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Old 03-25-2019, 11:47 PM   #61
theiman
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Finger Lakes, same 5 year period as the NYRA tracks in the previous post.
Period covered was some time in April(it varied every year for the first death)
The last deaths were all in late November. So approx 7-8 month period.

2014 - 35
2015 - 24
2016 - 28
2017 - 27
2018 - 23

Total 137 for an average of 27
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Old 03-26-2019, 01:32 AM   #62
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These NY numbers are best evaluated by using deaths per 1,000 starters, but I do believe that NYRA has been close to the national average at about 1.6. Epidemiology becomes valuable b/c it would be useful to compare the # of dead horse positives for bisphosphonate at the different venues like SA vs NYRA. The answers are out there, but nothing is being revealed.

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Old 03-26-2019, 08:38 AM   #63
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that seems like a pretty high number at the SPA in comparison to the rest considering the meet is so short and they would most likely have more sound horses there.
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Old 03-26-2019, 11:18 AM   #64
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that seems like a pretty high number at the SPA in comparison to the rest considering the meet is so short and they would most likely have more sound horses there.
The spa numbers include training deaths that have been reported in May and June. Those numbers are only 1 or 2 a season, sometimes none.
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Old 03-26-2019, 12:41 PM   #65
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The spa numbers include training deaths that have been reported in May and June. Those numbers are only 1 or 2 a season, sometimes none.



sometimes none?-
What year(s) were there none?


Those numbers also include non racing deaths like colic and barn accidents , runaway horses etc.


Daylasoul was hit by a truck on rt 9 in 2011



We need to dig deeper for some real numbers.





_ 2017 - 7 racing deaths,11 training deaths at Sar.,

and 2 deaths due to colic. according to NYSGC page.



Now Kentucky is blaming Climate Change for their 2.35/1000 fatality rate , national avg. is 1.68/1000
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Old 03-26-2019, 12:50 PM   #66
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Do these statistics include horse put down due to injury days after it happened?
Or even weeks, ie Barbaro?

If anything, racing needs to get into the 21st century and have accurate statistic not only in a database, but reviewed WEEKLY by each track.
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Old 03-26-2019, 09:18 PM   #67
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The spa numbers include training deaths that have been reported in May and June. Those numbers are only 1 or 2 a season, sometimes none.
that makes sense
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Old 03-26-2019, 09:20 PM   #68
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this is what I'm eluding to. people making all these judgements and comparisons to the past and they have no idea what the hell the past even is. Comparing to just three or four years ago is a piss poor way to come up with a conclusion. You need a very long window of statistics to make decisions like this.
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Old 03-27-2019, 02:08 AM   #69
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Bloodhorse, the magazine that fired Jeremy Balan as reward for all the work he did uncovering the death rate crisis at SA, has finally awakened to the bisphosphonate issue:
First Saturday....https://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-rac...ontrols-coming

Now today: https://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-rac...isphosphonates

The Paulick Report has an excellent synopsis of the current situation.
https://www.paulickreport.com/news/r...oing-about-it/

There are some key points, The drug maker admits that Osphos is available to any non-vet who wants it. They seem to take a hard line on this, saying how awful this is, but they sound to me like the makers of oxycondin who cry about how abuse of their drug is so awful, while pocketing huge profits. Dechra, maker of Osphos, is a public British corporation. In their last yearly report, the CEO stated that "equine products have performed well, and sales of Osphos® have continued to grow as its clinical merits are more widely appreciated" I was unable to find the exact value of Osphos sales, but given its specific mention, safe to say it is significant revenue.
Then there is this: "The company has already funded several studies seeking a better test for the drugs. Currently, they can be detected 28 days out in blood, but researchers are working to find them in post-mortem bone samples – so far, those haven't yielded many answers".
I have already discussed the pharmacology of the bisphosphonates, but rechecked my research. Here is what seems to be a definitive discussion of the drug from Britain:http://www.hpra.ie/img/uploaded/swed...2019154725.pdf

There is a lot of scientific stuff here, but some key points. The active ingredient, clodronic acid is not biodegradable, which means there are no metabolites, thus, unlike many other drugs, a drug test can only look for the drug itself. The reports states the drug achieves maximum levels in blood within 39 minutes, rapidly adheres to bone. The stated half life in urine is 1-2 hours, while in plasma 5.6 hours (half life means the length of time to reduce amount by 50%). With such a rapid half life, how is it possible to state that the drug is detectable within 28 days?????. This drug has been available in the US since 2014, and as the article notes could be imported for several years before. The drug is a potent pain reliever. Is it realistic to say that it has never, ever been tried on a racehorse? (remember the drug has been described by a vet as making "a lame horse sound in one day") I again emphasize that I have been unable to find one instance of a drug positive ever in US racing. I would love an explanation of this 28 day statement, especially since, sales companies are now easing buyers' worries by offering blood test.
I also continue to be mystified about the difficulties in finding this non-biodegradable drug in bones, when I already linked to a research paper that even described a method they used.
One final point. In Britain, the authorities have declared that any horse of any age that is found with any trace of bisphosphonates will be barred from racing forever. Is it any wonder that everyone at every level of US racing is so fearful? Maybe I am scientifically wrong (though I keep trying to find how) but it does not surprise me that the panicked reaction just does not make sense.

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Old 03-27-2019, 01:52 PM   #70
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With the spate of bisphosphonate articles hitting so rapidly, an overview is helpful. This class of drugs has been around since the 1800's. A main industrial use was to soften water in orange grove irrigation systems. Bone use in humans began in the mid 1990's (Fosamax). The first equine product (Tildren) was introduced in France in 2002. USA equine products (Tildren and Osphos) appeared in 2014. The newest products for humans are described as 20,000 times more powerful. Without getting into too much specific scientific detail, the affinity of bisphosphonates to bone is like metal chips to magnets. Once in the body, the drug quickly locks into bone.
Then there is this: "researchers are working to find them (bisphosphonates) in post-mortem bone samples – so far, those haven't yielded many answers."
Earlier I linked to a 2011 Canadian study measuring Tildren in bone:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3062923/
They administered the drug to 8 horses, and over a year's time they killed them (I am a bit uneasy about that), and then analyzed different bones for the drug. The study found the tuber coxae (TC) to be best site for biopsy. Interestingly, they found that the drug concentrations in bone did not diminish over the time studied, and the longest span (one year) maintained drug concentration. The report concludes that "there were no technical problems in measuring tiludronate in bone samples taken with a 5-mm diameter drill in the TC bone". I just do not understand why authorities are now getting no results. I can find no followup studies finding the assay technique used in 2011 to be unreliable; consider also, that there have been many human studies that had no difficulty measuring the drug in bones. This thread has shown the catastrophic difficulties for the entire industry, from drug makers to breeders to race tracks, should there be confirmation of bisphosphonates in equine bones. I cannot help but wonder if that is a factor in these biopsy assay difficulties.

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Old 03-27-2019, 03:03 PM   #71
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Another Article

https://www.pastthewire.com/bisphosphonate-concerns/

Here is another article highlighting the new sales policy offering blood tests for bisphoosphonates with the right of return. I believe the sales companies are misleading prospective purchasers by comparing their success banning steroids with the current situation. Unlike bisphosphonates, steroids (and metabolites) are easily detected. Buyers should know the facts on bisphosphonate detection; I believe this is a defensive marketing ploy. As I have explained there are solid scientific reasons that positive blood (and urine) detection has never been reported when investigating drug misuse. It's the honor system here at the sales, and on the race track b/c it is easy to avoid drug detection, and so many racing entities, as is their usual custom, do not want that known.

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Old 03-27-2019, 06:11 PM   #72
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Steve Byck Pipes In

On yesterday's Steve Byck At The Races radio show, there was a segment interviewing Dr. Steven Allday: https://stevebyk.com/broadcast/hour-...ite-dr-allday/ You can pick up about 30 minutes in. The subject of the SA breakdowns was discussed followed by a bisphosphonate segment. Allday stressed he had no California experience for many years, and, knew very few SA horsemen. He went on to speculate about certain track conditions unique to Southern Cal (desert like, then heavy rain and cold etc). that might logically be a cause of breakdowns; of course, no one mentioned the huge increase in deaths in Allday's home state of Kentucky, nor the large amount of turf race deaths at SA which logically (there's that word again) would point away from SA main track causation.
They then went on to bisphosphonates, and Byck covered the recent news about sales company. He then went on to blast a "certain on line publication" (the Paulick Report) for irresponsibly quoting an anonymous Florida vet. Here is the pertinent quote:

“In my opinion, Santa Anita's recent breakdowns may have less to do with the track and more to do with the rampant use of bisphosphonates,” the veterinarian wrote.

“I am an equine only veterinarian and work primarily on Thoroughbreds in training. In our practice, we have seen an almost ten-fold increase in catastrophic breakdowns and large long bone stress fractures (humeral/femoral/physeal) in our 2-year-old in training horses (both sales and race-prepping clients).

“These drugs are widely used prior to the yearling sales in Kentucky to supposedly decrease certain radiographic findings, despite these drugs only being FDA approved for the use in horses 5 years of age and older. The scariest part about bisphosphonates is that no one knows the half-life of the drugs in horses. In humans, the half-life can be up to 10 years.

“Even if a horse has not been given a bisphosphonate as a yearling, there are still trainers/vets on the track that are giving this for its almost immediate analgesic effect. It can take a lame horse and make them sound the very next day."

Just like Byck's guest Allday, this Florida vet, based upon his knowledge, was applying logic (***) to try to find the cause of SA breakdowns. Note that he did use the word "may".
Byck, focusing just on the drug misuse in sales babies, went on to brand as "phenomenally" inaccurate attempts to attribute SA deaths to bisphosphonates b/c half were homebreds and some were older race horses. Using this logic,(****), he actually counted off so many victims he knew could not have been given the drug. I know this guy is a race track shill (cannot forget his defense of takeout increases), but to completely ignore the well known analgesic power of bisphosphonates, which cannot be detected in post race testing, really defies his precious logic.(***). Instead of loudly voicing a misleading discussion, why does he not apply the same energy to pressure Calif authorities (KY also) to reveal the necropsy bisphosphonate assay reports? No logic needed to evaluate those results.
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Old 03-27-2019, 07:13 PM   #73
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love giving opinions on stuff i don't understand... it's the INTERNET!

Bisphosphonates(sp?) is outside my circle of competence.

I don't know about this stuff.

After skimming some available info I have a couple guesses/hunches...

...that could be DEAD WRONG so take them w/ a grain of salt

$0.02

Sounds terrible for use w/ falsifying bone-soundness in foals.

Sounds terrible for use in forcing a lame horse into a race.

Needs to be investigated and addressed.

Does not seem to be a major model regarding the breakdown issue at Santa Anita.
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Old 03-27-2019, 08:23 PM   #74
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based on what I've just read it needs to be banned in this country for equine use and any trainer found with it or a horse testing positive for it when a test becomes available, should be banned for life also.
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Old 03-28-2019, 01:28 PM   #75
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based on what I've just read it needs to be banned in this country for equine use and any trainer found with it or a horse testing positive for it when a test becomes available, should be banned for life also.
Any indication when test will become available so this drug can be stopped.?
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