Trump signs tariffs

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by Andy Asaro

One of us isn't making sense. I think I'll move on. Good luck.

What did I miss?

You posted a tweet that is false. Right out of the gate. First point. False...

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by Andy Asaro

One of us isn't making sense. I think I'll move on. Good luck.

Just now realized you moved from automotive and the completely false tweet you shared. None of that stuff is taxed.

Didn't realize milk was your straw man. I linked NAFTA. Feel free to read the section on agriculture if you want. It's all covered in there. Their tariff exemptions and ours.

Here's our subsidies and tariffs.

• Federal Milk Marketing Order establishes four sets of products: liquid milk, ice cream and yogurt, cheese, butter and dry milk. Every month, the USDA sets a separate price for liquid milk in each of 10 established regions, with processors paying according to how it will be used. Each of the other product categories is given a nationwide price. This cartel system ensures limited competition and means that entrepreneurs are forbidden from selling below government mandated prices.

• Milk Price Support Program guarantees that the government will purchase any amount of cheese, butter, or nonfat dry milk from processors at a minimum price. This creates a steady demand and higher prices for dairy products.

• Milk Income Loss Contract Program distributes cash subsidies to milk producers when marketprices fall below a set limit. This program is the newest of the dairy programs, enacted for the first time in 2002.

• Tariff Rate Quotas impose a higher tariff rate on imports above a set volume limit. That limit is set at approximately 5% of US consumption, ensuring that US dairy producers are not threatened by overseas production.

• Dairy Export Incentive Program distributes cash subsidies to dairy producers who sell in foreign markets. This ensures that domestic producers have an incentive to sell abroad despite lower world prices.

[elysiantraveller]

Trump jabbed first, and now world hits back in trade fight
The European Union is set to slap tariffs on $3.4 billion in American products on Friday, from whiskey and motorcycles to peanuts and cranberries.

Some excerpts:

"As you consider these tariffs, know that you are taxing American families, you are putting American jobs at risk, and you are destroying markets — both foreign and domestic — for American businesses of all types, sorts and sizes," said Senate Finance Chairman Orrin Hatch, R-Utah.

"The president has been so belligerent that it becomes almost impossible for democratically elected leaders — or even a non-democratic leader like (Chinese president) Xi Jinping — to appear to kowtow and give in," said Philip Levy, senior fellow at the Chicago Council on Global Affairs and a former White House trade adviser.

"The president has made it very hard for other countries to give him what he wants."

[Clocker]

Trump's tariff guru is Peter Navarro, mainly by default as anyone else in the administration with any knowledge of trade and tariffs seems to have quit. Last out was former Goldman chief Gary Cohn.

Navarro was the big push behind steel and aluminum tariffs. He was asked about retaliation by China and other countries.

Unfortunately, Trump’s trade advisors seem oblivious to history, as indicated when Navarro was asked whether other countries would retaliate against U.S. tariffs on steel and aluminum. His response: “I don’t believe any country in the world is going to retaliate.”

In fact, after the U.S. imposed steel and aluminum tariffs, China, Canada, Mexico, the EU, Japan, and other countries announced plans to retaliate against billions of dollars in American exports. Many of these new tariffs on U.S. exports are scheduled to take effect in July.

https://www.ntu.org/publications/det...-trade-policy#

One of the major targets of retaliatory tariffs on US exports to other countries is agricultural products. As a result of current and proposed tariffs on US commodities imported into China and other countries, agricultural commodity prices here are falling significantly.

According to Bloomberg, agricultural commodities prices have dropped to their lowest level this century. The Chinese government, as Trump has pointed out in the past, is savvy, retaliating against strategic and politically sensitive U.S. exports in an election year. Agriculture is not a flashy industry, and many people take for granted that farmers are among America’s preeminent exporters. The U.S. is the breadbasket of the world, raising and exporting more bushels of wheat, soybeans, cotton, and coarse grains (like corn) than any other nation. But the sector is also disproportionately reliant on China, so new trade barriers will hit farmers hard.

The U.S. produced more soybeans last year than any other country and exported about 60 percent of them to China; Beijing accounts for 65 percent of the world’s soybean imports, according to Reuters. Now, China is deliberately shifting its buying program to South American beans. The CEO of Bunge, one of the world’s largest agriculture traders, said on a conference call that China is “very deliberately not buying anything from the U.S.” Almost half of sorghum produced by the U.S. last year was exported to China. Forward prices of U.S. pork and ethanol, both of which rely partly on Chinese demand, also fell on announcements of retaliatory tariffs. And while only a small portion of the U.S. corn crop gets shipped to China, its biggest export destination, Mexico, now threatens to impose tariffs on shipments in response to tariffs that the Trump administration has levied on Mexican goods.

https://www.city-journal.org/html/hi...ffs-15981.html

[Inner Dirt]

I know one thing, in my small world businesses are using the recent tariffs whether implemented yet or not as a reason to price gouge and in their explanation they treat the customer like they are stupid. Here is a glaring example. A friend in Texas who is having a shop and house built was quoted two months ago $25,000 for a 30' x 40' metal building erected on a concrete slab, that price is without any electrical work. Since the house build was going well he calls the metal building people and asks if their price is still good. Of course the respond with "Because of 25% tariffs on steel the price is now $30,000." That of course is a 20% mark up.



Let us break it all down for a minute. First the company that installs the building also fabricates it. Taking a quick guess the weight of the building could not be more than two tons. The only increased cost tariffs can honestly effect is raw materials. I buy can buy better steel than used for construction, 500# at a time for a $1 a pound. So plain and simple at worst the metal building company was hit with a $1,000 increase but decided to charge $5,000 more.


I do think businesses are going to use tariffs as a reason to gouge. They will throw crap on the walls and see what sticks. I think eventually everything will just settle in. Trump tried to do the right thing but it backfired.

[fast4522]

Originally Posted by Inner Dirt

I know one thing, in my small world businesses are using the recent tariffs whether implemented yet or not as a reason to price gouge and in their explanation they treat the customer like they are stupid. Here is a glaring example. A friend in Texas who is having a shop and house built was quoted two months ago $25,000 for a 30' x 40' metal building erected on a concrete slab, that price is without any electrical work. Since the house build was going well he calls the metal building people and asks if their price is still good. Of course the respond with "Because of 25% tariffs on steel the price is now $30,000." That of course is a 20% mark up.



Let us break it all down for a minute. First the company that installs the building also fabricates it. Taking a quick guess the weight of the building could not be more than two tons. The only increased cost tariffs can honestly effect is raw materials. I buy can buy better steel than used for construction, 500# at a time for a $1 a pound. So plain and simple at worst the metal building company was hit with a $1,000 increase but decided to charge $5,000 more.


I do think businesses are going to use tariffs as a reason to gouge. They will throw crap on the walls and see what sticks. I think eventually everything will just settle in. Trump tried to do the right thing but it backfired.

Interesting post, but I only think it backfires if we pull the plug and looks like President Bush. But if we go the distance those who do not cave will burn to the core while our economy continues to grow.

[Clocker]

Originally Posted by fast4522

Interesting post

Because it shows that if American companies are protected from competition from lower priced imports by tariffs, they are free to implement major price increases. And as always, the consumer pays the price.

[mrhorseplayer]

Originally Posted by Clocker

Because it shows that if American companies are protected from competition from lower priced imports by tariffs, they are free to implement major price increases. And as always, the consumer pays the price.

in the long run the consumer is going to make more money.

[Clocker]

Originally Posted by mrhorseplayer

in the long run the consumer is going to make more money.

How? Steel tariffs will improve the situation for about 150,000 employees in the the steel industry. They will hurt the 5 million who have jobs that use steel as an input to their work. And the ultimate result is price increases for products made from steel. Who benefits?

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by Clocker

How? Steel tariffs will improve the situation for about 150,000 employees in the the steel industry. They will hurt the 5 million who have jobs that use steel as an input to their work. And the ultimate result is price increases for products made from steel. Who benefits?

You just sprinkle on a pinch of #MAGA and *poof!*

[fast4522]

You have no choice, just a mouth that will flap and flap as you watch more and more piss you off.

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by fast4522

You have no choice, just a mouth that will flap and flap as you watch more and more piss you off.

So... at this point the only thing you like about this is that I disagree with it.

That's cool. Let me fill you in on something though. I own a mortgage business. Now I could go into the whole relationship between equities and securities with you but its VERY obvious at this point you wouldn't understand that.

Essentially all this trade idiocy makes me more money as it applies pressure to interest rates.

So... knowing just how much you don't like me at least you can rest assured the stupidity of this trade policy is something I'm profiting off of.

[fast4522]

Originally Posted by elysiantraveller

So... at this point the only thing you like about this is that I disagree with it.

That's cool. Let me fill you in on something though. I own a mortgage business. Now I could go into the whole relationship between equities and securities with you but its VERY obvious at this point you wouldn't understand that.

Essentially all this trade idiocy makes me more money as it applies pressure to interest rates.

So... knowing just how much you don't like me at least you can rest assured the stupidity of this trade policy is something I'm profiting off of.

I like making moneys from all aspects in markets myself, I do not agree with you with the direction the country has gone in the past and I might benefit or lose because of what I believe but those are the breaks. You think that I do not like you, I just do not know you. You are more like a part of a group that is easy to loathe generally, not personally.

[johnhannibalsmith]

Originally Posted by fast4522

... You are more like a part of a group that is easy to loathe generally, not personally.

I wish we could use other posters' lines as our sig quotes sometimes.

[Inner Dirt]

Originally Posted by Clocker

Because it shows that if American companies are protected from competition from lower priced imports by tariffs, they are free to implement major price increases. And as always, the consumer pays the price.

I am pretty sure you predicted this well ahead of time if my memory is correct. I wish you were wrong and I hoped you would be. I bought some aluminum round rod a month ago that was quoted two months prior. New price 30% higher, the distributor blamed tariffs. Funny thing the mill it came from is in Virginia and mostly remelts scrap from local sources, in fact that mill buys scrap from the scrap yard I sell my scrap metal to. There isn't anything imported about them. Also the aluminum tariffs are 10%, if my memory is correct.