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Old 11-11-2010, 03:02 PM   #1
Phantombridgejumpe
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Bossert blames Z loss on schedule - I disagree

Jerry Bossert (NY Daily News) says Smith wasn't at fault, the owners were.

She was fit.
She was ready.
She just didn't get by Blame.

I don't see how racing against boys during the year would have made her more ready to pass that horse.

PS: I don't fault Smith either, sometimes they just lose, I don't need to find fault with anyone.
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:10 PM   #2
joanied
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None of it was Mike's fault...IMO, although I am a huge fan, Shirreff's made a mistake not taking her to CD early to get used to the surface, she needed a work over it.
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:29 PM   #3
andymays
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http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/mo...vember_11.html

Excerpt:

The blame falls squarely of the shoulders of her owners, Jerry and Ann Moss, along with trainer John Shirreffs, for keeping the mighty mare on such a conservative path, trying to keep her win streak alive, rather than trying to be the best by running with the best.


Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/mo...#ixzz150XkCPVH
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:36 PM   #4
The_Knight_Sky
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If Zenyatta had raced against the boys and/or over dirt strips,
Mr. Sherriffs would have known how much speed to drill into her in the mornings.

You simply cannot train over synths and leave it to chance that
the training will translate to a superior performance on the dirt.

That's akin to a novice scholastic runner training almost exclusively
on the grassy park trails for a track meet.
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:51 PM   #5
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Here is what I think. She had the perfect pace scenario, a decent trip, and came up a little short. If they ran this race 10 times, I'm not sure she wins more than once or twice. Just about any other pace scenario and she in not beating Blame. With similar, maybe she nips him once or twice.
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:53 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joanied
None of it was Mike's fault...IMO, although I am a huge fan, Shirreff's made a mistake not taking her to CD early to get used to the surface, she needed a work over it.
Definitely agree.
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:55 PM   #7
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I don't see any excuse that holds water. You can make the case it was her best ever performance. She simply got beat by a better horse that day.
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:57 PM   #8
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I'm pretty sure the author is talking more about HOY than anything else.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/mo...#ixzz150XkCPVH

Excerpt:

Tears were shed, and many souvenir tickets to win on Zenyatta were thrown to the ground, but more than likely, she'll go another year without winning Horse of the Year.

Last edited by andymays; 11-11-2010 at 03:59 PM.
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Old 11-11-2010, 04:08 PM   #9
The_Knight_Sky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andymays

Mr. Bossert is in high form.
He expresses my sentiments exactly.



It's not her fault, and it's certainly not the fault of jockey Mike Smith.
The blame falls squarely of the shoulders of her owners, Jerry and Ann Moss, along with trainer John Shirreffs, for keeping the mighty mare on such a conservative path, trying to keep her win streak alive, rather than trying to be the best by running with the best.

In 2008, they had the chance to take on Curlin in the Breeders' Cup Classic, in her backyard over a synthetic track that Curlin obviously didn't care for, but passed before running the Ladies' Classic.

Last year, they raced her just five times, four times against her own sex in California before trying the Classic and prevailing.

While becoming the first female to win the Classic, she beat the boys only once, something Rachel Alexandra did three times in 2009.

You think they would have learned, but they didn't.

This year, Zenyatta went to the gate six times, facing just females in her first five starts, winning each time, before taking a chance against the boys in the Classic.

She came up a head short to Blame, who faced open company in all five of his starts this year, defeating Zenyatta by a head on the track, where it means the most.

I fell in love with Zenyatta last week, seeing how kind of a horse she is, and how popular she is, but that doesn't mean she's Horse of the Year.

A lock for the Hall of Fame, Zenyatta did more for the sport than Blame ever will, but that doesn't mean she's Horse of the Year. Blame is.
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Old 11-11-2010, 04:09 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpitt84
Definitely agree.
It's reasonable to disagree, though.

Over the last decade, numerous trainers have asserted that the CD surface over which they trained their horses in the week leading up to the Derby didn't resemble the surface over which they ran on Derby Day. The implication is that the surface is changed manually to produce fast times.

It's possible that the surface was consistent throughout the week last week at CD, but I would not make such a generalization here. You don't know that bringing Zenyatta to Louisville earlier or working here more would have made the difference.
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Old 11-11-2010, 04:12 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cj
Here is what I think. She had the perfect pace scenario, a decent trip, and came up a little short. If they ran this race 10 times, I'm not sure she wins more than once or twice. Just about any other pace scenario and she in not beating Blame. With similar, maybe she nips him once or twice.
If Blame wasn't in the race, she wins by lengths.
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Old 11-11-2010, 04:12 PM   #12
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And good for Bossert, too. Good job not getting caught up in hype or emotion.

That's the way it should be.

I'm not saying that his conclusion is correct, but at least he reached it devoid of hype or emotion.
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Old 11-11-2010, 04:15 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greyfox
If Blame wasn't in the race, she wins by lengths.
If Haynesfield and Espoir City aren't in the race, Quality Road wins.
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Old 11-11-2010, 04:15 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greyfox
If Blame wasn't in the race, she wins by lengths.
Depends on the pace. If Blame isn't in it and they go the same fast pace, sure.
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Old 11-11-2010, 04:17 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valuist
If Haynesfield and Espoir City aren't in the race, Quality Road wins.
I bet Quality Road. In the rear view mirror I'm not sure he'd get the distance even with a softer pace scenario.
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