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Old 10-31-2022, 11:57 AM   #106
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I like to know how many others hate my guts besides you?


Please speak up...no hard feelings.....



If I hated your guts, I wouldn't keep letting you stay here under name #1,072

What I hate is your non-stop obsession with Dave and HSH.
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Old 10-31-2022, 12:11 PM   #107
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If I hated your guts, I wouldn't keep letting you stay here under name #1,072

What I hate is your non-stop obsession with Dave and HSH.

Believe me , there are plenty of haters still around but don't want to deal with the bull

Either they died, gave up , or you banned....



But I never lied !!!!!





PS- Yes, I did know them before they died...not after

Last edited by BroadwayJoe; 10-31-2022 at 12:12 PM.
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Old 10-31-2022, 12:31 PM   #108
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Been forever since I posted on here. I bought VC about a year ago. So first question one would ask is are you profitable? Nope but not because of the software - waaaaay too many Ďactioní bets.
But starting to get more selective and utilizing exotics better. Profitable the past two months which is niceÖnot saying Iíve turned the corner but do think Iím betting smarter
Starting to get a hang of where the software works better/worse. It will struggle in maiden races with FTS but thatís cool cuz thatís the one spot Iíve done well for a while with PP handicapping
Back to the betting change. Only making exotic bets that can payoff well vs swinging in most races. Still not as selective as Matt nor Michael but moreso than I was. And Keeneland was very, very good for me. Big fields helped.

FYI I used HSH for a number of years. Itís very good too just didnít fit my handicapping style as I found itís looking more for value in short-priced horses whereas VC is geared towards price horses.

Both Michael and Dave are helpful as are people who use each. And dare I say Iíve made a couple of friends in each community which is a nice add.

There are people who are profitable using each of these programs but Iím guessing most arenít. That takes a ton of discipline IMO. I donít have that yet Ö in part because I also play for Ďfun

The change of late is that Iím still playing a fair number of races but limiting the bets to where the payoffs are solid. With a few less races and slightly better betting strategy I think Iíll be on to something. We shall see.

If you are thinking about either of these or any other expensive package just know that there is no Ďturnkeyí solution. They are tools. You need to be the carpenter and hone your craft.
Thanks Jon for chiming in, for those of you who dont know, Jon is an excellent handicapper and it has been a pleasure meeting him and getting to learn from him and discuss races. We often have live valuecapping sessions via MS TEAMS on the weekends.
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Old 10-31-2022, 12:37 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by BroadwayJoe View Post
Believe me , there are plenty of haters still around but don't want to deal with the bull

Either they died, gave up , or you banned....



But I never lied !!!!!





PS- Yes, I did know them before they died...not after
Nobody cares...except you.

Dave's is like any other software. Some just won't be able to make it work.

but since I actually posted MULTIPLE 500+ profitable runs on here, using HSH...I think I've proven that it works.

It's still definitely not for everyone. But you can't say it isn't profitable.

Unlike most people on this board, I actually PROVED IT.
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Old 10-31-2022, 12:51 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage View Post
Nobody cares...except you.

Dave's is like any other software. Some just won't be able to make it work.

but since I actually posted MULTIPLE 500+ profitable runs on here, using HSH...I think I've proven that it works.

It's still definitely not for everyone. But you can't say it isn't profitable.

Unlike most people on this board, I actually PROVED IT.
Honestly, I think its more about the player than the software, now finding a software that matches ones playing style certainly helps. But I think most software will work if someone devotes the time and energy to learn it and has the discipline to use the software in races/situations where it is most effective.

There is something to be said though, for those folks who actually show a profitable run with a software BEFORE they knew the result. Congrats for doing that! I always found those threads really interesting.
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Old 10-31-2022, 12:56 PM   #111
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Originally Posted by BroadwayJoe View Post
I like to know how many others hate my guts besides you?


Please speak up...no hard feelings.....



It's not hate, but let's just say that based on your posts you are an acquired taste. On the handicapping side of PA I don't recall anyone as negative as you. For me personally, I can only tolerate so much of that crap. I'm sure that some people feel the same way about me. It's part and parcel of being on a forum.
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Old 10-31-2022, 01:25 PM   #112
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It's not hate, but let's just say that based on your posts you are an acquired taste. On the handicapping side of PA I don't recall anyone as negative as you. For me personally, I can only tolerate so much of that crap. I'm sure that some people feel the same way about me. It's part and parcel of being on a forum.
Its fine man.....

the glory of it is that you don't have to respond .....

Its not negativity always.....if I had experience , I'll comment....

The worst thing people can do is to come in here and ask...

What about XYZ Software...


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Old 10-31-2022, 01:34 PM   #113
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Its fine man.....

the glory of it is that you don't have to respond .....

Its not negativity always.....if I had experience , I'll comment....

The worst thing people can do is to come in here and ask...

What about XYZ Software...


For what it's worth Mike, you never have bothered me, but I will say, if you question someone else's methods/software, you always run the risk of them not taking it well. I myself understand that we all approach this game differently and we all have different styles of handicapping, different comfort levels with betting/money management, different amounts of time to devote to the game, and different ways we like to see data presented.

You seem more like a database guy to me, I went through that stage and found it didn't work for me.....paralysis by analysis for me anyway. But if that style works for you, who am I to tell you different. We can all continue to learn from each other.
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Old 10-31-2022, 02:21 PM   #114
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the glory of it is that you don't have to respond .....
I could say the same to you, and yet you DO respond -- to almost everything! No worries MikeGerogeJoe. Good luck to all no matter what software you choose. It's a tough game.
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Old 10-31-2022, 02:31 PM   #115
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SoÖeven though I havenít posted for a year now, I do feel the need to chime in.

This year, my year has gone pretty much the same way last year did. Really well in the beginning of the year, really not well second half of the year. Not sure why.

Matt brings up some excellent pointsÖone of which does seem to stop me from reaching my full potential with VC which is his rules comment. Iím in financeÖso Iím kind of a rules guy. It is very hard for me to ignore my rules. Iím getting better and I still have a few that just seem to make sense to me, but I have cut those way down.

Another good point Matt made which may have gotten missed was how people just starting out with VC seem to do really well. That was certainly the case for me. Itís almost like that saying that says a little knowledge can be dangerous. As I learned more, the harder the game seemed to get.

I donít actually play a lot of races. Recently, I downloaded 5 tracks, and made three bets (all losses by the way.). I think one of the things I like about VC is that - at least for me - it has a built in discipline which stops me from betting too many races.

I have learned a lot from Matt (and all of you actually.) I can honestly say that after using VC for two years now, that while I will certainly not be able to buy a new car or take a great vacation from my winnings, I have never fallen below my initial deposit in my accountÖwhich seems like a win to me anyway. But I sure wish I was better so I could buy that car!
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Old 10-31-2022, 03:30 PM   #116
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SoÖeven though I havenít posted for a year now, I do feel the need to chime in.

This year, my year has gone pretty much the same way last year did. Really well in the beginning of the year, really not well second half of the year. Not sure why.

Matt brings up some excellent pointsÖone of which does seem to stop me from reaching my full potential with VC which is his rules comment. Iím in financeÖso Iím kind of a rules guy. It is very hard for me to ignore my rules. Iím getting better and I still have a few that just seem to make sense to me, but I have cut those way down.

Another good point Matt made which may have gotten missed was how people just starting out with VC seem to do really well. That was certainly the case for me. Itís almost like that saying that says a little knowledge can be dangerous. As I learned more, the harder the game seemed to get.

I donít actually play a lot of races. Recently, I downloaded 5 tracks, and made three bets (all losses by the way.). I think one of the things I like about VC is that - at least for me - it has a built in discipline which stops me from betting too many races.

I have learned a lot from Matt (and all of you actually.) I can honestly say that after using VC for two years now, that while I will certainly not be able to buy a new car or take a great vacation from my winnings, I have never fallen below my initial deposit in my accountÖwhich seems like a win to me anyway. But I sure wish I was better so I could buy that car!
Glad to hear you are not losing too much, that was really my goal all along. Basically I was just hoping to make enough to pay for the data, which I have the last several years with a few bucks to spare. Certainly never going to get rich playing this game, at least not the way I play it.

Read a great article or blog by someone a while back, may have been by Dave Schwartz on his website maybe, cant remember for sure. But he went into detail the amount of money yoyu would need to push through the windows given a $1.10-$1.20 ROI to make even $1000 a week, which would certainly not be a comfortable living these days. It was astronomical!! The author also mentioned how emotionally draining it was as soon as he decided to play professionally, where he knew he had to make x amount of dollars over x period of time to feed the family, pay the mortgage, keep the heat on, etc. As much as I hate working a 9-5, I am 100% certain handicapping horses for a living would be worse, just is not something I am prepared to do.

The part I enjoy about Valuecapper is there isnt a lot of data mining or systems you have to learn to break even or make a few bucks, which allows me to focus on what has always been the weakest parts of my game, bet structure and money management. Still working on this and suppose I will be until the day I die, but I am making progress.

Always happy to meet up and discuss horses every once in a while if you'd like, pretty sure Jon would be game too, if we can find a weekend where life doesnt get in the way for an hour or two!!

Best,

M
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Old 10-31-2022, 03:43 PM   #117
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Nice posts guys.....

I too am happy to be about even.....

If i'd ever lost say 5/10 grand a year then HH would be very happy to see me stop posting...

But it isn't and you and PA will have me around till I die....

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Old 10-31-2022, 04:48 PM   #118
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If I could do no better than break even or even slightly profitable, I'd stop wasting my time on this game (which I have, for the time being, for precisely that reason...the return hasn't been worth the effort).
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Old 10-31-2022, 04:51 PM   #119
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If I could do no better than break even or even slightly profitable, I'd stop wasting my time on this game (which I have, for the time being, for precisely that reason...the return hasn't been worth the effort).
Maybe I should start trading......


Wanna book them?


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Old 10-31-2022, 04:53 PM   #120
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If I could do no better than break even or even slightly profitable, I'd stop wasting my time on this game (which I have, for the time being, for precisely that reason...the return hasn't been worth the effort).
Agree 100% PA, thats why I like Valuecapper, I can basically go through every race for the day in about 30 minutes and get my win bets, and 30 minutes may be a bit of an overestimate, Id say I normally spend 15 to 20 minutes looking through and the other 10 minutes placing the bets conditionally.....Im done for the day. Set it and forget it, no stress. On the days where I decide to actually watch the board, which is about 2 days a month maybe, I spend a lot more time.

Its just a fun hobby for me!
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