Songbird Alabama

[Fager Fan]

Originally Posted by SuperPickle

My point was that since both of them jogged they probably could have raced a month ago in a softer spot at Belmont or SA and jogged. Clearly the connections were waiting for their races versus racing them when they were ready.

I got your point but think it's not likely true for the reason above. You don't just sit on a horse when it's ready to run. There's nothing wrong with running at Belmont then Saratoga. It'd probably be better than coming into the Spa off such a long layoff/

[the little guy]

Originally Posted by Fager Fan

I know a number of owners who have raced there or have the opportunity to do so, and I've never heard it said. Nor can I remember reading in 20+ years any owner quoted as wanting to win a race just because it's Saratoga. Maybe it's all just eluded me.

I has.

[thespaah]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

One way to determine whether this is true is to look at average field sizes of big open stakes at Saratoga. Are they any larger than those at Del Mar, for instance? I've seen plenty of 5 horse (and even a few 4 and 3 horse) fields in the major Saratoga stakes over the years.

I was not referring to just stakes races.

[thespaah]

Originally Posted by the little guy

I has.

Jeez.. I cannot believe some of these people.
Anyone who has been around the block with Thoroughbred racing knows or at least has an idea that The Spa is one place where any owner who has one, proudly display that one winner's photo on the wall of the room where they entertain their guests.
A win at Saratoga says something special.

[affirmedny]

Originally Posted by the little guy

I has.

All one has to do is watch the opening of the msg/fs1 show today and watch the clip of Maggie and her husband Wed for a good example.

[EMD4ME]

Originally Posted by the little guy

I has.

It's well known to everyone, at least I thought so

[SG4]

Originally Posted by SuperPickle

. Barclay Tagg won the 5th race by 5+ lengths with a maiden for Fipke he'd been sitting on since a second place finish in December at Gulstream. The horse got pounded down to 2-1 off works that were called A by the clockers. In hindsight he could have ran this horse weeks ago maybe eve a month ago in a variety of spots downstate and won. Fipke loves Saratoga so they waited.

I had this horse on a watch list since last year specifically looking for her to run at Belmont, Tagg was quoted somewhere saying she got over the Belmont track really well but maybe wasn't quite as fond at Saratoga. I'm thinking 2 things -1, if she was ready she would've been racing at Belmont. 2, if Tagg's opinion is still true, she might really be one to watch when they head back downstate.

[depalma113]

Originally Posted by MonmouthParkJoe

After that race, in reality who is going to show up? Cotillion at Philly Park is double the purse I believe at $1 million and is a couple weeks later. Hard enough to get entries for this past race, I can only imagine who shows up now. Gives other fillies a chance to be graded stakes placed or even win if she loses, but with another big race for twice the amount and avoiding this monster, should be interesting. Maybe the ML will be closer to 1/9

Has any MDO filly won at a mile and a quarter?

[depalma113]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

I would buy this argument about why people run no chance entries in the Ky Derby.

But Saratoga? The vast, vast majority of people in this gane do not give two hoots about Saratoga as a "special" place. That is a totally parochial, New York view.

Well, I have been involved in two year-old training sales for nearly 25 years and have been around numerous trainers and owners. I can say, almost all of them want four things. To win the Kentucky Derby, to win a Breeders Cup and to win at Saratoga and Keeneland.

[biggestal99]

Originally Posted by depalma113

Has any MDO filly won at a mile and a quarter?

Marketing Mix won at 12F in graded company. :-)

Allan

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by depalma113

Has any MDO filly won at a mile and a quarter?

I think it could be a more interesting test for her than this last race. 10F on dirt at Saratoga is sometimes a lot tougher for speed horses than at other places. If she's pressed (or at least challenged) early and there's someone in there that really wants 10f, the last 1/16th could be challenging.

[v j stauffer]

Originally Posted by Fager Fan

I know a number of owners who have raced there or have the opportunity to do so, and I've never heard it said. Nor can I remember reading in 20+ years any owner quoted as wanting to win a race just because it's Saratoga. Maybe it's all just eluded me.

I believe it has.

[bobphilo]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

Read the start of the thread. The whole argument here is whether there are going to be no chance entrants that show up against Songbird at Saratoga.

I was responding to the post that claimed that a meet quality is based on the field size in major stakes.
If Songbird scares away non-contenders making for small but select fields that is no knock on the SPA.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by bobphilo

If Songbird scares away non-contenders making for small but select fields that is no knock on the SPA.

There's not much that can be done remedy this. It's been a problem for as long as the game has been around. Man O War used to run in 2, 3 and 4 horse fields because no one wanted to face him. These days, with all the opportunities to get black type, horses will even ship away from their home base to avoid a champion. When it happens, you can't hold it against the horse or the track.

[thespaah]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

There's not much that can be done remedy this. It's been a problem for as long as the game has been around. Man O War used to run in 2, 3 and 4 horse fields because no one wanted to face him. These days, with all the opportunities to get black type, horses will even ship away from their home base to avoid a champion. When it happens, you can't hold it against the horse or the track.

One issue is the amount of graded stake races and/or non graded events with huge slots inflated purses.
IMO there are too many graded stake races.
yeah, connections can avoid other high caliber horses by chasing huge purses.
For example. Yes the PA Derby has been around a while. However, the only thing that keeps this event going is the fact that Parx can dip into the slots money and inflate the purse to seven figures.
Same goes for the West Virginia Derby. I think that race carries a purse of $1.5 million.