Drug Free Racing Is Only Hope

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by Hoofless_Wonder

I'll agree that comparing HK to NA racing as it stands today is more like watermelons to spinach, since Hong Kong is such a highly regulated "closed system". But I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility that their model could not be adapted to one of the year-round circuits here, say like NYRA, southern California, south Florida or Kentucky.

Hong Kong is not really subject to the market forces that affect NA racing. If an owner or trainer in the US doesn't like what's happening in So. Cal they ship to Florida or Kentucky or NY.

[Steve R]

I see no discussion of the adverse effects race day medication has on the overall well-being of the horses themselves (Bute: anemia and suppression of white blood cell production; Lasix: dehydration, potassium and calcium imbalance), not to mention the inherent danger in masking injuries. Apparently hardcore players really don't care all that much about the issue except to the extent it affects their betting strategy. It seems as if most of the owners don't care much either. It's that attitude which helps to create the image in the general public of Thoroughbred racing as abusive which, to a large degree, it is, especially at the lower end where so many horses shouldn't even be on the track.

[Stillriledup]

Originally Posted by Steve R

I see no discussion of the adverse effects race day medication has on the overall well-being of the horses themselves (Bute: anemia and suppression of white blood cell production; Lasix: dehydration, potassium and calcium imbalance), not to mention the inherent danger in masking injuries. Apparently hardcore players really don't care all that much about the issue except to the extent it affects their betting strategy. It seems as if most of the owners don't care much either. It's that attitude which helps to create the image in the general public of Thoroughbred racing as abusive which, to a large degree, it is, especially at the lower end where so many horses shouldn't even be on the track.

Animal lovers care, but this isn't really an animal lover board so you will see comments slanted towards the gaming aspect of drugs, doesn't make the horse player somehow less compassionate.

[Grits]

Originally Posted by Stillriledup

Animal lovers care, but this isn't really an animal lover board so you will see comments slanted towards the gaming aspect of drugs, doesn't make the horse player somehow less compassionate.

Not sure what you term as an "animal lover" board, SRU. Perhaps you can explain further.

Its not every horse racing board on the internet that has grown men openly discussing their love of their pets, and their great sadness when they lose them. I'd say this is a board that very much cares about animals.

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...ts#post1784982

[pandy]

Originally Posted by Steve R

I see no discussion of the adverse effects race day medication has on the overall well-being of the horses themselves (Bute: anemia and suppression of white blood cell production; Lasix: dehydration, potassium and calcium imbalance), not to mention the inherent danger in masking injuries. Apparently hardcore players really don't care all that much about the issue except to the extent it affects their betting strategy. It seems as if most of the owners don't care much either. It's that attitude which helps to create the image in the general public of Thoroughbred racing as abusive which, to a large degree, it is, especially at the lower end where so many horses shouldn't even be on the track.

I've written about it. Lasix, like most drugs, has serious side affects. And the fact that most of the horses that are on it don't need it, it's basically animal abuse.

[GatetoWire]

Let's just be honest. Very few people inside racing really want to clean it up. Instead they want to maintain the status quo.

These moderate improvements and relying on testing will never catch any real cheating. It didn't in cycling and it won't in racing. All it does is provide a smokescreen that horsemen actually care.

Everyone in the know in racing realizes that the amount of cheating going on now is widespread. Look at the some of the results the last few years in the marquee Grade 1 races held in Security and out of Security. Many of the elite trainers are the biggest offenders. Everyone knows it and even when they get caught it get's swept under the rug. Accidental, coincidence, contamination.

Take a look at the results over the next few weeks and months. When a horse improves miraculously or does something beyond belief just take a minute and think about Lance Armstrong and his miraculous rides up the mountains in France that everyone ooh'd and ahh'd about even though it was obvious that he wasn't clean. The exact same thing happens in racing. Particularly on races that don't have enhanced security and out of competition testing.
And don't worry nothing will change. No one really wants to pull back the covers because what's under the covers is just too scary to see.

[Stillriledup]

Originally Posted by GatetoWire

Let's just be honest. Very few people inside racing really want to clean it up. Instead they want to maintain the status quo.

These moderate improvements and relying on testing will never catch any real cheating. It didn't in cycling and it won't in racing. All it does is provide a smokescreen that horsemen actually care.

Everyone in the know in racing realizes that the amount of cheating going on now is widespread. Look at the some of the results the last few years in the marquee Grade 1 races held in Security and out of Security. Many of the elite trainers are the biggest offenders. Everyone knows it and even when they get caught it get's swept under the rug. Accidental, coincidence, contamination.

Take a look at the results over the next few weeks and months. When a horse improves miraculously or does something beyond belief just take a minute and think about Lance Armstrong and his miraculous rides up the mountains in France that everyone ooh'd and ahh'd about even though it was obvious that he wasn't clean. The exact same thing happens in racing. Particularly on races that don't have enhanced security and out of competition testing.
And don't worry nothing will change. No one really wants to pull back the covers because what's under the covers is just too scary to see.

The key to your entire post is the second sentence "very few people inside racing". We need to specifically ask WHO are these insiders who don't want a clean game who actually have the power to make drastic changes.

If you own a track, your goal is to make money, cleaning up the game is costly in more ways than one, also, if other major track owners aren't on board, the cleaning up strategy won't be as effective.

64 dollar question is this. How will a cleaner game make the current track owner MORE money? Remember there are costs involved, so somehow betting handle Needs to rise up to not only cover the costs, but to show enough profit to make it worthwhile.

If you have proof handles will rise substantially, I'm sure tracks would listen. If you have no proof, than why would they gamble ?

[Hoofless_Wonder]

Originally Posted by AndyC

Hong Kong is not really subject to the market forces that affect NA racing. If an owner or trainer in the US doesn't like what's happening in So. Cal they ship to Florida or Kentucky or NY.

True to a certain degree, but if you recall there was a time for many years in which NYRA was the last jurisdiction to NOT allow lasix. And the racing there was fine.

If the purses are high enough and the changes phased in with proper oversight, there's no reason NYRA couldn't backtrack and once again offer a better product for the player. It would take a number of years to do it, but then again Hong Kong was built in a day either.

[Stillriledup]

Originally Posted by Grits

Not sure what you term as an "animal lover" board, SRU. Perhaps you can explain further.

Its not every horse racing board on the internet that has grown men openly discussing their love of their pets, and their great sadness when they lose them. I'd say this is a board that very much cares about animals.

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...ts#post1784982

I just meant that this is a horse racing board first and foremost.

[Ruffian1]

Originally Posted by Hoofless_Wonder

True to a certain degree, but if you recall there was a time for many years in which NYRA was the last jurisdiction to NOT allow lasix. And the racing there was fine.

If the purses are high enough and the changes phased in with proper oversight, there's no reason NYRA couldn't backtrack and once again offer a better product for the player. It would take a number of years to do it, but then again Hong Kong was built in a day either.

I know that thy did not allow lasix when others did, but the joke was that they allowed about 25 anti bleeding medications most of which were either not allowed in most other states that did have lasix or trainers shipping in had never heard of those drugs or were not able to give those drugs in their home states.
The old hay, oats and water stuff was cute but anything but accurate.
No exaggeration, when I was told over the phone what was available, I had not heard of most of them, and I had heard of all of them from other east coast tracks.

[HalvOnHorseracing]

Originally Posted by GatetoWire

Let's just be honest. Very few people inside racing really want to clean it up. Instead they want to maintain the status quo.

These moderate improvements and relying on testing will never catch any real cheating. It didn't in cycling and it won't in racing. All it does is provide a smokescreen that horsemen actually care.

Everyone in the know in racing realizes that the amount of cheating going on now is widespread. Look at the some of the results the last few years in the marquee Grade 1 races held in Security and out of Security. Many of the elite trainers are the biggest offenders. Everyone knows it and even when they get caught it get's swept under the rug. Accidental, coincidence, contamination.

Take a look at the results over the next few weeks and months. When a horse improves miraculously or does something beyond belief just take a minute and think about Lance Armstrong and his miraculous rides up the mountains in France that everyone ooh'd and ahh'd about even though it was obvious that he wasn't clean. The exact same thing happens in racing. Particularly on races that don't have enhanced security and out of competition testing.
And don't worry nothing will change. No one really wants to pull back the covers because what's under the covers is just too scary to see.

I was at the HBPA meeting last weekend, and one of the panelists talked about a survey that was done in Florida. 90% trainers/owners in favor of Lasix, 10% against. It would be correct to say very few people in racing want to change the Lasix rules.

[Stillriledup]

Originally Posted by HalvOnHorseracing

I was at the HBPA meeting last weekend, and one of the panelists talked about a survey that was done in Florida. 90% trainers/owners in favor of Lasix, 10% against. It would be correct to say very few people in racing want to change the Lasix rules.

Race secretaries just need to write in the conditions 'not eligible horses on Lasix'

Give trainers a window to wean the horses off Lasix and then somewhere in the next 6 months just start making Lasix horses in eligible.