NBA and gambling.

[Poindexter]

Cleveland coach Bickerstaff is saying that fans are giving him a hard time for pulling players late in the game. It is actually very interesting because there is a strong tendency for nba games to land close to the line. For instance phoenix was favored by 9.5 last night they are up 10 late in the game and Booker hits a three pointer to go up 13 and then on the next (final) possession Atlanta chooses not to even take a shot. I have seen other games where a team is up double digits with say 45 secs to go, they take a 24 sec violation, the other team does the same, end of game.

To me it seems like they are sort of scripting some of these finishes when the game is already decided. Don’t forget with in game betting, someone has a bet at almost any number. So I am sure somebody out there had Atlanta plus 12. They went from having a 40 to 50 percent chance of covering to a zero percent chance of covering because Atlanta elects not to shoot and ran out the clock. That is the answer? It seems to me if you are going to promote sports betting teams should be shooting and more importantly attempting to score with time on the clock, especially when they are down. I get that the team up 13 will run out the clock. But the team down 13 running out the clock makes no sense to me.

I can’t watch a game without the spread being mentioned, so why are they tiptoeing around the randomness of the finishes?

[Inner Dirt]

Originally Posted by Poindexter

Cleveland coach Bickerstaff is saying that fans are giving him a hard time for pulling players late in the game. It is actually very interesting because there is a strong tendency for nba games to land close to the line. For instance phoenix was favored by 9.5 last night they are up 10 late in the game and Booker hits a three pointer to go up 13 and then on the next (final) possession Atlanta chooses not to even take a shot. I have seen other games where a team is up double digits with say 45 secs to go, they take a 24 sec violation, the other team does the same, end of game.

To me it seems like they are sort of scripting some of these finishes when the game is already decided. Don’t forget with in game betting, someone has a bet at almost any number. So I am sure somebody out there had Atlanta plus 12. They went from having a 40 to 50 percent chance of covering to a zero percent chance of covering because Atlanta elects not to shoot and ran out the clock. That is the answer? It seems to me if you are going to promote sports betting teams should be shooting and more importantly attempting to score with time on the clock, especially when they are down. I get that the team up 13 will run out the clock. But the team down 13 running out the clock makes no sense to me.

I can’t watch a game without the spread being mentioned, so why are they tiptoeing around the randomness of the finishes?

The finishes have always been random, why should they change now because of wide spread gambling? I remember an incident I think it was the year the 49ers streak for making the play-offs was broken. That would have been 1991. I was living in SoCal and a 49er fan back then and a couple friends and I were at Agua Caliente betting football. I don't remember the opponent, but the 49ers were ahead late, but not covering.
My friends had the 49ers opponent needing them to cash a parlay. The 49ers were in the red zone, but now just needed to take a couple knees to run out the clock. I told my friends not to worry the 49ers had too much class and will just run out the clock. They scored a TD, to my shock. Maybe they were pissed that they no longer controlled their own destiny.

My 49ers have too much class comment was mocked quite often after that.

[Poindexter]

Originally Posted by Inner Dirt

The finishes have always been random, why should they change now because of wide spread gambling? I remember an incident I think it was the year the 49ers streak for making the play-offs was broken. That would have been 1991. I was living in SoCal and a 49er fan back then and a couple friends and I were at Agua Caliente betting football. I don't remember the opponent, but the 49ers were ahead late, but not covering.
My friends had the 49ers opponent needing them to cash a parlay. The 49ers were in the red zone, but now just needed to take a couple knees to run out the clock. I told my friends not to worry the 49ers had too much class and will just run out the clock. They scored a TD, to my shock. Maybe they were pissed that they no longer controlled their own destiny.

My 49ers have too much class comment was mocked quite often after that.

I think you misunderstood my post.Personally don't see a whole lot of difference between the Hawks not attempting to shoot when down 13 on the final shot clock of the game and a jockey grabbing hold of a horse in the final strides when it is obvious he will not win and then costing himself a placing in the tri or super. They are both a case of a gambler intentionally being deprived of an opportunity to cash a ticket. When the sports leagues lived in the pretend world that nobody bet their games they did not have any responsibility to care. But now that they are promoting gambling like crazy, they have a responsibility to give gamblers a fair shake. That is my point. I understand that this stuff evens out over time. But the new breed of sports bettor might not be so understanding as evidenced bye this article. Not a big deal to me, jmo. I will be betting the NBA when I am 90 years old

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/j...ssed-the-line/

"There's no doubt about it that it's crossed the line," Bickerstaff said. "The amount of times I'm standing up there and we may have a 10-point lead and the spread is 11 and people are yelling at me to leave the guys in so we can cover the spread, it's ridiculous. But again, I understand the business side of it, the nature of the business of it, but it is something that I believe has gone too far."

Bickerstaff went on to detail his personal experience with sports bettors who have found his information and sent him messages over losing bets.

"I personally have had my own instances with some of the sports gamblers, where they got my telephone number, were sending me crazy messages about where I live, and my kids and all that stuff," Bickerstaff said.

[thaskalos]

Personally...I don't remember Bickerstaff's team ever having a 10 point lead late in a game.

But seriously, if this were a real problem...wouldn't other coaches and players be complaining too? What makes J.B Bickerstaff such a special case? And...aren't these complaints valid in NFL games too? Why don't we hear much about them?

To me as an NBA bettor, the real "disrespect" that the teams show towards the bettors of their games is in their player injury reports. I shouldn't have to wait until "game-time" to find out if the team's best player will play in the game or not.

[Inner Dirt]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

Personally...I don't remember Bickerstaff's team ever having a 10 point lead late in a game.

But seriously, if this were a real problem...wouldn't other coaches and players be complaining too? What makes J.B Bickerstaff such a special case? And...aren't these complaints valid in NFL games too? Why don't we hear much about them?

To me as an NBA bettor, the real "disrespect" that the teams show towards the bettors of their games is in their player injury reports. I shouldn't have to wait until "game-time" to find out if the team's best player will play in the game or not.

Don't about 85% of the GTD guys play in the NBA? That is just my wild guess.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by Inner Dirt

Don't about 85% of the GTD guys play in the NBA? That is just my wild guess.

More like 50-50.

[Inner Dirt]

Originally Posted by Poindexter

I think you misunderstood my post.Personally don't see a whole lot of difference between the Hawks not attempting to shoot when down 13 on the final shot clock of the game and a jockey grabbing hold of a horse in the final strides when it is obvious he will not win and then costing himself a placing in the tri or super. They are both a case of a gambler intentionally being deprived of an opportunity to cash a ticket. When the sports leagues lived in the pretend world that nobody bet their games they did not have any responsibility to care. But now that they are promoting gambling like crazy, they have a responsibility to give gamblers a fair shake. That is my point. I understand that this stuff evens out over time. But the new breed of sports bettor might not be so understanding as evidenced bye this article. Not a big deal to me, jmo. I will be betting the NBA when I am 90 years old

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/j...ssed-the-line/

"There's no doubt about it that it's crossed the line," Bickerstaff said. "The amount of times I'm standing up there and we may have a 10-point lead and the spread is 11 and people are yelling at me to leave the guys in so we can cover the spread, it's ridiculous. But again, I understand the business side of it, the nature of the business of it, but it is something that I believe has gone too far."

Bickerstaff went on to detail his personal experience with sports bettors who have found his information and sent him messages over losing bets.

"I personally have had my own instances with some of the sports gamblers, where they got my telephone number, were sending me crazy messages about where I live, and my kids and all that stuff," Bickerstaff said.

I did not misunderstand, I just stated coaches and players have not altered their style because of gamblers. Why should they? So they should throw player development to the wind to cover a spread? A 12th man who practices hard should not get rewarded with minutes because the game is on the line late? Here is an idea, use what troubles you to your advantage.
I doubt many people are studying what coaches do in garbage time in NBA games, it has been noted that a record is going to be set for 20 point comebacks this year.


Over a dozen years+ ago as I was in California, I participated in a football picking contest where you either gained or lost points depending on how you did against the spread, you could pick from any 10 pro or college games. Depending on the week you could pick a couple games to be worth double or triple. There were teams like Louisville at the time who would play the starters late and always try to run up the score. There were other teams that pulled starters, but had good back ups and ran the same offensive plays. Then there were teams that would get up big and then tone it down, those were to be avoided. After awhile it was obvious most teams followed a pattern.

[Inner Dirt]

Originally Posted by Inner Dirt

Don't about 85% of the GTD guys play in the NBA? That is just my wild guess.

Originally Posted by thaskalos

More like 50-50.

The next time I get glued to a desk or couch because of an ailment I think I will track that. Maybe 85% is high, but 50% has to be low. What injury reports do you look at? I just use ESPN. Also did you notice if they say GTD all the way up to game time?

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by Inner Dirt

The next time I get glued to a desk or couch because of an ailment I think I will track that. Maybe 85% is high, but 50% has to be low. What injury reports do you look at? I just use ESPN. Also did you notice if they say GTD all the way up to game time?

I use ESPN and oddsshark.com. And, yes...often the GTD lasts right up to the start of the game. The rest of the time it lasts almost to the start of the game...and that too is ridiculous, IMO. It clearly doesn't take that long to decide whether a player will play in the game or not.

[thaskalos]

Case in point:

Anthony Edwards is Minnesota's best player, and he is still listed in "questionable" status, even though the game against Golden State tips off in twenty minutes. Does it really take this long to decide if a player should play in a game or not? And there is an amazing number of "questionable" players in these NBA games. This is WAY worse for the sports bettor than the problem that the original poster has commented upon in this thread.

[lamboguy]

the one thing i guarantee you. the bettors and the sportsbooks don't know if the player is questionable, but Billy Walters knows!

[Inner Dirt]

Obviously those salary estimation sites are all over the place but many claim NBA athletic trainers make $60k a year. If that is the case couldn't a high roller or a syndicate get connections with a couple of them?

[thaskalos]

With the Miami Heat already having significant roster injuries, it's imperative that Jimmy Butler plays tonight against the Warriors. Early reports came out that Butler had some minor illness and didn't participate in this morning's team shootaround...but he was still "probable" for tonight's game. Now his condition has been downgraded to "questionable" as reported by the Miami Herald. No word as to Butler's availability coming from the team...even though the game tips off in 2 hours. How this sport can be considered a serious gambling venture is beyond my comprehension.

[Inner Dirt]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

With the Miami Heat already having significant roster injuries, it's imperative that Jimmy Butler plays tonight against the Warriors. Early reports came out that Butler had some minor illness and didn't participate in this morning's team shootaround...but he was still "probable" for tonight's game. Now his condition has been downgraded to "questionable" as reported by the Miami Herald. No word as to Butler's availability coming from the team...even though the game tips off in 2 hours. How this sport can be considered a serious gambling venture is beyond my comprehension.

At 5:47 EST Miami is +4.5 on FanDuel and they are the home team. That tells me Butler is not playing.

[Inner Dirt]

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...betting-issues


Betting irregularities investigated on low salaried player.