Becoming a winning player...

[Dave Schwartz]

I have begun this thread with the intention of facilitating the exchange of positive ideas that may be of assistance to someone hoping to achieve the state known as "winning player."

If you are already a winning player, I ask that you consider sharing whatever hints, tips, tricks, secrets, or ideas that you may have at your disposal.

I respectfully request that posters in this thread refrain from telling us why it is impossible to win in the long run, why it is impossible to be a professional, why nobody should want to be a professional why this poster must be lying because that can never work... etc.

There are so many positive voices here; it would be nice if they had a chance to speak unencumbered. Please check your attitude at the door.


What ideas do YOU have?


Regards,
Dave Schwartz

[Greyfox]

You have to believe that you can win.
Confidence is huge. Try and guarantee that your very first bet each day is a winner.

[JustRalph]

not this year (yet )

But a winner 5 of the last 6 years.

hints, tips, tricks, secrets?

1. Learn Race Shape and Pace

2. Par Times and theories behind same, make your own if needed.

3. Don't be afraid to change......... If you don't.....the game will (poly?) and you will lose.................

4. Good software helps

[Bruddah]

1. Realistically determine how much time, energy and resources you will be ready to expend. Are you willinging to work 10hrs. a day 7 days a week or are you willing to devote a much smaller amount of time, energy and resources.

2. Develop an actual work plan, as if, you will be working a full, or part time job.

3. Become an expert on the following subjects on the track(s) you will be playing. Remembering each track will take literally 100's of hours of dedication and "Burn Out", at some time, will eventually follow.

The better you know a single track, the tracks trainers, jockeys, owners and angles, the more profitable a handicapper you will be. I am not a "PRO" by any means, but I do make a nice score every year at Oaklawn. I have made a minimum of $15k to almost the amount which would qualify me as "PRO", by standards set in another thread. However, I consider myself a profitable Hobbyist and enjoy working during my race meet of choice.

P.S. I still spend 100's of hours on this meet. No one said it would be easy.

[russowen77]

I sure agree about the one track thing to a degree. I make money at Oaklawn and last meet was the best I ever had there. It is an advantage to know who the juicers are and which jock the will use when they spot em sure helps. Get to see a lot of folks scratching their head over how that nag got up for second and locals headed to cash.

I sure apprciate the time y'all are giving to help the ones of us who need it. The trouble is that I don't want my season over with in April.

[The Judge]

Have been a winning player for some time now but lets face it I wasn't winning much money. I use TMM I re- listen to the Value Tech tapes and put it into practice.

The most important thing that I started to do was play my bottom horses. Horses that have "no" numbers to speak of, so they are at the bottom of the rankings. They are playable because its a "heavy pressure race" you hit the p/p button and it ranks the horses the E are on top then the EP's then the P's then the S's then the unknowns at the bottom. After awhile you get a feel for when the bottom horses S's and unknows will run at hugh prices.

[russowen77]

Originally Posted by The Judge

Have been a winning player for some time now but lets face it I wasn't winning much money. I use TMM I re- listen to the Value Tech tapes and put it into practice.

The most important thing that I started to do was play my bottom horses. Horses that have "no" numbers to speak of, so they are at the bottom of the rankings. They are playable because its a "heavy pressure race" you hit the p/p button and it ranks the horses the E are on top then the EP's then the P's then the S's then the unknowns at the bottom. After awhile you get a feel for when the bottom horses S's and unknows will run at hugh prices.

Could you please elaborate about Tmm and Value Tech please. I am buying everthing I can get may hands on right now and some is good but a lot of it is I think folks way of figuring out how to make money in the racing game without betting. You are describing the one thing I am getting better at but --for ie in the LA Derby-- there were 2 closers and I picked the wrong one.
Something I seem to be good at right now.

[whyhorseofcourse]

I am a losing player this year, but won a lot last year.
I feel that memory is a big key too.
The speed figures and times are not everything.
If you can remeber excatly how that horse ran before when you saw him. You might be on to something.

[The Judge]

If there were two closers and the price is right you could play them both to win or in exotics. The point is you spotted the play you will hit your fair-share just try to remeber when you do. You may find yourself loosing more races but winning more money.

TMM is powerful but for sometime I did not use it to its full potential. I only played the top numbers or near top numbers .I didn't know when to dig deeper. Some races set up for the slower horses the horses that will make a last desperate run these may not be the clear S (sustained ) type horses but may be horses that seem to have no running style at all . Their finishes look like 6th by 8 ,5th by 5, 7th by 5 today they are contenders because they will pick-up the front runners there odds are often over 20-1.

The Value Tech tapes helped me with this. Pizzola's stuff cost alot if I were going to get Tmm or the new Black Magic I would get Value Tech Tapes to go along with it.

[russowen77]

Thanks for the advice. I just found the site. They have a package where you get a bunch of stuff for $800. I am going to stop buying books for a bit and get that package. It will take a bit but I sure like what I hear so far.

[Greyfox]

Originally Posted by russowen77

Thanks for the advice. I just found the site. They have a package where you get a bunch of stuff for $800. I am going to stop buying books for a bit and get that package. It will take a bit but I sure like what I hear so far.

You know yourself better than anyone else. That may be a great product that you are buying, in the right persons hands.
My advice is simple. If you've been buying books make sure that you are applying the principles in those books first. That $ 800 could go a long ways if employed right.
I could be wrong, but you seem to be grasping a little bit at straws.
Step back. Assess what you've been doing. Assess your strengths. Assess your weaknesses. And then proceed with caution.
Then, if after all that, you want to venture into a "new system" of tapes, fine.

[HorseRun]

Dont ever bet Favorites, there is no logical reason to always bet favorites, you will lose in the end....the name of this game is not to pick winners but to win money....dont worry if you pass on a few 4-5 winners and dont be afriad to lose some races and dont be afriad if your horse runs last 4 races in a row, come back and bet the next race if you like a horse at 20-1(it took me some time not to be "ashamed" if my horse runs last, thus i am no longer afraid to lose)

whats a better day ????

bet $200 every race for 20 races and have 11 winners all at even money

OR

bet $200 every race for 20 races and have only 2 winners pay 15-1

[Kelso]

Originally Posted by Dave Schwartz

I have begun this thread with the intention of facilitating the exchange of positive ideas that may be of assistance to someone hoping to achieve the state known as "winning player."

If you are already a winning player, I ask that you consider sharing whatever hints, tips, tricks, secrets, or ideas that you may have at your disposal.
What ideas do YOU have?

Thanks very much, Dave.

[betchatoo]

Damn, I answered yes, but I thought you said a whining player.

In seriousness (and I apologize for this capperal) I am ahead for the year and this will make 13 out of the last 15. I think the single most important thing about winning is understanding yourself. You have to know what you're good at and what you can take mentally to figure out a strategy that works for you.

In my case I make the majority of my money on exotics (generally pick 3's, pick 4's and tris) and I know that I am going to go through the occasional prolonged losing streak because of the way I play. It doesn't bother me (except when horses I bet on are disqualified half a dozen times in a week). I also know I'm going to hit the big scores and sometimes they come together in bunches.

I know successful players who couldn't handle this strategy. They go into deep funks when they hit losing streaks and so they work on more conservative, grind it out approaches. These would drive me crazy. There's no right or wrong here, just different methods.

As for a tip, I can only repeat one that has been emphasized over and over on this forum, look for vulnerable favorites and exploit those races to the best of your ability. I am a JCapper user and nearly half of the UDM's I have set up are designed to tell me when a horse is not likely to run well.

Good luck to all and, once you've learned your stuff, then believe in yourself. It helps immensely.

[Dave Schwartz]

In my case I make the majority of my money on exotics (generally pick 3's, pick 4's and tris) and I know that I am going to go through the occasional prolonged losing streak because of the way I play. It doesn't bother me (except when horses I bet on are disqualified half a dozen times in a week). I also know I'm going to hit the big scores and sometimes they come together in bunches.

Betcha,

IMHO, this is an example of exactly what a professional sounds like. Not so much what you said but rather, how you said it. It clearly states that you know how the game works for you.

I keep telling people that the most important element of success is belief, that you can't win without it. Yes, yes, I know... you have to have a winning strategy... but without belief, without expectation of a positive outcome, the winning approach just never seems to... come to anything.


I recall, during my 30 years of struggle to become (and now stay) a winning player, that in times of doubt I would make a list of all that I knew to be true. LOL - I actually remember writing down things like "I know that the top 3 ranks for best-of-last-2 final times wins 62% of all races." That is not near as powerful as being able to say that "I know my big scores come in bunches."

Thanks for a most meaningful post.


Regards,
Dave Schwartz