Where do Jocks figure in your capping??

[Elliott Sidewater]

Not much, but there are a few horses here and there that will only put forth their best effort for a particular rider. If a horse is claimed and the new trainer breaks his usual choice of rider to have the right jockey on his horse, that is worthy of my attention. In general, though, putting the jockey before the horse is not good practice in my opinion.

[fellowmen]

Originally Posted by Vince Stone

How much weight do you give to the jocks riding horses? Does anyone have a list of what certain jocks do well with certain types or horses RE: Paco Lopez is aggressive. The ride Irad gave Terra Promessa prompted this thread. If you had money on her you were probably cursing him for a little while. So do the jocks figure in you're capping? If so to what extent. What are some good or bad qualities of certain jocks?

It seems to me if you feel the rider is foremost in your handicapping process for a certain contest or maybe even the deciding factor, the best track for this angle is Saratoga. But on the other-hand a good percentage of the pools are being filled by uninformed players doing just that. So playing against a weak favorite ridden by the Ortiz brothers Javier or Johnny V might give you some added value. I will call it the Spa rider paradox. But i have to admit ive boxed a a superfecta with the Ortiz2-joel-junior-johnny-and Javier than once.

[no breathalyzer]

Originally Posted by Murph

I don't like to criticize jockeys but I DO rate them. I use a letter grade system that is subject to my opinions.

My list has 50 to 100 names depending on time of year and number of tracks running. A riders are from the top national rankings and most consistently have the top level mounts in graded stakes. Usually 6 to 10 A riders on the list.

B riders are the jockeys who appear alert and competitive day in and day out. They will usually be a top 10 rider on their local circuit and will have shipped and won in the past 12 months among other positive signs. Jose Ortiz jr, Ramon Hernandez and Paco Lopez are examples of B rated riders on my list.

C riders are the average riders we have filling our fields every day. They work hard and try hard but for whatever reason find themselves in difficult positions because they have been out ridden by a B jock. They to often check into a wall, find their mount pinned or boxed on the inside or they like to fan 5-6 paths wide ect.

F rated riders are the auto toss list. I don't like for this category to get too large lest I do miss a couple long ones.

D riders are a special category I call dead or deadman. These riders have proven to torch MY tickets in ways I do not understand more than twice. I try to keep this list at 1% or 2% of the total on my list. Currently I rate two riders with a deadman tag. Jack Gilligan and Irad Ortiz.

I'm a bit surprised you rate this kid with a deadman tag.. i think isn't all that bad i actually kind of like.

In NY Dilly and Lizzy get dead man tags.. they win my ticket pretty much is torched

[Vince Stone]

Can anyone give a list, doesn't matter how big or small, of some riders that do a particular thing well? Ex. Good Aggressive riders, good finishers, who you would want on you're speed horse etc

[EMD4ME]

Originally Posted by Vince Stone

Can anyone give a list, doesn't matter how big or small, of some riders that do a particular thing well? Ex. Good Aggressive riders, good finishers, who you would want on you're speed horse etc

IRAD on a rating horse / closer.
Johnny V on a horse who needs to race uncovered 3-4 wide
Cc Lopez on speed
Carmouch on speed
Rocco Bowen on dirt, any horse
Joel Rosario on chalk that I bet against
Manny franco if I need a hard drive in the lane

[hracingplyr]

Had said several times that its the horse that wins 60% of the time. the only thing the jockey can possibly do is screw up the race. I really don't remember Mr. Jerkins using many name jocks.


Bob

[ultracapper]

Originally Posted by Vince Stone

Can anyone give a list, doesn't matter how big or small, of some riders that do a particular thing well? Ex. Good Aggressive riders, good finishers, who you would want on you're speed horse etc

Corey Nakatani on Santa Anita's downhill turf sprint course. He's worth 5 lengths to his mount. Trips are everything in those sprints, and Nakatani has all the angles and lanes figured to a fine "T". TBaze is getting very good at this trip also. Also, TBAZE on mid-field to pulling up the rear closers. He's very, very good at saving ground and getting his horse in striking distance at the 3/16ths pole. For years now, TBaze has also become much more efficient on the W2W type runners. He shows great patience and almost a fearlessness in allowing stalkers to get very, very close to being even with his mount, but then just keeps enough into his mount to just keep those nostrils in front. From there, I've seen many a mount of his start to restretch the lead back out inside the 1/8th pole.

Both Nakatani and TBaze are very good jockeys. Nakatani maybe a smidge better, but they're both very good.

[magwell]

Three type of jocks 1. Great jock, like Ramon can help a horse to win ..... 2. average or capable jock, aka a passenger wins if the horse is best ...3. bad jock will get the best horse beat aka human anchor ...........

[Murph]

Originally Posted by no breathalyzer

I'm a bit surprised you rate this kid with a deadman tag.. i think isn't all that bad i actually kind of like.

In NY Dilly and Lizzy get dead man tags.. they win my ticket pretty much is torched

JG is one that I am never on the right side of. When he loses I don't understand why too often, when he wins it seems like I should have been on that one. He gets the D because I always need to take a PASS/PLAY look when he is in. I should probably study closer for his best running style matches and and posts and look closer at replays, study connections ect. When I do what I've done in the past it's not working for me. So I keep looking.

[Murph]

Originally Posted by Vince Stone

Can anyone give a list, doesn't matter how big or small, of some riders that do a particular thing well? Ex. Good Aggressive riders, good finishers, who you would want on you're speed horse etc

There is a list for you, Vince. The top 10 riders are predisposed to win graded stakes races.

http://www.equibase.com/stats/View.c...year&tb=jockey

[Vince Stone]

Thanks all for the replies

[MonmouthParkJoe]

Originally Posted by EMD4ME

IRAD on a rating horse / closer.
Johnny V on a horse who needs to race uncovered 3-4 wide
Cc Lopez on speed
Carmouch on speed
Rocco Bowen on dirt, any horse
Joel Rosario on chalk that I bet against
Manny franco if I need a hard drive in the lane

This right here! I know not everyone is a fan of J. Ort, but I think he has a better sense of pace in his head, more so than his brother which is why i agree with Irad here.

CC Lopez is one of my favorites on speed. Paco on anything at monmouth

Bravo on any horse in a turf sprint that needs to be six wide on the far turn

[no breathalyzer]

i want to say John McKee: lol: this gut needs to quit the game.. bytheway he is on the do not bet list

[no breathalyzer]

Bet non hungry jockeys at your own risk... classic example in the last at tp.... disgraceful ... act like you want it son... guy act like he was on a 1/5 shoot .. for the record i didn't lose a dime on this race...

[no breathalyzer]

any jockey that is hungry and can finish wins by 3 lengths min there... jockey don't matter tho