Give HOY to Sea The Stars

[46zilzal]

Originally Posted by Gorgeous George

Was a class above anything in the world last year. His feat will never be matched and his kind will never be seen again.

This same thing has a beard on it a mile long. People said that about Phar Lap, Man O'War, Red Rum, Arkle, Citation, Ribot, Native Dancer and guess what? GREAT ones visited again with names like Mill Reef, Brigadier Gerrard, John Henry, Shegar, Nashwan, Mtoto, Nijinsky, Makye Diva, Miesque, Kingston Rule, Affirmed, Slew, Bid, Cigar, Curlin, Tom Fool, Alleged, Buckpasser, Street Sense and or course SECRETARIAT.

Making statements like that is not only historically shallow, but simply outright IGNORANT of the facts. The book is never closed in quality

[gm10]

Originally Posted by 46zilzal

This same thing has a beard on it a mile long. People said that about Phar Lap, Man O'War, Red Rum, Arkle, Citation, Ribot, Native Dancer and guess what? GREAT ones visited again with names like Mill Reef, Brigadier Gerrard, John Henry, Shegar, Nashwan, Mtoto, Nijinsky, Makye Diva, Miesque, Kingston Rule, Affirmed, Slew, Bid, Cigar, Curlin, Tom Fool, Alleged, Buckpasser, Street Sense and or course SECRETARIAT.

Making statements like that is not only historically shallow, but simply outright IGNORANT of the facts. The book is never closed in quality

Well said. This STS hype is a bit too self-centred. These horses do show up once in a while, on all sides of every ocean. In fact, there were two of them in the US this year.

[joanied]

46ZilZal & gm10...

I'll go along with that

[Gorgeous George]

Originally Posted by 46zilzal

This same thing has a beard on it a mile long. People said that about Phar Lap, Man O'War, Red Rum, Arkle, Citation, Ribot, Native Dancer and guess what? GREAT ones visited again with names like Mill Reef, Brigadier Gerrard, John Henry, Shegar, Nashwan, Mtoto, Nijinsky, Makye Diva, Miesque, Kingston Rule, Affirmed, Slew, Bid, Cigar, Curlin, Tom Fool, Alleged, Buckpasser, Street Sense and or course SECRETARIAT.

Making statements like that is not only historically shallow, but simply outright IGNORANT of the facts. The book is never closed in quality

None of them done what STS done.

[Gorgeous George]

Originally Posted by gm10

Well said. This STS hype is a bit too self-centred.

Jealousy

Originally Posted by gm10

In fact, there were two of them in the US this year.

STS will forever be hailed as a great. RA and Zenyatta were above average horses not greats. In 2 years you will rarely see their name posted on here.

[Seabiscuit@AR]

See The Stars is already forgotten, apart from this thread you won't see the name anywhere

[gm10]

Originally Posted by Gorgeous George

None of them done what STS done.

This is what I mean. Apparently what STS did, is more than what RA or Zenyatta did.
Why? Because European = better? I only know of one form line connecting STS and Zenyatta - and that is through Rip Van Winkle. And it's not flattering.

[gm10]

Originally Posted by Gorgeous George

Jealousy

I'm a Londoner - Lingfield is my local track.

STS will forever be hailed as a great. RA and Zenyatta were above average horses not greats. In 2 years you will rarely see their name posted on here.

I think we will recognize all 3 as great horses for the rest of our lives.

[Gorgeous George]

Originally Posted by gm10

This is what I mean. Apparently what STS did, is more than what RA or Zenyatta did.
Why? Because European = better? I only know of one form line connecting STS and Zenyatta - and that is through Rip Van Winkle. And it's not flattering.

what about twice over??? and that is flattering!! you really should read through the thread before making statements like that. He won more group 1's, he beat far more group 1 winners and he never ducked anyone.

[Gorgeous George]

Originally Posted by gm10

I'm a Londoner - Lingfield is my local track.

Thats got nothing to do with the arguement your obviously a RA or Zenyatta fan who cant stand the fact another horse excelled them this year. Or another reason could be you lost alot of money backing against STS.

Originally Posted by gm10

I think we will recognize all 3 as great horses for the rest of our lives.

No we wont, being a Londoner you should realise that STS will never be forgotten. Is everyone really going to remember Zenyatta as the horse who won a breeders cup classic? or will they remember her as a horse who went undefeated racing against weak fields? Will Rachel Alexandra really be remembered as the horse that won ONE leg of the triple crown do me a favour.

[gm10]

Originally Posted by Gorgeous George

what about twice over??? and that is flattering!! you really should read through the thread before making statements like that. He won more group 1's, he beat far more group 1 winners and he never ducked anyone.

Ok Twice Over is there too (easy to overlook), and his line is not as unflattering as Rip VW.

STS didn't duck anybody but you must admit that he was only raced on the right ground, I remember that he was far from certain to run at York or Longchamps - it depended on the ground conditions.

Why you would want to give HOY honours to a horse who never even set foot in the US is beyond me. Zenyatta and RA both won 4 and 5 grade 1 races resp. To declare that STS should still win HOY is the ultimate arrogance. This is an idiotic topic. I hope you were just out to provoke and not actually serious.

[DanG]

Love Sea the Stars; but…

Regardless of the subjective vote…I will never see a loser in 2009. Thanks again to Barbara D. Livingston of DRF for putting it in perspective and who is also the finest equine photographer of our time imo.

Zenyatta (left) and Rachel Alexandra

[Gorgeous George]

Originally Posted by gm10

Ok Twice Over is there too (easy to overlook), and his line is not as unflattering as Rip VW.

STS didn't duck anybody but you must admit that he was only raced on the right ground, I remember that he was far from certain to run at York or Longchamps - it depended on the ground conditions.

Why you would want to give HOY honours to a horse who never even set foot in the US is beyond me. Zenyatta and RA both won 4 and 5 grade 1 races resp. To declare that STS should still win HOY is the ultimate arrogance. This is an idiotic topic. I hope you were just out to provoke and not actually serious.

They obviously cant give it to STS, the thread was to highlight the fact that STS was the best horse in 2009 and achieved more than RA and Zenyatta. He was better on quick ground your right but he won his maiden on soft ground and the irish champion stakes was claimed as good to yielding but we all knew over here in ireland it was soft. J Oxx prefered better ground so the risk of injury was minimal thats a testimony to his great training than a negative about the horse
p.s. dont get me started on ground issues for RA and Zenyatta

[Steve R]

Originally Posted by Gorgeous George

Was a class above anything in the world last year. His feat will never be matched and his kind will never be seen again.

Originally Posted by 46zilzal

This same thing has a beard on it a mile long. People said that about Phar Lap, Man O'War, Red Rum, Arkle, Citation, Ribot, Native Dancer and guess what? GREAT ones visited again with names like Mill Reef, Brigadier Gerrard, John Henry, Shegar, Nashwan, Mtoto, Nijinsky, Makye Diva, Miesque, Kingston Rule, Affirmed, Slew, Bid, Cigar, Curlin, Tom Fool, Alleged, Buckpasser, Street Sense and or course SECRETARIAT.

Making statements like that is not only historically shallow, but simply outright IGNORANT of the facts. The book is never closed in quality

No other horse had ever won the 2,000 Guineas, Epsom Derby and Arc in the same year, a series with 90 years of history. Gorgeous George's assertion that "his feat will never be matched" is quite reasonable.

What is "outright IGNORANT", however, is the idea suggested in this thread that Sea The Stars' form can be considered in the context of the performance of Rip Van Winkle in the BC Classic. That goes beyond ignorance. It's like downgrading Affirmed because Alydar subsequently was beaten 12 lengths by State Dinner in the Metropolitan Handicap.

[gm10]

Originally Posted by Gorgeous George

Thats got nothing to do with the arguement your obviously a RA or Zenyatta fan who cant stand the fact another horse excelled them this year. Or another reason could be you lost alot of money backing against STS.

That is ridiculous. I don't even remember if I even bet in any of his races. I didn't bet on Zenyatta or RA either this year.

No we wont, being a Londoner you should realise that STS will never be forgotten. Is everyone really going to remember Zenyatta as the horse who won a breeders cup classic? or will they remember her as a horse who went undefeated racing against weak fields? Will Rachel Alexandra really be remembered as the horse that won ONE leg of the triple crown do me a favour.

I think you are being a little Englander here.