Trayvon Martin

[TJDave]

Originally Posted by Robert Fischer

If you are going to carry a gun somewhere you can't go using it every time you get your ass kicked.

I'd think the idea is that carrying a gun ensures that you never get your ass kicked.

[Pell Mell]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

Yes, thousands of folks are dying every day from fisticuffs.

I mean, just look at boxers. They're dropping like flies. Granted, they wear gloves, but still...

Is this a joke?

And let's not forget, this was NOT an unprovoked attack. That fact has been established. Zim wasn't just minding his own business when he was jumped from out of the blue. He was the instigator.

What if Martin felt threatened? How does "Stand Your Ground" apply to him now that he's dead?

If Martin was carrying, legally, and had cause to believe he was in danger he would be within his rights according to the law...did Zim identify himself? We don't know do we but we all have opinions..suppose Martin said "Hey man" wachoo foll'in me fo? and then gets nasty and decides to F**k up this dude..which is what I think happened...see, we all have opinions and if Zim was charged and I was on the jury he would walk...that's what's wrong with this country today...people are so use to taking shit, and we know who the waiters are that are serving it up, they think that's how it's supposed to be..

[Robert Fischer]

Originally Posted by TJDave

I'd think the idea is that carrying a gun ensures that you never get your ass kicked.

Yea, a gun means you don't have to work out.

That's fine if you don't go around the neighborhood initiating confrontations.

It's completely different to defend yourself in an unprovoked situation, or even these nuts that choose to make a good living as a bounty hunter or security guard...

...but you go out and initiate confrontations as a NEIGHBORHOOD WATCH and you had better have a BAD GUY on the other end of the bullet.

[Pell Mell]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

In Florida, manslaughter, defined as: The killing of a human being by the act, procurement, or culpable negligence of another, without lawful justification according to the provisions of chapter 776 and in cases in which such killing shall not be excusable homicide or murder . . . is a second degree felony punishable by up to 15 years in state prison regardless of whether the act may have been intentional or not.[2] If manslaughter is committed upon a child via culpable negligence under FL statute 827.03(3), then the crime is aggravated manslaughter of a child which is a first degree felony punishable by up to 30 years in state prison.[3] The penalty is the same if it is committed upon the elderly or disabled. Also, under the 10-20-Life system, if a firearm is used in any way then the penalty will be raised to the next degree.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manslaughter

" and in cases in which such killing shall not be excusable homicide or murder"..

Seems to me that if Zim were not charged because of the Stand Your Ground law that it would be an excusable murder...

The whole damned point to this case is that if Sharpton and Co. were not rabble rousing there would be no case...this is purely a political case..

[PaceAdvantage]

Originally Posted by Pell Mell

suppose Martin said "Hey man" wachoo foll'in me fo? and then gets nasty and decides to F**k up this dude..which is what I think happened...

Another idiot is born...welcome to the world Pell Mell

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Robert Fischer

Yea, a gun means you don't have to work out.

That's fine if you don't go around the neighborhood initiating confrontations.

It's completely different to defend yourself in an unprovoked situation, or even these nuts that choose to make a good living as a bounty hunter or security guard...

...but you go out and initiate confrontations as a NEIGHBORHOOD WATCH and you had better have a BAD GUY on the other end of the bullet.

Maybe Zimm did. Maybe Martin thought he was "bad", which is why he chose to ignore his girlfriend's advice and not continue to run. Maybe Martin decided to try turn the tables on Zimm. Maybe after that, things went south really fast for Martin...

And to confront someone means to face off, especially in a challenging way...to cause to meet...to bring face-to-face...to encounter. I don't think merely following someone meets that definition.

Boxcar

[PaceAdvantage]

Originally Posted by Pell Mell

The whole damned point to this case is that if Sharpton and Co. were not rabble rousing there would be no case...this is purely a political case..

No it's not. And the way you characterized Martin's speech patterns shows you are by no means an unbiased opinion. You're as rabble rousing and as race-motivated as Sharpton & Co., whether you want to believe so or not.

No case...what a freakin' joke. The 17yo was KILLED over nothing.

Zim walked away under his own power. Never even went to the hospital. There was no threat to his life. Note that this is DIFFERENT than saying Zim didn't FEEL there was a threat to his life. That's why a jury is required in this case.

I'm not saying whether or not he should be convicted and go to jail...that's for a JURY to figure out. If this case never sees a jury, that will be the ultimate injustice as far as I'm concerned.

There are way too many questions left unanswered for this guy to walk free as if nothing ever happened.

[Let's Roll]

Has the TM toxicology report been released yet ?

[PaceAdvantage]

Originally Posted by Let's Roll

Has the TM toxicology report been released yet ?

Has Zim's?

[chickenhead]

Anyone portraying he got his gun and went hunting is delusional. He was going grocery shopping with his gun.

He was going grocery shopping until he saw someone walking down the street, called the cops on him, and then started chasing him for no explicable reason. That is aberrant behavior. It's not normal or expected. I realize where you live, in Predator town, its called Tuesday. But everywhere else, I'm saying.

I've never even implied Zimmerman was some manhunter. All well intentioned, in his own mind. Way more well intentioned than I'll ever be, I'm sure. But lacking in reason. He didn't behave as any other reasonable person would. I know this because we are all in similar situations every day....look, a person walking! No 9-11. No chase-that-mother****er. For walking.

I said I thought there should be a trial. Zimmerman doesn't seem without fault, to me. That's what courts are for, to figure this stuff out.

That doesn't seem so outrageous, or so outraged, to me. It seems like a pretty normal, pretty boring response to a shooting: Trial. Normal. Expected.

Whatever *your own* needs are to make such a boring, hum drum opinion look like misplaced outrage or whatever -- that's your problem. But it's certainly been put on display in copious quantity.

[Let's Roll]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

Has Zim's?

That's a good question, I'd like to see them both.

[bigmack]

How is it the same folk running around saying 'no one knows what happened' are the same ones at the front of the line demanding justice?

I'll throw this out...

It's quite possible that they were both a bit freaked out. The kid is 17, someone is following him, (You'd think he'd just go back, but) - Georgie is doing his 'due diligence' thing, and has done it, many times prior, with furarm.

Here's the juicy part: I've heard a number of times that Georgie said he was REACHING for his cellular telephono. TM may have thought he was reaching for a gun, TM popped him, Gerogie scaaaacreamed, like a girl, drew gun and pow. Pow.

With that scenario what to do? What to do?

[lsbets]

Originally Posted by bigmack

How is it the same folk running around saying 'no one knows what happened' are the same ones at the front of the line demanding justice?

I guess you don't understand that justice does not mean a guilty verdict. It means a thorough and complete investigation followed by a trial if warranted. I would think everyone would want that, especially when someone ends up dead.

And again, the people in this thread with the most knowledge of the use of force have said they don't feel the shooting was justified. Doesn't that at least cause you to pause for two seconds?

[Tom]

Originally Posted by TJDave

I'd think the idea is that carrying a gun ensures that you never get your ass kicked.

So whenever you go out for skittles from now on, pack heat.

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

Yes, thousands of folks are dying every day from fisticuffs.

I mean, just look at boxers. They're dropping like flies. Granted, they wear gloves, but still...

Is this a joke?

And let's not forget, this was NOT an unprovoked attack. That fact has been established. Zim wasn't just minding his own business when he was jumped from out of the blue. He was the instigator.

What if Martin felt threatened? How does "Stand Your Ground" apply to him now that he's dead?

You wasting your time... I covered all of this hundreds of posts ago.