Good Ole D Wayne Lukas

[Mineshaft]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

I think running horses over their head is a really bad idea.

1. You are throwing away a race where the horse might have some earnings power of spotted properly

2. I've seen a lot of very promising horses never come back from a drubbing

Whether the horse is spotted properly is somewhat subjective. There's a difference between aggressive and crazy. But I don't think occasionally winning a big race with some longshot justifies the practice any more that occasionally cashing a bet on a longshot but still losing money on them over the long haul does. It's a long term thing.

Bingoooo we have a winner...........................

[maclr11]

Making money is a secondary goal for d Wayne. Lukas just wants to be in the big races, what does he care if he wins a 47k msw now. This isn't a one horse mom and pop operation who need this horse to win to survive. One of the major keys to d Wayne's strategy and a way to make money through breeding is to win the marquee races. Aka triple crown races. You can't make the derby field by winning a maiden race. Take the shot, if you think you have the horse go for it. This horse obviously has some talent. There's a limited number of derby points, there's a msw every weekend. You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. Plus you can't say he didn't gain experience in a big field and now they have tried the best and know that he's not there yet. And guess what there's a msw race coming up this weekend, next weekend, 2 weeks from now, and at every distance and surface you could imagine.

[Relwob Owner]

Originally Posted by Mineshaft

runs a Maiden in the Risen Star and I think he just crossed the finish line


freakin goofball

We get it. You think he runs horses over their heads at times. You have covered that ground and he has done that.

However, the man is an amazing trainer who has withstood the test of time and saying he is a "goofball", especially after his training jobs the last year or so, makes you sound like the goofball.

[Stillriledup]

Originally Posted by Relwob Owner

We get it. You think he runs horses over their heads at times. You have covered that ground and he has done that.

However, the man is an amazing trainer who has withstood the test of time and saying he is a "goofball", especially after his training jobs the last year or so, makes you sound like the goofball.

He's an amazing talker, can sell snow to the eskimos, and has the ability to convince rich and intellgent businessmen to buy large animals that havent even proven they can run at all. As far as him withstanding the test of time on his horsemanship skills and classifying his runners properly? Im thinking not as much as his legendary status as a motivational speaker.

[cj]

Originally Posted by maclr11

Making money is a secondary goal for d Wayne. Lukas just wants to be in the big races, what does he care if he wins a 47k msw now. This isn't a one horse mom and pop operation who need this horse to win to survive. One of the major keys to d Wayne's strategy and a way to make money through breeding is to win the marquee races. Aka triple crown races. You can't make the derby field by winning a maiden race. Take the shot, if you think you have the horse go for it. This horse obviously has some talent. There's a limited number of derby points, there's a msw every weekend. You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. Plus you can't say he didn't gain experience in a big field and now they have tried the best and know that he's not there yet. And guess what there's a msw race coming up this weekend, next weekend, 2 weeks from now, and at every distance and surface you could imagine.

Well said.

[turninforhome10]

Originally Posted by maclr11

. And guess what there's a msw race coming up this weekend, next weekend, 2 weeks from now, and at every distance and surface you could imagine.

What condition book are you reading? FG has one race going long for 3yo's males on the 12th of March. No assurances that it will fill, but I imagine it will. But to say that there is all these races to run in, is coming from where? He could ship between FG and OP but here are the races.
FG http://www.equibase.com/premium/eqbH...0220-20140312D

OP http://www.equibase.com/premium/eqbH...0221-20140313D

That is my point. Finding a 3yo MSW going long for straight 3yo's is no guarantee this time of year. Probable? Yes. Guaranteed? NO.

[maclr11]

It was more of a generic point. FG, Oaklawn, Gulfstream, Turfway, Aqueduct, Santa, Sam Houston, Tampa take your pick it's D. Wayne Lukas you think he's afraid to ship. Extras come up all the time, I'm sure if he asks for an extra they might listen to him. He can find a sprint, route, turf, poly, low purse, high purse. 3YO maidens are not on the list of horses that are hard to get in.

[wisconsin]

Originally Posted by Stillriledup

He's an amazing talker, can sell snow to the eskimos, and has the ability to convince rich and intellgent businessmen to buy large animals that havent even proven they can run at all. As far as him withstanding the test of time on his horsemanship skills and classifying his runners properly? Im thinking not as much as his legendary status as a motivational speaker.

You are out of your mind. This guy was training horses in Wisconsin as a kid. He clearly has the skills. Who cares if he gives great motivational speeches. What does that have to do with anything?

The ridiculous disdain for this man blows my mind.

[speed]

It's not like his assistant trainers over the years have gone out on their own and had any success.

[taxicab]

I wouldn't be so hard on the old Coach for running maidens in tough spots.
Trivia question.
Who's the only trainer in history to win a Breeders Cup race with a maiden ?
Yup.....

[Stillriledup]

Originally Posted by wisconsin

You are out of your mind. This guy was training horses in Wisconsin as a kid. He clearly has the skills. Who cares if he gives great motivational speeches. What does that have to do with anything?

The ridiculous disdain for this man blows my mind.

Skills? His best skill was to convince really rich people to purchase yearlings for millions of dollars and give them to HIM to train. Do you know how many dollars his owners spent at the yearlings sales over the years? A little bit more than most people. And, when those same owners died or got out of the game, he didnt have all those fancy yearlings and he fell off the map

My comments stated that his success has a LOT to do with his ability to wear nice suits, have a very cool pair of shades, be tall and handsome and speak like a presidential candidate, oh yeah, and hire amazing assistants.

Do you think that his "training" got great horses and his people skills had nothing to do with it? There's no "distain" for anything, we are just calling a spade a spade. Go to equibase and look at his "earnings" breakdown year after year.....did he "forget" how to train? No, if anything, he got better, smarter and more experience as the years have gone on, yet, his earnings went down drastically......that had nothing to do with "skills" and had everything to do with a lack of owners buying him fancy horses.

[wisconsin]

Originally Posted by Stillriledup

Skills? His best skill was to convince really rich people to purchase yearlings for millions of dollars and give them to HIM to train. Do you know how many dollars his owners spent at the yearlings sales over the years? A little bit more than most people. And, when those same owners died or got out of the game, he didnt have all those fancy yearlings and he fell off the map

My comments stated that his success has a LOT to do with his ability to wear nice suits, have a very cool pair of shades, be tall and handsome and speak like a presidential candidate, oh yeah, and hire amazing assistants.

Do you think that his "training" got great horses and his people skills had nothing to do with it? There's no "distain" for anything, we are just calling a spade a spade. Go to equibase and look at his "earnings" breakdown year after year.....did he "forget" how to train? No, if anything, he got better, smarter and more experience as the years have gone on, yet, his earnings went down drastically......that had nothing to do with "skills" and had everything to do with a lack of owners buying him fancy horses.

Yeah, his assistants just happened to know everything.

Todd Pletcher, Michael Maker, Kiaran McLaughlin, Dallas Stewart, Bobby Barnett, Mark Hennig, Randy Bradshw, and his own son, who was going to good. They all came in and did not learn a thing from Lukas.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by maclr11

Making money is a secondary goal for d Wayne. Lukas just wants to be in the big races, what does he care if he wins a 47k msw now. This isn't a one horse mom and pop operation who need this horse to win to survive. One of the major keys to d Wayne's strategy and a way to make money through breeding is to win the marquee races. Aka triple crown races. You can't make the derby field by winning a maiden race. Take the shot, if you think you have the horse go for it. This horse obviously has some talent. There's a limited number of derby points, there's a msw every weekend. You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. Plus you can't say he didn't gain experience in a big field and now they have tried the best and know that he's not there yet. And guess what there's a msw race coming up this weekend, next weekend, 2 weeks from now, and at every distance and surface you could imagine.

We all understand the strategy, but like a I said, winning a marquee race doesn't necessarily justify the strategy if you blow a couple of million dollars in purse money by running in a series of bad spots and also ruin a few horses along the way doing it.

He may be a great horseman, but I would never give one of my horses to him unless I had complete control over the race selection process. If I couldn't get a Mott, Shug, Shirreffs, or someone like that, I'd rather give my horse to someone who shows flashes of promise but hasn't had the stock yet (maybe Leah Gyarmati).

[therussmeister]

Originally Posted by Mineshaft

runs a Maiden in the Risen Star and I think he just crossed the finish line


freakin goofball

Judging by this post I assumed the horse finished last, but he didn't. So why aren't we talking about good old Robert Pincins, Clark Thomas, or Danny Pish?

[Mineshaft]

Originally Posted by therussmeister

Judging by this post I assumed the horse finished last, but he didn't. So why aren't we talking about good old Robert Pincins, Clark Thomas, or Danny Pish?

Has Pish ever run a Maiden in a Grade 2 race?