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08-12-2015, 05:52 PM
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#31
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by thaskalos
The original poster didn't ask for the various reasons why a second place horse might receive a higher number than the winner; he asked for a PARTICULAR reason, in a PARTICULAR race.
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Obviously pace as was discussed in depth on TVG spot he is referencing. He wasn't asking anything...he already knew.
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08-12-2015, 05:54 PM
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#32
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Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 156
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A poster just said honor code ran a better race. So there IS at least one other person in the world that agrees with me. I was starting to worry. If you live in Margaritaville long enough you can become Margaritaville yourself.
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08-12-2015, 05:54 PM
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#33
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,549
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by AndyC
I think the Sheets and TG are great products. But to say that anybody has a real, true and accurate variant is only kidding themselves. There is so much subjectivity in making a variant that the words true and accurate should not be in the conversation. If the variants were always correct the Sheets and TG would always have the same numbers adjusted for their different scales. They don't.
Ground loss can make a winner a loser but what about when there is a dead rail? Do the Sheets or TG adjust for that? And just how do they know the exact detriment or benefit to a horse of weight carried? Does it differ by the horse's height, weight, stride, running style, or configuration of the track?
Neither the Sheets nor TG nor Beyers nor TF are perfect products.
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And what about when two speedsters set torrid fraction and then tire each other out in the last stages of the race...allowing the closer to come around the outside and win by a slim margin? The sheets account for the closer's wide run...but do they account for the torrid speed duel which exhausted the front-runners?
__________________
Live to play another day.
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08-12-2015, 05:55 PM
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#34
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,549
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by cj
Obviously pace as was discussed in depth on TVG spot he is referencing. He wasn't asking anything...he already knew.
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I bet he STILL doesn't know.
__________________
Live to play another day.
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08-12-2015, 05:55 PM
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#35
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by RarifiedAir
A poster just said honor code ran a better race. So there IS at least one other person in the world that agrees with me. I was starting to worry. If you live in Margaritaville long enough you can become Margaritaville yourself.
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Do you think the best horse in each race always wins?
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08-12-2015, 05:56 PM
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#36
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Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 156
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by cj
Obviously pace as was discussed in depth on TVG spot he is referencing. He wasn't asking anything...he already knew.
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honest... I didn't know. The poster has it right I really was asking. Now... for listening to TVG announcers... you really are asking a lot. Especially if its Matty Carrouthers. But thats a totally different topic. I saw the pace I didn't need to hear what the "personalities" said. I really did ignore it. I was working out on the olyptical at the time.
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08-12-2015, 05:57 PM
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#37
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 209
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by cj
Second post even better. I'm gonna make some popcorn. This should be fun.
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Would be funny if Rarified Air was that Timeform Fig guy he was mocking. 
Anyway heading out to play some cards but looking forward to checking back here later and enjoying the responses.
BTW Timeform guy, keep up the good work.
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08-12-2015, 05:58 PM
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#38
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Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 156
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by cj
Do you think the best horse in each race always wins?
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Answer... a profound no. You won't have an argument from me on that.
As for this race I just don't see it. And 5 to 6 points I think is insanity.
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08-12-2015, 06:02 PM
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#39
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Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 156
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Trips
Would be funny if Rarified Air was that Timeform Fig guy he was mocking.
Anyway heading out to play some cards but looking forward to checking back here later and enjoying the responses.
BTW Timeform guy, keep up the good work. |
Just to state... I'm not questioning timeform guys work. In fact I'm a huge Mike Beer fan... used to watch his vids on DRF.
I'm a simple guy who likes to keep things simple... in a world of people (this board) who are just the opposite. Its somewhat fascinating.
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08-12-2015, 06:05 PM
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#40
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,549
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by RarifiedAir
Just to state... I'm not questioning timeform guys work. In fact I'm a huge Mike Beer fan... used to watch his vids on DRF.
I'm a simple guy who likes to keep things simple... in a world of people (this board) who are just the opposite. Its somewhat fascinating.
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I am starting to think that you are yanking our chain here. For a "simple guy who likes to keep things simple", you've sure chosen a strange username...even if you've misspelled it.
__________________
Live to play another day.
Last edited by thaskalos; 08-12-2015 at 06:06 PM.
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08-12-2015, 06:05 PM
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#41
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 4,285
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by RarifiedAir
honest... I didn't know. The poster has it right I really was asking. Now... for listening to TVG announcers... you really are asking a lot. Especially if its Matty Carrouthers. But thats a totally different topic. I saw the pace I didn't need to hear what the "personalities" said. I really did ignore it. I was working out on the olyptical at the time.
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You could do a lot worse than listen to Matt Carothers. Matt does his homework. Don't judge the message by how the messenger delivers it.
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08-12-2015, 06:09 PM
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#42
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Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 156
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by AndyC
Personally, if I thought there was a big mistake made I would take advantage of it at the betting windows rather than make a big deal about it on a racing forum.
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Honor Code was better and if they race against themselves next time out I will bet Honor Code with confidence.
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08-12-2015, 06:11 PM
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#43
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Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 156
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by AndyC
You could do a lot worse than listen to Matt Carothers. Matt does his homework. Don't judge the message by how the messenger delivers it.
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Todd Schrutte?
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08-12-2015, 06:12 PM
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#44
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,549
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by RarifiedAir
Honor Code was better and if they race against themselves next time out I will bet Honor Code with confidence.
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And you might very well cash your ticket. There is no law that says Liams Map will ration his speed better the next time.
__________________
Live to play another day.
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08-12-2015, 06:25 PM
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#45
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,222
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by AndyC
I think the Sheets and TG are great products. But to say that anybody has a real, true and accurate variant is only kidding themselves. There is so much subjectivity in making a variant that the words true and accurate should not be in the conversation. If the variants were always correct the Sheets and TG would always have the same numbers adjusted for their different scales. They don't.
Ground loss can make a winner a loser but what about when there is a dead rail? Do the Sheets or TG adjust for that? And just how do they know the exact detriment or benefit to a horse of weight carried? Does it differ by the horse's height, weight, stride, running style, or configuration of the track?
Neither the Sheets nor TG nor Beyers nor TF are perfect products.
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Bingo.
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