Fire Victor Espinoza

[johnhannibalsmith]

Originally Posted by Rex Phinney

He hasn't won a meaningful race in 10 months.

...

That really doesn't sound like the definition of trounce.

[SG4]

Why is it that when international horses go around the world to race they're respected as globetrotters, but California Chrome makes the Dubai trip & considers Ascot & now his connections are considered idiots & doing wrong by the horse? If you had a once in a lifetime horse why not take advantage by doing once in a lifetime things? He was hardly embarrassed yesterday, and he'd be up against it at Ascot but isn't it exciting to at least consider such a sporting venture? These are the types of things I dream about doing if I was a small time owner with a big time horse.

[letswastemoney]

I guess Lea was destroyed if California Chrome was "trounced" in Dubai.

What exactly does he need to do to earn respect anyway, go on a super winning streak like Zenyatta? Horses win and horses lose.

To think a horse that just ran second in Dubai didn't belong in that race is quite possibly the dumbest logic I've ever heard.

[NY BRED]

according to TVG Mr. Sherman was unaware of the plans to
go to Ascot, so these jerks feel they are better trainers than
Art.

You all saw Steve Coburn after the Belmont, now you determine
how f*&%ng stupid and greedy these people are.


Hope this horse survives this journey,wondering what Vegas would give as Odds that Art Sherman continues as trainer.

Talk about humilating the horse, now look at the payback for the trainer.

Morale: No good deeds go unpunished.

[breezing]

nevermind.

[nearco]

Originally Posted by NY BRED

according to TVG Mr. Sherman was unaware of the plans to
go to Ascot, so these jerks feel they are better trainers than
Art.

You all saw Steve Coburn after the Belmont, now you determine
how f*&%ng stupid and greedy these people are.


Hope this horse survives this journey,wondering what Vegas would give as Odds that Art Sherman continues as trainer.

Talk about humilating the horse, now look at the payback for the trainer.

Morale: No good deeds go unpunished.

That's apparently not true. The decison to go to Ascot was made before the DWC and the reason the particular trainer with whom he will be stabled with in England was picked is because his right hand man used to work for Art Sherman.

[Appy]

Regardless of where Chrome is racing, would Espinoza be the guy you would have riding him?

[Relwob Owner]

Originally Posted by nearco

That's apparently not true. The decison to go to Ascot was made before the DWC and the reason the particular trainer with whom he will be stabled with in England was picked is because his right hand man used to work for Art Sherman.

This article seems to it is true he didn't know, unless Im missing something in it.

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-raci...ough-on-chrome

[nearco]

Originally Posted by Relwob Owner

This article seems to it is true he didn't know, unless Im missing something in it.

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-raci...ough-on-chrome

http://www.thenational.ae/sport/hors...d-to-newmarket

Perry Martin, who bred and owns California Chrome in conjunction with Steve Coburn, made the decision in midweek although it was clearly contingent on the chestnut colt running well in the World Cup.

Guest’s stable was chosen because Chris Mills, the owner of Mirza, has a son, Robert, who works as an apprentice with Guest. A few years ago Robert Mills worked in California with Art Sherman, and as he was riding Mirza in morning trackwork at Meydan, the link was re-established.

The Shermans will return to America and assistant trainer Alan Sherman intends to act as the vanguard in early May, when he will fly to England to apply the finishing touches should California Chrome run at Newbury.

After California Chrome’s run at Meydan, Sherman Snr revealed that he intended to give his stable flag-bearer a rest, stating that the four year old was going to be a tired horse after two runs already this season.

“They won’t do much with him for around ten days,” Sherman Jnr said. “We’ll let Rae tinker with him for a bit until he is bucking and kicking again, and then get back into training. We don’t have a Kentucky Derby horse this year so going to England in early May for me should not be a problem.”

Hard to believe Sherman didn't know, seeing as somebody who worked for him was the link between the two trainers. Also sounds like they have it all figured out about how the horse will be trained and Sherman's son going over in May to spearhead things. Doubt all that got arranged without Sherman's knowledge.

[lamboguy]

i highly doubt that a 77 year old trainer that has been around horses his whole life would have anything to do with with making a dumb move like this one.

[DelMarJay]

Isn't this board for intelligent debate and analysis?

Man, this horse aint Seattle Slew. Chrome has a very limited ability to make CASH in the breeding shed, at least for a few years(and then only if he could produce some solid stakes runners).

He made over 2 mil. including appearance fees on this 1 trip! He was running on a brand new track in a DESERT AT NIGHT and ran better than
many of us had expected.

Shouldn't have been 4/5 with above stated factors, but don't blame the horse for a bad bet. I'm also not getting the vitriol over the
trainer/training, workouts, jockey/ride(s) and down home owners. Again, this aint FREAKING SEATTLE SLEW! The connections have been shot down from day one and continue to be attacked(yes, admittedly they've had some PR problems).

Easy in hindsight to complain about everything regarding Chrome's handling, but excuse me for not seeing it. MINT has been made, rides have not been "BAD" by jock standards, and who the hell knows how a particular horse should be worked unless you're in the shed working with Chrome every day.

I say here's(champagne clink) to a very good horse who has made a fortune and has a great fandom who need to realize it's not F'ng SEATTLE SLEW!!
Now I'll take the arrows and slings.

[classhandicapper]

1. If Chrome still doesn't want to run between or inside horses, I consider that a failing of some sort on either the horse's part or the trainer's part. It's been long enough to overcome that issue (if there really is one).

2. If the horse can get comfortable in other spots, then having him 4 wide first turn when the pace was lively was a bad ride given that this horse has tractable speed and could easily have backed off. It sounded to me like Sherman was not pleased with the ride.

I had no bet on the race, but while I was watching it with a friend, I was yelling at the TV he had NO CHANCE while they were still going into the first turn. That's an almost impossible trip unless the outside part of the track is playing better (which was tough to tell off such a limited sample of races), they are absolutely walking on the lead (which they weren't), or you are TONS the best horse (which he was not).

IMO, he ran a big race.

Forget about the winner for a minute because it's tougher to get a really good line on him. CC beat Lea, who we know is a very solid Grade 1 racehorse, despite the tougher trip. And based on the rest of the result, it looks like Lea ran his race.

This is the only horse that can run 2nd in the Dubai World Cup despite a rough trip, earn 2 million dollars, and somehow still be controversial because he isn't an all time great.

[castaway01]

Originally Posted by DelMarJay

Isn't this board for intelligent debate and analysis?

Man, this horse aint Seattle Slew. Chrome has a very limited ability to make CASH in the breeding shed, at least for a few years(and then only if he could produce some solid stakes runners).

He made over 2 mil. including appearance fees on this 1 trip! He was running on a brand new track in a DESERT AT NIGHT and ran better than
many of us had expected.

Shouldn't have been 4/5 with above stated factors, but don't blame the horse for a bad bet. I'm also not getting the vitriol over the
trainer/training, workouts, jockey/ride(s) and down home owners. Again, this aint FREAKING SEATTLE SLEW! The connections have been shot down from day one and continue to be attacked(yes, admittedly they've had some PR problems).

Easy in hindsight to complain about everything regarding Chrome's handling, but excuse me for not seeing it. MINT has been made, rides have not been "BAD" by jock standards, and who the hell knows how a particular horse should be worked unless you're in the shed working with Chrome every day.

I say here's(champagne clink) to a very good horse who has made a fortune and has a great fandom who need to realize it's not F'ng SEATTLE SLEW!!
Now I'll take the arrows and slings.

So let me get this straight---you think we all feel California Chrome is as good as bleepin' Seattle Slew, but you're smart enough to know better? I'm not sure you mentioned that enough times for us to follow your "intelligent" discussion.

Yeah, breeding 100 to 150 times a season at $10,000 a pop, they can't make any money that way...

[Tom]

Originally Posted by Some_One

How is the horse at risk doing what it was born to do?

Yes, and doing it while finishing second in the richest race in the world.
Wish I was that stupid!

No comments required.......

[Tom]

Further, do trainers like Pletcher, Shug, Hollendorfer , Mott go to
Dubai with their First or even second stringers?

Mott was there Saturday.
With his BC winner Main Sequence.
Got his arse handed to him.