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02-11-2013, 01:03 AM
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#46
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by PICSIX
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Next we'll be throwing in the racing secretary for carding races that enable them to win
Look there are cheaters unfortunately . If you don't believe that investments made to keep horses in good shape and hiring good conditioners can produce winners , then you will never trust a high percentage trainer .
If they are using illegal narcotics , then they need to be severely punished .
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02-11-2013, 01:07 AM
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#47
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by tzipi
OK that's fine, Amoss is clean with all his infractions in multiple states and her 22 wins out of 39 starters is clean. I'll say it's a crazy ITM% and Win% but we'll have to agree to disagree Nijinsky  . |
Civil enough for me .
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02-11-2013, 02:46 AM
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#48
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Austin, Tx
Posts: 2,752
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by nijinski
Next we'll be throwing in the racing secretary for carding races that enable them to win
Look there are cheaters unfortunately . If you don't believe that investments made to keep horses in good shape and hiring good conditioners can produce winners , then you will never trust a high percentage trainer .
If they are using illegal narcotics , then they need to be severely punished .
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Are you kidding? You aren't seriously debating whether Tom Amoss is winning cleanly right? You don't need a database of infractions to prove or disprove. How about simple arithmatic?
Bring Tom Amoss' statistics to any insurance underwriter to crunch the numbers and provide probability statistics regarding the liklihood that those numbers are achievable in large quantities and the odds are lots of millions to one against.
Do we have to be so dull and obvious as to defend this and not just agree that it is statistically impossible to win with this high rate while using the same, legal practices of their peers?
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02-11-2013, 02:49 AM
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#49
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 25,607
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Valento
Are you kidding? You aren't seriously debating whether Tom Amoss is winning cleanly right? You don't need a database of infractions to prove or disprove. How about simple arithmatic?
Bring Tom Amoss' statistics to any insurance underwriter to crunch the numbers and provide probability statistics regarding the liklihood that those numbers are achievable in large quantities and the odds are lots of millions to one against.
Do we have to be so dull and obvious as to defend this and not just agree that it is statistically impossible to win with this high rate while using the same, legal practices of their peers?
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He's making it look easy and pretty soon might be looking for a 'harder game' to conquer.
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02-11-2013, 05:11 AM
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#50
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Youngstown, Ohio
Posts: 2,053
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Doesn't Amoss fill in on TVG sometimes? Next time he does, flood Twitter (we all follow Todd, Geno, Paul) with these accusations. Isn't that what TVG is all about now?
RR
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02-11-2013, 06:23 AM
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#51
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Boston+Ocala
Posts: 23,761
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by rrpic6
Doesn't Amoss fill in on TVG sometimes? Next time he does, flood Twitter (we all follow Todd, Geno, Paul) with these accusations. Isn't that what TVG is all about now?
RR
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watching TVG these days is like waiting for the rigor mortis to set in
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02-11-2013, 07:58 AM
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#52
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NJ
Posts: 3,822
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by bob60566
Excellent post 
But have the yearly handle in racing in North America not been in steady decline 30% since the peak in late seventies, that is close to three decades ago. |
No, your information is incorrect. Handle peaked at 15.1 billion dollars in 2003.
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02-11-2013, 09:26 AM
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#53
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Racing Form Detective
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lincoln, Ne but my heart is at Santa Anita
Posts: 16,316
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by castaway01
No, your information is incorrect. Handle peaked at 15.1 billion dollars in 2003.
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I wonder what happen if you adjusted those numbers for inflation.
__________________
Some day in the not too distant future, horse players will betting on computer generated races over the net. Race tracks will become casinos and shopping centers. And some crooner will be belting out "there used to be a race track here".
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02-11-2013, 09:42 AM
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#54
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Boston+Ocala
Posts: 23,761
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robert Goren
I wonder what happen if you adjusted those numbers for inflation.
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no doubt a lot worse than what it looks like
this saturday, The Donn Handicap Day in Gulfstream, with a $2 million Rainbow Pick Six carryover, only managed to do total handle of $17 million. i was there 30 years ago when they did $12 million that day without a carryover or simulcast wagering.
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02-11-2013, 09:52 AM
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#55
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: NE Ohio
Posts: 16,487
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by lamboguy
no doubt a lot worse than what it looks like
this saturday, The Donn Handicap Day in Gulfstream, with a $2 million Rainbow Pick Six carryover, only managed to do total handle of $17 million. i was there 30 years ago when they did $12 million that day without a carryover or simulcast wagering.
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That's amazing. No full card simulcasting in 1983 (except for LV) and they probably ran 9 races. They ran 12 live races there last Saturday.
1983 Donn....did Bates Motel ever run at Gulfstream?
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02-11-2013, 11:25 AM
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#56
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Vancouver Island
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,747
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robert Goren
I wonder what happen if you adjusted those numbers for inflation.
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http://www.paulickreport.com/news/ray-s-paddock/thinking-bout-the-old-times-racing-trends-then-and-now/
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02-11-2013, 11:32 AM
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#57
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NJ
Posts: 3,822
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robert Goren
I wonder what happen if you adjusted those numbers for inflation.
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Separate question; I was just addressing the original statement. Obviously they're worse.
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02-11-2013, 11:32 AM
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#58
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Boston+Ocala
Posts: 23,761
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Valuist
That's amazing. No full card simulcasting in 1983 (except for LV) and they probably ran 9 races. They ran 12 live races there last Saturday.
1983 Donn....did Bates Motel ever run at Gulfstream?
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vegas didn't have it then either. they booked more action than the track handled. horse racing was big, but back then tracks were family run, today most of them are run by the corporates.
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02-11-2013, 08:14 PM
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#59
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Valento
Are you kidding? You aren't seriously debating whether Tom Amoss is winning cleanly right? You don't need a database of infractions to prove or disprove. How about simple arithmatic?
Bring Tom Amoss' statistics to any insurance underwriter to crunch the numbers and provide probability statistics regarding the liklihood that those numbers are achievable in large quantities and the odds are lots of millions to one against.
Do we have to be so dull and obvious as to defend this and not just agree that it is statistically impossible to win with this high rate while using the same, legal practices of their peers?
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No I'm not kidding .
There is no proof medically that the class of drugs involved here will alter a race . This is why I have a problem with the smear tactics .
Therapeutic is what they are . Overages are not allowed , so I would then agree with a penalty but you have no proof that there is an edge due to
a substance used . Show me all the class 1 offenses and I would be quite upset with Amoss . It doesn't look to be the case .
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02-11-2013, 09:36 PM
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#60
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 7,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by lamboguy
no doubt a lot worse than what it looks like
this saturday, The Donn Handicap Day in Gulfstream, with a $2 million Rainbow Pick Six carryover, only managed to do total handle of $17 million. i was there 30 years ago when they did $12 million that day without a carryover or simulcast wagering.
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Not to derail the irresponsible posting in this thread, but the Rainbow Six handled $695K. Of course everyone takes any figures you give with a mountain of salt.
How many people were at Funny Cide's JCGC win again?
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