payment from Presque Isle - Page 2 - Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com

Ray Paulick · 10-23-2014, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lamboguy

to the best of my knowledge nothing has been straightened out yet. there was no answer again today at the horseman's bookeeper's office. i spoke with another large trainer and owner that is due over $80,000 and he is going through the same thing as i am.

as far as i know, this is never supposed to happen. in my life i have never heard of a racetrack that needs to borrow money to pay an owner for a claimed horse. for that matter, i have never heard of a race track having to get a loan to pay a purse that took place 5 weeks ago.

i only brought this up because this is bazaar. i can afford to wait for my money, but some guys can't.

Agree that it should not happen. I heard from an owner today who is owed a considerable amount, and he has not been paid. I called another owner who said he is all paid up. Both are in the top 15 or so by money won at the meeting. My understanding (based on assurances, not hard evidence) is that checks are going out this week.

lamboguy · 10-23-2014, 07:14 PM

Ray, Debbie Howell is a nice person that i have spoken with on numerous occasions. she told you that there was some type of mechanical mix up in the purse disbursements. to be honest with you, i have no idea why the purse would have anything to do with paying for a claimed horse. i don't think that money goes to some other agency and then back to the horsemen's account to be paid off. that's the part that doesn't make sense to me.

thaskalos · 10-23-2014, 07:15 PM

"The check is in the mail".

Somehow I never thought that racinos would have to resort to this type of lame excuse.

lamboguy · 10-23-2014, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thaskalos

"The check is in the mail".

Somehow I never thought that racinos would have to resort to this type of lame excuse.

i can promise you one thing, if the paychecks for any of these employee's at these tracks were 10 minutes late, they would have some one arrested.

johnhannibalsmith · 10-23-2014, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lamboguy

...i have no idea why the purse would have anything to do with paying for a claimed horse. i don't think that money goes to some other agency and then back to the horsemen's account to be paid off. that's the part that doesn't make sense to me.

This is the sticker if it is as you said.

With all the source streams into the purse fund I can imagine where it would get all snarled up due to over/under being off.

But if you have zero in the account at first post, a horse claimed for $10k in race 1, you should be able to drop for $10 on a new horse in race 2 unless they have something super nutty there. The claim part as told can't be explained away by this bottleneck or whatever.

Brogan · 10-23-2014, 07:29 PM

Perhaps some states have different rules than others, BUT...

Purse accounts are purse accounts and shouldn't be mixed with other funds. If they (the track) offered the race at a stated purse, they needed to have sufficient funds in an account designated for that purpose.

Owner accounts are funds held in trust for the owner. Funds are transferred from one owner's account to another when there is a valid claim. There's any number of lawyers that have been disbarred for dipping into client's accounts. If this is what Presque Isle has done, there should be immediate legal ramifications.

Mineshaft · 10-23-2014, 07:40 PM

what if lambo wanted to claim a horse the same nite his horse got claimed. He filled out the slip, they checked with the book keeper to see if lambo had enough money in the account and they say Nope. Then what? They void his claim and the horse does get claimed by another owner and the horse goes onto make 100K after the claim. Then what?

tampahorseplayer · 10-23-2014, 10:30 PM

Stall tactics anyone??? Technically the claim $$ should not be going to the horsemans fund or whatever since it isnt theirs to distribute. It goes from one owner to the next, simple as that. I was always under the impresson if your horse was claimed you could go right to the bookeeper and get the claim $$ same day. Something seems off from what ray was told vs lambo, why the descrepency. youd think lambo would hear a story of the same kind of details, why would an employee tell lambo that. Getting a loan to pay off claims is wayyyy off from the $$ being choked up somewhere along the line.

westny · 10-23-2014, 10:40 PM

Higher a criminal attorney with others who haven't been paid. Sued them for fraud, theft and what else they are guilty of. You'll get your money then.

Appy · 10-24-2014, 01:12 AM

Go get your horse back and tell the guy you never got paid. See what he says about not having paid for the horse. This would be the old "misery loves company" move.

Robert Goren · 10-24-2014, 06:58 AM

These people are crooks. They ran short of money and dipped into accounts they should have. This happens everyday in business and people go to jail for doing it. All I can say is don't do business anyone connected with place ever again. Everybody there knows what is going on and if they had one shred of integrity, they would have been gone a long ago.

Mineshaft · 10-24-2014, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Goren

These people are crooks. They ran short of money and dipped into accounts they should have. This happens everyday in business and people go to jail for doing it. All I can say is don't do business anyone connected with place ever again. Everybody there knows what is going on and if they had one shred of integrity, they would have been gone a long ago.

If me or you do this guess what would happen? We would be in jail waiting to get bonded out? This whole story is fishy to me.

lamboguy · 10-24-2014, 09:23 AM

this is the second time that proves to me that the Pennsylvania Racing Commission doesn't do its job. this time they insulted the intelligence of Ray Paulick, a person who works hard to present the facts in this game, i love his work and realize that the game would be in even worse shape if he wasn't here to keep things in line.

the only reason i went to Presque Isle to begin with is because i like giving horses to this one trainer there. i think i am going to make the move to Woodbine next year. they do a first class job, its quite evident that they care about the game, they do have the lowest takeout in w-p-w wagering. their simulcast production is top notch as well. i have watched Dawn Lupul and can tell you that she doesn't make things up as she goes along. she knows this game and has a great eye for horse flesh. the all weather course is maintained every day and looks great. when you look at the turf course that is on the outside of the track and i believe 1 1/2 miles is also perfectly maintained. there is no argument with that turf being the best on the continent. i have sent up horses to other trainers there for years and never hear complaints on how the backside looks. i am also told the track kitchen puts out great food.

so if anyone is looking for a place to send their horses, i highly reccomend the place for owners and trainers.

Brogan · 10-24-2014, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mineshaft

what if lambo wanted to claim a horse the same nite his horse got claimed. He filled out the slip, they checked with the book keeper to see if lambo had enough money in the account and they say Nope. Then what? They void his claim and the horse does get claimed by another owner and the horse goes onto make 100K after the claim. Then what?

Its a shell game...or a game of musical chairs. They would have allowed lambo to claim off the "funds" in his account. Its the next guy that would be stuck if he tried to withdraw from his account. Don't be the last guy standing when the music stops.

Its nothing more than a Ponzi scheme...everything is fine until you want to cash out.

onefast99 · 10-24-2014, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnhannibalsmith

This is the sticker if it is as you said.

With all the source streams into the purse fund I can imagine where it would get all snarled up due to over/under being off.

But if you have zero in the account at first post, a horse claimed for $10k in race 1, you should be able to drop for $10 on a new horse in race 2 unless they have something super nutty there. The claim part as told can't be explained away by this bottleneck or whatever.

That is true but I have seen where an owners horse was claimed in race 3(MP) for 25k and he went in to claim one for 25k in the 7th but didn't have enough funds due to the state tax! Claim was voided, horse went on to win 3 of its next 5 races...