AP- on the edge of destruction!!

[SuperPickle]

Originally Posted by Valuist

Legalized sports betting will be the final nail in the coffin. And its hard to feel sorry for the sport of horse racing. They wanted the band aid, short-term fixes. They never listened to the public.

This is 100% correct. Sports betting will be everywhere when it comes. Almost like the lottery. It'll be the thing that takes 15-40% of handle and pushes out all the tracks gasping for air (Finger Lakes, Monmouth, Arlington, Turf Paradise, Hazel.)

The initial implementation with cull the heard. Then if and when they get to Euro style operations (online, prop, in-play) then its over. When we get to the point in this country that you can bet an NFL or NBA game in-play sitting on your couch its all she wrote.

[CincyHorseplayer]

I'm not buying the extinction theory. Regionally horses would go to one or two places if other tracks shut down. Right now minor league horses around me are competing at Indiana Downs, Belterra Park, Thistledown, and Ellis. As much as I hate to say it my hometown track could go. They are sorry ass bunch. In the first year of the Racino they slashed purses midway through the meet and the facility total F-in sucks. They have a damn canopy cover on the tiny grandstand. It's pathetic. They've written the same condition book for nearly 20 years except they edited out races that would attract better barns/horses so it's basically welfare for Ohio horsemen with the sorriest horses. Even in my state of Ohio the horses that would ship north to Thistledown would make their races better just by adding the winning types. Thistledown by the way is at least trying. They increased their purses after their first racino season and did it again last year I believe. Anyway contraction would be welcome. It would work IMO.

[MonmouthParkJoe]

Originally Posted by CincyHorseplayer

I'm not buying the extinction theory. Regionally horses would go to one or two places if other tracks shut down. Right now minor league horses around me are competing at Indiana Downs, Belterra Park, Thistledown, and Ellis. As much as I hate to say it my hometown track could go. They are sorry ass bunch. In the first year of the Racino they slashed purses midway through the meet and the facility total F-in sucks. They have a damn canopy cover on the tiny grandstand. It's pathetic. They've written the same condition book for nearly 20 years except they edited out races that would attract better barns/horses so it's basically welfare for Ohio horsemen with the sorriest horses. Even in my state of Ohio the horses that would ship north to Thistledown would make their races better just by adding the winning types. Thistledown by the way is at least trying. They increased their purses after their first racino season and did it again last year I believe. Anyway contraction would be welcome. It would work IMO.

I agree. I think alot depends on timing as well. Racinos have been around for some time now. There is alot of cross over into other areas of gambling by horse players but not vice versa. You would think handle would have dropped off the board with the casino cannibalizing our customer base. I still think it has, but the customers that the casinos have taken have now been replaced by the CRW outfits. So while handle has been stagnant or crept up a bit, alot has to do with the robots.

Alot will depend on how sports betting is rolled out. Monmouth, for example, estimates it could do something like $300 million a year in sports betting with around 3% going to purses which would certainly help in the short term. If sports betting is limited to B&M locations at first and given their split of on/off track handle, I dont think it will have that much bottom line impact to racing. If/when it moves to an online platform, that will hurt. If other jurisdictions can do the same, then it could really hurt. Given how long it takes things to get done in this industry, it could take a while.

[betovernetcapper]

For at least 20 years AP has threatened to close, if they didn't get the best racing dates, or a casino or whatever. If this time they do close, so what? It's part of Crapnet & I haven't bet there in years.
BTW each spring there has been the same story about exciting new stables with great horses and every year it's been the same old crowd with a lot of state bred races. Let them go & give the dates to Hawthorn. They are pretty decent people & I'm sure if they had the summer dates they could make it work.
Over the years AP has opposed Internet betting, rebates an anything else that would bring in business. Who needs them?

[wisconsin]

Originally Posted by betovernetcapper

For at least 20 years AP has threatened to close

They DID close in 1998 and 1999.

[Hapman]

Originally Posted by betovernetcapper

For at least 20 years AP has threatened to close, if they didn't get the best racing dates, or a casino or whatever. If this time they do close, so what? It's part of Crapnet & I haven't bet there in years.
BTW each spring there has been the same story about exciting new stables with great horses and every year it's been the same old crowd with a lot of state bred races. Let them go & give the dates to Hawthorn. They are pretty decent people & I'm sure if they had the summer dates they could make it work.
Over the years AP has opposed Internet betting, rebates an anything else that would bring in business. Who needs them?

Except no one wants to go to Hawthorne. AP is packed with well-off young families every weekend no matter how bad the product is. If you could get slots and get better purses and better fields too it would be the best option for the state going forward. The industry is almost completely dead though this is assuming there's a miracle and they can finally pass the damn slots. Otherwise there won't be even one track left here.

Overall, the sport needs to attract a younger generation and a place like AP is certainly far more up to the task than Hawthorne.

[illinoisbred]

Originally Posted by Hapman

Except no one wants to go to Hawthorne. AP is packed with well-off young families every weekend no matter how bad the product is. If you could get slots and get better purses and better fields too it would be the best option for the state going forward. The industry is almost completely dead though this is assuming there's a miracle and they can finally pass the damn slots. Otherwise there won't be even one track left here.

Overall, the sport needs to attract a younger generation and a place like AP is certainly far more up to the task than Hawthorne.

I live 20 some miles from Arlington but have not been there nor wagered on a race at that track in 3 years. From what a close friend that still almost daily attends Arlington tells me, the track has become a destination for hipsters. The track also plans many nonracing events on weekends (held though while racing is in progress) that appeal to hipsters. Betting must not be hip...hipsters haven't pushed a lot of money through the windows.

[Robert Fischer]

Wanted to bet against Oscar Performance, but they botched it.


Only 6 horses in the whole field , and it's sandwiched between a mediocre allowance, and a synth allowance that happens to be called a stake (bruce d).

not cool, Arlington

[Tom]

YouTube

Arlington needs a theme song...

Look at all the tracks, running today.
How many tracks, you gonna play?
They all got starting gates, but none are fillin'
You check with equibase, just to see who's still in.
It's a five horse race, so don't forget to bet place,
But you tell me over and over and over again my friend,
Ah, you don't believe we're on the eve of destruction.

The handle's down, the take out is rising,
Not a lot of good news, on the horizon.
You want to make a bet but what's the sense in playing
No one wants the lead, is all I'm saying.
And the timner's on the fritz, and that's where it's staying,
But you tell me over and over and over again my friend,
Ah, you don't believe we're on the eve of destruction.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by Tom

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I98KeKV_F9g

Arlington needs a theme song...

Look at all the tracks, running today.
How many tracks, you gonna play?
They all got starting gates, but none are fillin'
You check with equibase, just to see who's still in.
It's a five horse race, so don't forget to bet place,
But you tell me over and over and over again my friend,
Ah, you don't believe we're on the eve of destruction.

Give the man a Grammy!

[burnsy]

That's hilarious Tom , Eve of Destruction.

Its just fiction though, the game is thriving.......according to some.

[Tom]

The game can thrive and still not benefit the customers.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by Tom

The game can thrive and still not benefit the customers.

Only as long as the customers have "money to burn". When things get tight...the game stops "thriving".

[Robert Fischer]

They couldn't card a full field for the Secretariat, and they couldn't put the Secretariat in their multi-race sequence of Stakes, and now, in the current joke of a field, Oscar Performance isn't even the heavy false favorite he was supposed to be. (Too small of a field, and not enough dumb money tuning in).


PASS.

[GMB@BP]

Originally Posted by Robert Fischer

They couldn't card a full field for the Secretariat, and they couldn't put the Secretariat in their multi-race sequence of Stakes, and now, in the current joke of a field, Oscar Performance isn't even the heavy false favorite he was supposed to be. (Too small of a field, and not enough dumb money tuning in).


PASS.

will have to see the pace figures but that looked pretty legit