Thread for Russian Attack on Ukraine

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by elysiantraveller

Remember folks... this is a war over Russian National Security and mostly NATO's fault.

https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1569965542693376000

Some here need to learn to just take the L.

Thank you for making my case again.

You believe Reuters, that obviously neutral western news source.

The west wants Ukraine in NATO and integrated into the western economies PERIOD. There's no way the west would agree to that deal or they would have made it before the war started.

I wish we could make wagers on things like this.

I'd bet anything this war could have been avoided by guaranteeing that certain eastern European countries would never join NATO, guaranteeing their security from Russia, and the west agreeing to stop interfering in the internal politics of the region. The west would never agree to those terms because the long term plan is to overthrow Putin and replace him with a pro west government. It will be done internally with some kind of coup or revolution, but that's the plan and why we are at war.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by mhaney0423

Just out of curiousity, how would you feel about the Spanish speaking people in the southern US wanting to me more closely aligned with Mexico? It would be freedom? Maybe Mexico would grant Texas and Arizona freedom?

Personally, as a libertarian, I would be in favor of it as long as the people that wanted to remain part of the US could leave.

When business partners, husbands and wives, friends etc... can't get along anymore, they break up.

Hell, I'd be in favor of the US splitting up into 2-4 pieces if the politics remain as hostile are they are now. To me, freedom is not winning an election and using my new power to impose my will on the losers. Freedom means some level of compromise, but if we can't compromise anymore it means breaking up and being free to make my life what I and other like minded people want it to be.

I had no problem compromising with the democrats a few decades ago even though I'd occasionally get annoyed if I thought they were making an obvious economic error. I can't compromise with the people in power now. I think they are some combination of extreme corruption, totalitarianism, economic illiteracy, and social delusion. I can't find many redeeming qualities. I say that as someone that is no fan of a lot of the republicans either, but imo they are certainly less bad.

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

Here's the issue.

People read the US press.

Here's the issue...

You have priors and no amount of information will let you change them.

What's startling is you literally say the truth out loud with your weird waffling. Then you backtrack because agendas gotta agenda...

It's not a revanchist war... Russia is just trying to reunite russophones. (You said this)

These countries can have their independence but can't negotiate their own treaties. (You also said this)

Was it "western propaganda" when I linked Putin's own words from his declaration of the special operation?

I'm not going to waste my time replying to anymore of your posts since your default response is "blah blah western media."

It's boring. Pointless.

You're a self proclaimed libertarian so by default you're cool with colonialism and imperialism... would be much easier if you just owned it.

[fast4522]

Russia is looking to take the resources it needs, just like Japan did in WW2. Death is not a problem for Putim. It is none of our business because it is not in our national interest, I am glad it is not in the news every day.

[mhaney0423]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

Personally, as a libertarian, I would be in favor of it as long as the people that wanted to remain part of the US could leave.

When business partners, husbands and wives, friends etc... can't get along anymore, they break up.

Hell, I'd be in favor of the US splitting up into 2-4 pieces if the politics remain as hostile are they are now. To me, freedom is not winning an election and using my new power to impose my will on the losers. Freedom means some level of compromise, but if we can't compromise anymore it means breaking up and being free to make my life what I and other like minded people want it to be.

I had no problem compromising with the democrats a few decades ago even though I'd occasionally get annoyed if I thought they were making an obvious economic error. I can't compromise with the people in power now. I think they are some combination of extreme corruption, totalitarianism, economic illiteracy, and social delusion. I can't find many redeeming qualities. I say that as someone that is no fan of a lot of the republicans either, but imo they are certainly less bad.

Now in this scenario of course, it would be necessary for Mexico to annex Texas and Arizona by force......you still OK with it? If your answer is yes, I can't help you and I can't explain what's really happening in Ukraine.

[elysiantraveller]

Be wild if we start seeing more of this...

https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status/1570054722563997698

__________________
Dumbest timeline confirmed...

[mhaney0423]

Originally Posted by elysiantraveller

Be wild if we start seeing more of this...

https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status...54722563997698

You know its about over when Russia finds it necessary to destroy civilian infrastructure, i.e. Dams, Electric Plants, Etc. Just pure cowardice, I only wish Ukraine could respond in kind and knock out power to all of Moscow or maybe the Sayano-Shushenskaya Dam.

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by mhaney0423

You know its about over when Russia finds it necessary to destroy civilian infrastructure, i.e. Dams, Electric Plants, Etc. Just pure cowardice, I only wish Ukraine could respond in kind and knock out power to all of Moscow or maybe the Sayano-Shushenskaya Dam.

With their limited stocks it's wasteful tbh.

The dam strike made sense only to slow the Ukrainian counteroffensive in the south. Currently there is one, possibly two, Russian divisions trapped on the west side of the Dneiper.

Russia, I don't think, has a choice but to forfeit Kherson but will they is the next question. Would be a pretty calamitous admission of defeat there.

[elysiantraveller]

●●● Western Propaganda Alert! ●●●

The opening minutes of this should be enlightening to those who think large groups of Ukrainians actually wanted to join Russia...

https://twitter.com/JuliaDavisNews/status/1570493649284378628

__________________
Dumbest timeline confirmed...

[PaceAdvantage]

Ukraine is yet another mess the western world and more specifically, our wonderful US gov't helped to create. Russia is merely doing the dirty work of helping ensure it's turned into yet another US-backed utter shit show (hello Iraq & Afghanistan, we're looking at you).

Between Joe & Hunter's dealings down there over the years (yeah, it actually matters in this conversation), to the absolute corrupt nature of the Ukrainian government over the past decades (google it), we're getting exactly what every idiot in DC was looking for.

Just remember, if Biden didn't magically come up with 81 million miraculous votes, NONE OF THIS would be happening right now.

We should ask the ordinary citizens of Ukraine what they would rather have.

This war (whether they "win" or lose), or go back to 2017-2020.

[elysiantraveller]

Offensive in the north has resumed with Ukrainain forces appearing to encircle Lyman. Another key railhead. Fighting being reported in multiple fronts east of the Oskil.

Getting very close to Russia being pushed back to pre February lines of contact in some places.

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

...

Or...

And just hear me out...

Russia could have not launched a war of conquest.

[PaceAdvantage]

When you poke a dumb animal with a stick often enough...it's going to do the only thing it knows how to do. Even if it ends up getting them killed.

They're obviously idiots...and have exposed themselves as nothing but a third rate conventional military force.

Bring on the nukes...I guess

[JustRalph]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

When you poke a dumb animal with a stick often enough...it's going to do the only thing it knows how to do. Even if it ends up getting them killed.

They're obviously idiots...and have exposed themselves as nothing but a third rate conventional military force.

Bring on the nukes...I guess

U.S. Air Force Generals are laughing at them, I’m sure.

The biggest reveal in all this, in my opine is that their soldiers are deserting mid battle. Not just a few either.

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

When you poke a dumb animal with a stick often enough...it's going to do the only thing it knows how to do. Even if it ends up getting them killed.

They're obviously idiots...and have exposed themselves as nothing but a third rate conventional military force.

Bring on the nukes...I guess

Honestly why do you keep persisting with the west has to be at fault for this?

Sweden and Finland weren't in NATO a year ago.

Even Russian state media has abandoned this narrative yet for some reason is persists among the tankie-right.