Is the run over for Seattle?

[NJ Stinks]

Originally Posted by Valuist

Wilson? He's tremendous. IMO, he Rodgers and Brady are the top 3 QBs in the league.

My opinion is that Flacco and Roethlisberger are not taking a backseat to Wilson except when it comes to scrambling. And that advantage will shrink with the passage of time.

And I'm not sure where Brees and Romo fit in all this but I sure can't say I prefer Wilson to be passing the ball instead of those guys.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by NJ Stinks

My opinion is that Flacco and Roethlisberger are not taking a backseat to Wilson except when it comes to scrambling. And that advantage will shrink with the passage of time.

What...you figure that Flacco and Roethlisberger will get QUICKER with the passage of time?

[NJ Stinks]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

What...you figure that Flacco and Roethlisberger will get QUICKER with the passage of time?

Really, I cannot remember betting the Seahawks primarily because of Wilson. But I will and have played the Steelers and Ravens primarily because of their QB's.

[Valuist]

Originally Posted by NJ Stinks

My opinion is that Flacco and Roethlisberger are not taking a backseat to Wilson except when it comes to scrambling. And that advantage will shrink with the passage of time.

And I'm not sure where Brees and Romo fit in all this but I sure can't say I prefer Wilson to be passing the ball instead of those guys.

I understand some claiming Roethlisberger is at his level. I'd put him in the top 4. But you have got to be joking about Flacco....he's not even top 10.

[NJ Stinks]

Originally Posted by Valuist

I understand some claiming Roethlisberger is at his level. I'd put him in the top 4. But you have got to be joking about Flacco....he's not even top 10.

Rest assured, Valuist, I'm not joking. Flacco has played on teams not nearly as good as Wilson's for Joe's entire career. Yet Joe is 10-5 in the playoffs in his career. Even more impressive is that Joe is 8-5 on the road in the playoffs!

Here's a link to some interesting stats on QB's and their playoff records. (Records are available from QB's that started in 1991 or later.) Joe Flacco doesn't need me to sing his praises - this link says it all about Joe.


link: http://www.footballdb.com/stats/qb-r...post&alltime=1

[ultracapper]

I think of Joe Flacco the same way I think of Eli Manning. Right time and place, they can be wonderful, give them half a chance to kill you, and they'll get that done too.

[Valuist]

Yesterday pretty much leads me to conclude it IS over for Seattle.

But I do chuckle at people thinking stiffs like Flacco and Eli are better than Russell Wilson. Those two are one third the player Wilson is.

[kingfin66]

Originally Posted by Valuist

Yesterday pretty much leads me to conclude it IS over for Seattle.

But I do chuckle at people thinking stiffs like Flacco and Eli are better than Russell Wilson. Those two are one third the player Wilson is.

What about the game makes you think this? The final score? The "eye test?"

Seattle has a disappointing record this year, but the reality is that an NFL team can only withstand so many injuries. Seattle's defense has been injury riddled all season, but things came to a head in the second half of the Jacksonville game when KJ Wright had to leave with a concussion and Bobby Wagner with a hamstring. Wright is still out and Wagner was a mere shadow of his usual self. In fact, his injury is so bad that Earl Thomas suggested that he should not have been playing on it. Here is the body count:

Richard Sherman - played with an injured achilles until it ruptured

Kam Chancellor - out for the season with a neck stinger.

Cliff Avril - out for the season with a neck injury

KJ Wright - concussion

Bobby Wagner - hamstring

Those are all Pro Bowl caliber or All Pro level players that are missing. Of course, all NFL teams deal with injuries, but not at this level. Perhaps it is a sign that the team is getting old.

I think it is a little bit early to write the Seahawks' obituary. This season is likely a lost cause as even winning out, not a given by any means, would not guarantee them the playoffs. They too much help from Atlanta and I don't think they are going to get it. They do have some glaring needs to address in the offseason, but there are still enough weapons on both sides of the ball to give them a chance to get back on top.

[burnsy]

Originally Posted by NJ Stinks

Really, I cannot remember betting the Seahawks primarily because of Wilson. But I will and have played the Steelers and Ravens primarily because of their QB's.

I have, The SB vs Denver I loved the guy even back then. I posted here he would be way better than Luck and people laughed at me.......the guy is top 5 material any day of the week. He's already won one and probably should of won two SB's.

The run is over due to injuries and attrition, its not his fault. The other problem for them now is the La Rams, a team capable of becoming a Tour de Force of their own.

The NFC is tough competition this year, when it comes to crunch time, I don't think Seattle has the horses on defense to hang with the Rams, Vikings or Eagles. They are just depleted this year. The offensive line also lacks. The Rams are reaching full tilt at the right time, they came into Seattle and bludgeoned them. I doubt the Seahawks want any part of that again this season.

[Valuist]

Originally Posted by NJ Stinks

Rest assured, Valuist, I'm not joking. Flacco has played on teams not nearly as good as Wilson's for Joe's entire career. Yet Joe is 10-5 in the playoffs in his career. Even more impressive is that Joe is 8-5 on the road in the playoffs!

Here's a link to some interesting stats on QB's and their playoff records. (Records are available from QB's that started in 1991 or later.) Joe Flacco doesn't need me to sing his praises - this link says it all about Joe.


link: http://www.footballdb.com/stats/qb-r...post&alltime=1

Flacco caught lightning in a bottle for one magical postseason. He's been living off that ever since. He's not a top 10 QB in the league. And he hasn't been that for several years.

[Valuist]

Originally Posted by kingfin66

What about the game makes you think this? The final score? The "eye test?"

Seattle has a disappointing record this year, but the reality is that an NFL team can only withstand so many injuries. Seattle's defense has been injury riddled all season, but things came to a head in the second half of the Jacksonville game when KJ Wright had to leave with a concussion and Bobby Wagner with a hamstring. Wright is still out and Wagner was a mere shadow of his usual self. In fact, his injury is so bad that Earl Thomas suggested that he should not have been playing on it. Here is the body count:

Richard Sherman - played with an injured achilles until it ruptured

Kam Chancellor - out for the season with a neck stinger.

Cliff Avril - out for the season with a neck injury

KJ Wright - concussion

Bobby Wagner - hamstring

Those are all Pro Bowl caliber or All Pro level players that are missing. Of course, all NFL teams deal with injuries, but not at this level. Perhaps it is a sign that the team is getting old.

I think it is a little bit early to write the Seahawks' obituary. This season is likely a lost cause as even winning out, not a given by any means, would not guarantee them the playoffs. They too much help from Atlanta and I don't think they are going to get it. They do have some glaring needs to address in the offseason, but there are still enough weapons on both sides of the ball to give them a chance to get back on top.

You mention all these previously top level defensive players who are hurt now. Guess what; that's not random. That's what happens to older defensive players. That's why you don't see many All Pro defenders north of 30.

400 rush yards allowed in their last 2 games. QB ratings against of 124 and 91. They've only forced more than 1 turnover in their last 7 games.

I enjoyed betting this team many times, and contend they were probably the best team in 2012, 2013, and 2014, but that is rear view news now.

[kingfin66]

Originally Posted by Valuist

You mention all these previously top level defensive players who are hurt now. Guess what; that's not random. That's what happens to older defensive players. That's why you don't see many All Pro defenders north of 30.

400 rush yards allowed in their last 2 games. QB ratings against of 124 and 91. They've only forced more than 1 turnover in their last 7 games.

I enjoyed betting this team many times, and contend they were probably the best team in 2012, 2013, and 2014, but that is rear view news now.

Of the players I listed just one, Cliff Avril, is north of 30 years old. I agree that it is true that NFL players become more susceptible to injuries as their careers advance, but I think that there is a randomness these injuries. The injuries to Avril and Chancellor in particular are random as they involve neck injuries. Avril suffered his when another players heel struck in under the chin.

The 400 rush yards are attributable to the injuries and the rushing attack of the teams they played. Same thing for the passing. I don't see much going for them to end this year, but I do believe they will be back next year.

[NJ Stinks]

Originally Posted by Valuist

Flacco caught lightning in a bottle for one magical postseason. He's been living off that ever since. He's not a top 10 QB in the league. And he hasn't been that for several years.

Do you think the Patriots and Steelers are rooting for Flacco and the Ravens to make the playoffs?

Flacco's teams have made the playoffs six times. He is 6-0 in the first playoff game in those six years. In 15 playoff games in total since 2008 Flacco is 2-0 at home and and 8-5 on the road.

You can say Joe was lucky or Joe is a has been. I say Joe is as dangerous as they come when the season is on the line. And I hope he gets a chance to prove it again this year.


link to Joe's playoff stat's: http://www.pro-football-reference.co.../gamelog/post/

[burnsy]

Originally Posted by NJ Stinks

Do you think the Patriots and Steelers are rooting for Flacco and the Ravens to make the playoffs?

Flacco's teams have made the playoffs six times. He is 6-0 in the first playoff game in those six years. In 15 playoff games in total since 2008 Flacco is 2-0 at home and and 8-5 on the road.

You can say Joe was lucky or Joe is a has been. I say Joe is as dangerous as they come when the season is on the line. And I hope he gets a chance to prove it again this year.


link to Joe's playoff stat's: http://www.pro-football-reference.co.../gamelog/post/

He's like Eli. Neither is the best around but they are both "Poker Players" cooler than Fonzi and ice water in their veins. The really ultra talented QB's, are not used to pressure or mishaps and that's their downfall in the tough times. Eli and Joe can throw a horrible pick or fumble , shake it off and kill you the next set. They are gun slingers. When the money is down and everything is at stake......they don't feel it, if they screw up, they don't remember it. Sometimes, that's just what it takes to win in a close game. They both have beaten some of the best operating this way. Its not always how good you are, sometimes its how good you respond to the moment.

Peyton was not a poker player and neither is Brady or Big Ben. When things go bad you can read it all over their faces and body language. That's the key to beating guys like that.....knock them down hard early and you can beat them. The Giants and Ravens are examples of this.

[lamboguy]

The Steelers have by far the most talent in the league and could overcome their main weakness's with their coach and quarterback should anyone knock off the Patriots before they get to them.

the New England staff just doesn't make mistakes in big games and that is why i think it will be close to impossible for the Steelers to knock them off, but someone else might like the Ravens or Jaguars. those guys have quarterbacks with ice in their veins and also have very well coached teams. The Patriots need to be out-foxed to go down, something that's not happening with my Steelers.