Where he has a problem is on the personality side. There are times he creates conflict when he should be working with those people because they can help him. He also can't handle any criticism at all. That stuff is going to hurt him.
Yeah, but his personality was very much on display when he ran for President, especially when he ran for the Republican nomination, and he just kept winning.

A friend of mine just emailed us an article from Vox, one of those liberal websites, saying that the top 1% will get the biggest tax cut....wait for it...in 2027! This is the kind of spin we're going to hear. Heck, I remember when the Bush Tax Cuts started, the dems called it "tax cuts for the rich" but when Obama was President and they were in power they extended those tax cuts and said "now is not a good time to raise taxes on the middle class." Funny how it was tax cuts for the rich when Bush was President, but tax cuts for the middle class when they were in power.
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Old 12-20-2017, 01:02 AM   #17
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Yeah, but his personality was very much on display when he ran for President, especially when he ran for the Republican nomination, and he just kept winning.

A friend of mine just emailed us an article from Vox, one of those liberal websites, saying that the top 1% will get the biggest tax cut....wait for it...in 2027! This is the kind of spin we're going to hear. Heck, I remember when the Bush Tax Cuts started, the dems called it "tax cuts for the rich" but when Obama was President and they were in power they extended those tax cuts and said "now is not a good time to raise taxes on the middle class." Funny how it was tax cuts for the rich when Bush was President, but tax cuts for the middle class when they were in power.
I used to get annoyed when they called them the Bush tax cuts. They were as much Obama's tax cuts since he made them code.

It certainly goes both ways though.
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Old 12-20-2017, 01:46 AM   #18
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https://www.marketwatch.com/story/th...ted-2017-12-18

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Old 12-20-2017, 01:49 AM   #19
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Yep.....

If the economy is roaring, my taxes are lower, Iíll throw the bum out if I donít like his personality
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Old 12-20-2017, 09:48 AM   #20
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Yeah, but his personality was very much on display when he ran for President, especially when he ran for the Republican nomination, and he just kept winning.
Exactly.
Even if he accomplished nothing, I would vote for him for his personality alone.
Breath of fresh air after 8 years of the little piss-ant foreigner putting down America.

Let Trump be Trump!
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Old 12-20-2017, 10:28 AM   #21
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I used to get annoyed when they called them the Bush tax cuts. They were as much Obama's tax cuts since he made them code.

It certainly goes both ways though.
But when Democrats raised taxes, they called it investments.

And when the Democrats raised those Bush tax cuts under Obama they claimed that those tax cuts ruined the economy and we needed to raise those taxes back to pre-Bush rates, remember?

But that lie was exposed as fraudulent thanks to Obama's piss-poor economy of zero growth ... <2 % every year in our GDP.

Thanks to our great president DJT, we're on our way again as the economic engine of the world.
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Old 12-20-2017, 10:39 AM   #22
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I used to get annoyed when they called them the Bush tax cuts. They were as much Obama's tax cuts since he made them code.
The lefties here used to call them Bush's tax cuts for the wealthy.
They stooped that when OBama renewed them. They were more Bush's, though,, because OBama never would have made to begin with. He was forced to keep them because reality was inplay at the time - they worked.

Bottom line, the money belongs to us and WE are the ones who should have the majority of it.

As good as the new rates are, they are at least 5 times too high.
Government should not get more than 5% from anyone.
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Old 12-20-2017, 01:51 PM   #23
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But when Democrats raised taxes, they called it investments.

And when the Democrats raised those Bush tax cuts under Obama they claimed that those tax cuts ruined the economy and we needed to raise those taxes back to pre-Bush rates, remember?

But that lie was exposed as fraudulent thanks to Obama's piss-poor economy of zero growth ... <2 % every year in our GDP.

Thanks to our great president DJT, we're on our way again as the economic engine of the world.
Pretty partisan view of what happened.

The economy tanked because the housing market collapsed. The recovery was slow due to over-regulation and lack of investor confidence.

They were tax cuts. As our deficit roars past $20 trillion dollars this century we have lowered tax rates(Bush), extended those lower rates (Bush/Obama), raised them back to where they were before for high earners (Obama), and then sweepingly lowered them again (Trump).

I get we have a spending problem but to deny we have a revenue problem is absurd as well. 47% in this country don't pay anything to the feds.
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Old 12-20-2017, 01:52 PM   #24
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The lefties here used to call them Bush's tax cuts for the wealthy.
You are correct that's how they framed it because that's what they were targeting.

No one ever said elected officials are intellectually honest.
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Old 12-20-2017, 05:01 PM   #25
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I used to get annoyed when they called them the Bush tax cuts. They were as much Obama's tax cuts since he made them code.

It certainly goes both ways though.
The tax cuts were made in 2003. Bush was President in 2003 and for five years after that. How could they be Obama's tax cuts?
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Old 12-20-2017, 05:21 PM   #26
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You are correct that's how they framed it because that's what they were targeting.

No one ever said elected officials are intellectually honest.
Tax cuts for the lowest bracket were 50%.
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Old 12-20-2017, 06:59 PM   #27
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Pretty partisan view of what happened.

The economy tanked because the housing market collapsed. The recovery was slow due to over-regulation and lack of investor confidence.

They were tax cuts. As our deficit roars past $20 trillion dollars this century we have lowered tax rates(Bush), extended those lower rates (Bush/Obama), raised them back to where they were before for high earners (Obama), and then sweepingly lowered them again (Trump).

I get we have a spending problem but to deny we have a revenue problem is absurd as well. 47% in this country don't pay anything to the feds.
No, its really not absurd. My, along with most other responsible people, spend at or lower then the amount of revenue I bring in. The amounts vary from person to person and most seem to be able to manage to live within their means.
The government dos NOT live by this code because its not THEIR income and IS NOT required to abide by the rules of basic math.
There are no negative consequences to them, therefore, why abide by basic rules?

If they were forced to live within basic logic and math, I would imagine we wouldn't have this exploding deficit!
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Old 12-20-2017, 07:25 PM   #28
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Tax cuts for the lowest bracket were 50%.
And that 50% cut saved them a total of $600, because the change from 15% to 10% only applied to the first $12,000 dollars of earnings. The rest of the $45,000 was still taxed at 15%.

That same tax cut saved a millionaire more than $35,500 in the first year; and that does not take into account other savings.
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Old 12-20-2017, 07:57 PM   #29
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No, its really not absurd. My, along with most other responsible people, spend at or lower then the amount of revenue I bring in. The amounts vary from person to person and most seem to be able to manage to live within their means.
The government dos NOT live by this code because its not THEIR income and IS NOT required to abide by the rules of basic math.
There are no negative consequences to them, therefore, why abide by basic rules?

If they were forced to live within basic logic and math, I would imagine we wouldn't have this exploding deficit!
I am amazed-and not in a good way-by people who think running a country is the same as running a household. The first is more complex than the latter by several thousand orders of magnitude.

The necessities of your household would seem to include:
Pay the rent or mortgage.
pay for food
Pay for health care
pay for the children's education
Pay for transportation
Pay for necessary repairs
Pay for clothing.

The necessities of government might include.
Pay your civilian employees.
Pay your elected officials
Pay your military employees.
Pay for transportation vehicles used by your civilian and elected officials including a big honkin' 747 used by POTUS
Pay for office space and supplies and heat and light and plumbing and upkeep on all those buildings.
Pay for tanks, artillery pieces, guns, grenades, airplanes, bombs, bullets, RPGs, bazookas, napalm, bayonets, aircraft carriers, destroyers, submarines, torpedoes.
Pay for roads, bridges, tunnels.
pay for airports, ocean ports.
Pay for TSA screeners, FBI agents and other federal officers.
Pay for a freakin' wall.

I could probably go on for pages not scratch the surface of what the Federal
government is involved in. All of which, your opinion to the contrary not withstanding, is important and necessary.
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Old 12-20-2017, 08:15 PM   #30
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Trump is an ass but he is quietly doing what he said he would do re Supreme Court, Taxes, Judges, Regulations, Trade, putting Conservatives in charge of Agencies, and most important the Economy. IMO we underestimate him.
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