Software Purchasers

[Dave Schwartz]

Question:

If we had such a contest as is currently being dicussed on PA, what chance is there that you would purchase one of the competing products?

[gino]

Dave,
with all due respect to programmers and players everywhere, this contest idea is idiotic...my take on it is this...set up one workstation per program in some mall or rock concert or rest home or 4th grade class...randomly choose 100 playas, let 'em pick the winner in 100 races....this is a cut above the infinite # of monkeys approach, but it is a fair way to test "the program" "out of the box"...
this is not meant to be a Shameless Plug, but one of the nattering nabobs(god, i miss Spiro Agnew)(talk about a guy who was ahead of his time) is going to be on the attack any minute, but i own HSH. it isn't the first program i've owned, but i'm pretty damn sure it's the last...
at the moment software, hardware, the universe and, most importantly, me, are in an ever so slightly out of tune harmonic convergance///\\\\
am i on the way to A Palm Tree Named Gino?
mebbe.
will i wind up living in my car again?
mebbe.
betting on horses is a crazy way to make a living, and no "program" bets.
HSH is a fantastic tool, but my dexterity comes and goes, and so do the $$$, that's why most people have regular jobs...
so Dave and the rest of you gifted mad scientists, get back to the work bench and grind out more/better code to help your loyal(hah!) cult following, and the rest of you , quit your goddam whining and wondering and go bet the livin' shite(if u spell it Gaelic, it's ok, PA?) out of your picks.
quit worrying about Cliff Goodrich and short fields and doped horses...have some f&&*&%ing fun before it's all over...
bet where you're happy.
that's what's great about the USA, money doesn't just buy votes, money is the vote.
gino
#5 in the 5th

[Secretariat]

Dave,

I had kind of hoped those numbers on the poll would be reversed.

It seems users go into a handicapping software thread, but the great majority of them would not buy a software program, based on the actual developers demonstrating the features; by making selections ahead of time, for no contest remuneration, plus taking time way from development to thier own product upgrades. I must say I am a bit dissapointed in the poll results thus far.

[lousycapper]

Must be more iconoclasts in this world than I thought? We want the black box...bring on the black box so that we can dance around it and worship it... put ears and a tail on it and we'll take it to bed with us... back to Perry Mason and the case of the MISSING BLACK BOX... LOL

-L.C.

[Maxspa]

All,
Many of us on this board have purchased many of the software offerings that have been discussed and analyzed. When I view the discussion groups that software providers have initiated, I find many of the same names as I see on this board. Lately, I've been very disappointed in the general trend of thought that software by itself, with some basic adjustments will not produce a profit. I also have learned that handicappers are getting custom software that fits their own philosophy and approach. Who knows the real results of those ventures. Which leads me to the point that if software providers are hiding behind the notion that software by itself will not make a profit, THEN BETTER SOFTWARE HAS TO BE DEVELOPED AND PEOPLE WILL BUY IT. Prove to the public that your software can make a legitimate profit and you'll be rewarded with lots of orders.
In an earlier post, I was not happy with the advertising approach that Tom Console used, stated so and gave specific examples of why I felt it was done in poor taste. Now I have to give Tom Console CREDIT for his guarantee of all your money back without taking out the unfair restocking fee if this software does not work for you. This is a necessary step to give credibility
to the software developers. Tom has taken a stand on the quality his software and as a result, I would more inclined to buy his program.
In summary, I believe people on this board are critical but they are fair. Case in point, Jaguar's review of Tom Console's software. Remember many of us have purchased all kinds of racing material and have witnessed first hand the lack of quality in some offerings. We will not be easily taken again.
Maxspa

[gino]

software doesn't make winning bets, dude...i'm not sure if maxspa is a big hot tub, or if you're max's pa, but if it's the former you been in the water too long, and if it's the latter, max better get an after school job...no computer program in the world is going to "make a profit" on its own...the game would be over, finito, Hal would have all the money....you are responsible for the success/failure of the bets...not Dave Schwarz, Doc Sartin, Mike Warren, or the Baby Jesus...
get a dartboard or call Tom Console, even better, keep betting...
gino
guns don't kill people, people with guns, knives, cars, bare hands, etc, kill people

[bucktron]

Food for Thought

Man will never fly.
Motion Pictures will never talk.
A computer program will never defeat a Chess Grand Master.

Never say Never! There may be computer handicappers out their living in million dollar houses driving Lincolns and BMWs claiming that they are $8.00 and hour Security Guards. The technical market collapse has created many strange bedfellows with lots of time and expertise. Many of these guys are capable of viewing problems in ways that an autistic mind would consider perfectly logical but traditional mainstream human intelligence could not conceive of. Usually quiet by nature, they don’t possess the Achilles heal of intense verbal communication. They normally lurk instead of speak. Their goal is simply maintaining the lifestyle that they have become accustom to. Never say Never! Just say it isn’t so. HAL may be listening.

[gino]

Bucko-
i totally agree with your post.
point well taken.
i may have come down a little hard on maxspa, but it was in the context of the so-called contest discussion...
it has always driven me a leetle crazy when people say "the program gave me blahblahblah..."
if it was just a grammatical slip-up or a turn of phrase, i'd let it go, but it seems to be a mindset that is becoming too pervasive in our culture...
Hal is always listening.
gino
"Never, ever, tell me the odds."
-Han Solo

[Maxspa]

Gino,
I stand firmly on my comments regarding computer software! This board works best when people can express their opinions and be open for different points of view. Although I disagree with your thoughts on this subject, I respect your right to express them.
Maxspa

[gino]

max-
as i do yours...and as i explained to bucko, i just nut up a little when i hear people talking about software "picking" winners, so my apologies are extended...you keep betting your way and i'll keep betting mine. i think there's more than enough to go around..
gino
quick, where's my "Odd-Rator"?

[VetScratch]

HAL may be listening.

I wouldn't put it past him. What a wimpy pest he's been since I finally had to tell him that he didn't meet my standards.

Give me a true Italian anyday. No matter what they say, it's always poetry to my ears!

[rmania]

Originally posted by gino
software doesn't make winning bets, dude...
...no computer program in the world is going to "make a profit" on its own...the game would be over, finito, Hal would have all the money....

I totally agree with you Gino, but not for the same reasons. My thought is that by the time a computer like Hal becomes a reality (i.e., analyzes the data, makes all of the decisions and phones in the bets) horse racing will be nothing more than a distant memory.

In the meantime, there ARE programs that run on our current (less sophisticated) computers that CAN produce a profit WITHOUT ANY USER INPUT. Of course, these profitable modes are limited. But, when combined with actual user input, the probabilities of “better than average” success abound. This proposed contest was supposed to prove just that. Or, at least, that was my interpretation.

As for myself, I decided to go ahead and start proving my claims rather than wait for a contest that may never happen. And I think I have accomplished my goal.

[sq764]

I think a lot of people do not want to admit that they have ever bought a handicapping program.. I guess its a pride thing.

Its the same thing when I hear people say they always win money at the track. If you hear 10 people talk and all 10 make money, its a good chance that 8 or 9 of them are lying.

[rmania]

Originally posted by sq764
I think a lot of people do not want to admit that they have ever bought a handicapping program.. I guess its a pride thing.

Its the same thing when I hear people say they always win money at the track. If you hear 10 people talk and all 10 make money, its a good chance that 8 or 9 of them are lying.

Good observation....

You can add to that... what I've noticed is that most of those who are willing to talk own software written by developers who maintain websites with a BBS (kinda like a support group ).

Maybe their successful..maybe not. I guess we'll never really know.

As for your first statement, there could be another reason they're not talking. It could be because they're actually winning. After all, why would they want tell anyone... as it may affect the odds (right !! )

Hell, I GAVE Stonepony (a proclaimed novice) a copy of my software hoping he/she would help to substantiate my claims. But, so far, Stonepony ain't talk'in.............

[Maxspa]

All,
I think we're being involved in a semantic interpretation. Of course the software doesn't make bets, but the software has a direct influence on the bet that the user makes. Secondly, the user in most software applications will have adjustments to make
before a final betting decision can be made. Most of us expect those input changes and actually want to be integral part of the
process. Since the software programs are doing the major number crunching as well as providing the informative handicapping aspects ex:trainer info etc. , it plays a critical role in the selection process. Quality software and good user adjustments should result in a positive R.O.I.
Maxspa