Is Everything You Believe a Lie

[46zilzal]

ridiculous on all counts

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by boxcar

You obviously don't believe in the existence of Absolute Truth. For what you just stated above cannot possibly be absolutely true, can it? "There can be no widespread agreement..." In other words, we can't know. Wow! How encouraging, how comforting is your self-defeating agnosticism.

You are wrong, as usual. Just because we can’t widely agree on what this “Absolute Truth” is doesn’t mean that it doesn’t exist. It just means that we can’t all recognize it when we meet it.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by Richie

and i am just the opposite as you, i gave my kids the bible, religion, education, conservatism. I gave them everything "concrete" that changed my life. I feel those opinions (facts to me) should not die with me, of course they can do what they want with it. It appears they are doing good.

That’s fine…but I must disagree with you on one thing. Religions are not “facts”…that’s why they require “faith” from their followers. The “facts” don’t need any ‘faith’ for their support.

[porchy44]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

These are loaded questions which lead down deep rabbit holes...IMO. There can be no widespread agreement on what is "good", "evil", "lie", or the "Truth"...with a capital "T".

Todays culture does not search for any positive truth but is dubious towards anything that claims to be true, except the truth in which they have created themselves. They think all truth claims must be taken apart except that one.
The only thing evil in todays culture is saying there is a thing called evil.

Just because people have "widespread agreements", doesn't mean there is no truth to the matter.

[xtb]

Originally Posted by kyle r

Tell me three big, important, widely held beliefs that are true in that they can withstand scrutiny that you can defend?

Death and taxes are two.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

You are wrong, as usual. Just because we can’t widely agree on what this “Absolute Truth” is doesn’t mean that it doesn’t exist. It just means that we can’t all recognize it when we meet it.

You're equivocating. Originally, your entire life revolved around your god OPINION. You placed great value on opinion, remember?

And if we can't recognize it, then this is a form of agnosticism. Even in this last statement you equivocate, moving from "can't widely agree" to "can't all recognize it". A lot of "can'ts here. And when you make such broad, sweeping generalizations, I take it that you do know WHO recognized it? Or is that something else that can't be known either?

Moreover, if Absolute Truth actually exists it should be obvious to all of us. I will point to three proofs of this: One theological, one philosophical and the other Natural, as in Natural Law.

Rom 1:19-20
19 ...since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities — his eternal power and divine nature — have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.
NIV

The philosophical are the Laws of Logic, without which rationale, coherent thought and communication would be impossible. It is absolutely true, for example, that a thing cannot exist and not exist at the same time and in the same sense, for this would be a self-contradictory, self-defeating and absurd proposition.

Finally, Natural Law could be defined as rules of human conduct which are inherently or intuitively known by all men to be true, for God has revealed his Absolute, Eternal Law to all of us (Rom 2:14-15). For example, it is always wrong to murder someone, etc.

So...you want to champion opinion? I will champion and boldly proclaim Truth which God has graciously revealed to me in multiple ways.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

That’s fine…but I must disagree with you on one thing. Religions are not “facts”…that’s why they require “faith” from their followers. The “facts” don’t need any ‘faith’ for their support.

Forgive this bad pun...but ABSOLUTELY not true! There are two kinds of faith: Rational and Irrational. The former relies solely on evidence and proof and these can be in the form of historical, metaphysical, etc.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by kyle r

Tell me three big, important, widely held beliefs that are true in that they can withstand scrutiny that you can defend?

1. The velocity of light in a vacuum is constant for all observers.
2. There are four primal forces that control everything, viz., gravity, the electric force, the strong force and the weak force.
3. The germ theory of disease.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by boxcar

You're equivocating. Originally, your entire life revolved around your god OPINION. You placed great value on opinion, remember?

And if we can't recognize it, then this is a form of agnosticism. Even in this last statement you equivocate, moving from "can't widely agree" to "can't all recognize it". A lot of "can'ts here. And when you make such broad, sweeping generalizations, I take it that you do know WHO recognized it? Or is that something else that can't be known either?

Moreover, if Absolute Truth actually exists it should be obvious to all of us. I will point to three proofs of this: One theological, one philosophical and the other Natural, as in Natural Law.

Rom 1:19-20
19 ...since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities — his eternal power and divine nature — have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.
NIV

The philosophical are the Laws of Logic, without which rationale, coherent thought and communication would be impossible. It is absolutely true, for example, that a thing cannot exist and not exist at the same time and in the same sense, for this would be a self-contradictory, self-defeating and absurd proposition.

Finally, Natural Law could be defined as rules of human conduct which are inherently or intuitively known by all men to be true, for God has revealed his Absolute, Eternal Law to all of us (Rom 2:14-15). For example, it is always wrong to murder someone, etc.

So...you want to champion opinion? I will champion and boldly proclaim Truth which God has graciously revealed to me in multiple ways.

I am not championing opinion...I said in my initial post here that opinion is unreliable and unverified...and that I wouldn't even pass my opinions on to my own son. How is that "championing opinion"?

Religion, politics, philosophy, psychology, morality, immorality...it's all opinion, and therefore all speculative. That's why we argue continually about them. "Absolute Truth" may very well exist...but it's very well hidden.

[kyle r]

Originally Posted by Actor

1. The velocity of light in a vacuum is constant for all observers.
2. There are four primal forces that control everything, viz., gravity, the electric force, the strong force and the weak force.
3. The germ theory of disease.

Physics is a weak area for me. I will make two comments and feel free to respond, but what I’d really like to engage you on is your belief in germ theory? You do tecognize it’s a THEORY, no, and not Germ FACT? So, as you will be putting forth the THEORY, you would be on defense. I, however, agree to answer all sincere questions directly and you’ll also ha e the right of cross examination.
On your other assertions, I know it isn’t exactly what you’re talking about, but are you aware the official measurement of the speed of light does change and quite often? And on gravity - the THEORY of Gravity - you do know that theory has changed over the years, most obviously going from a force based on attraction and mass to the idea that mass alters the contour of space. Also, you do realize in order to keep the current THEORY coherent, the existence of unobservable dark matter, dwarfing the mass of known matter, has to be postulated?

[Actor]

Originally Posted by porchy44

“The view that Jesus existed is held by virtually every expert on the planet”

I've looked into this claim. The vast majority of these "experts" are members of the clergy, ergo, they are paid to promote this view. Most of those who are not clerics have incomes derived from said promotion.

[46zilzal]

GERM FACT pal no less.


I have not spent over 30 years in medicine to believe it to be otherwise.

It is just like the CLOWNS who designate evolution as a theory: only 200 years of evidence seems no enough for those closed minded fools.

[kyle r]

Originally Posted by 46zilzal

GERM FACT pal no less.


I have not spent over 30 years in medicine to believe it to be otherwise.

It is just like the CLOWNS who designate evolution as a theory: only 200 years of evidence seems no enough for those closed minded fools.

Are you willing to sincerely and transparently defend it against a cross examination?

[kyle r]

Originally Posted by 46zilzal

GERM FACT pal no less.


I have not spent over 30 years in medicine to believe it to be otherwise.

It is just like the CLOWNS who designate evolution as a theory: only 200 years of evidence seems no enough for those closed minded fools.

By the way, I stipulate that bacteria exist, but viruses have not been shown to exist and neither has been proven to be pathogenic.

[PaceAdvantage]

Isn't it a fact that viruses are not actually life? Or did I misremember reading that somehow?

If they are not life...then what are they, exactly?