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Old 11-14-2022, 11:48 PM   #1711
classhandicapper
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Originally Posted by elysiantraveller View Post
If...;

Decimating your own military setting it back decades.

Destroying any international prestige you might have had.

Fracturing the CSTO.

Expanding NATO.

Losing a ground war to the poorest country in Europe.

Eroding your once iron grip on power (Putin).

If all of that is #winning.... fuck me... I don't want to know what your definition of losing is.
First off, I was the one telling you from before this got started that Russia has a GDP less than California and its supposed risk to the free world was the largest crock of shit imaginable. It was the equivalent of WMDs in Iraq. It was an excuse used by evil neocons to try to start a war to overthrow him. Same playbook. I was obviously right. He couldn't even handle Ukraine easily. The only risk was/is backing him into a corner so badly he uses nukes. Well, the necons got their war. We'll see if these imbeciles push him to use nukes.

Second, you missed the point of that prior post from KimDotCom.

Putin is making deals all over the world to sell his natural resources. The money is still flowing in and he's rebuilding his military while the war is ongoing. It's NATO that is being depleted.

The world is slowly moving away from dollar dominated trade. That's the "new world order" you laughed at. You didn't understand what the guy was saying. We are pushing Russia, China, India, and other countries together and away from the US dollar when the right strategy was to deal with Putin against China like Trump wanted to do. Of course we couldn't do that when pure evil like the neocons prefer war with anyone does doesn't bow down to them. Things are getting riskier for the west long term now.

Putin has a little bit of an issue with hard liners that want an all out assault, use of the air force, use of tactical nukes etc... to take all of Ukraine and just end it, but fortunately he is resisting WW3.

Other than that, when this is over he's going to be richer, Russia will be more secure because Ukraine will be decimated and not in NATO, his primary goal will be achieved, and he will have new alliances in trade moving away from the US.
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Old 11-15-2022, 12:29 AM   #1712
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First off, I was the one telling you from before this got started that Russia has a GDP less than California and its supposed risk to the free world was the largest crock of shit imaginable. It was the equivalent of WMDs in Iraq. It was an excuse used by evil neocons to try to start a war to overthrow him. Same playbook. I was obviously right. He couldn't even handle Ukraine easily. The only risk was/is backing him into a corner so badly he uses nukes. Well, the necons got their war. We'll see if these imbeciles push him to use nukes.
Russia invaded Ukraine so we could overthrow him... Got it...

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Second, you missed the point of that prior post from KimDotCom.
Wouldn't say I "missed" it. I didn't read it at all.

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Putin is making deals all over the world to sell his natural resources. The money is still flowing in and he's rebuilding his military while the war is ongoing. It's NATO that is being depleted.
He already had those.

If he was rebuilding his military as you say why is he buying Iranian SRBMs and Drones?

A clue... because all of his factories are shut down.

He isn't building shit let alone rebuilding.

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Originally Posted by classhandicapper View Post
The world is slowly moving away from dollar dominated trade. That's the "new world order" you laughed at. You didn't understand what the guy was saying. We are pushing Russia, China, India, and other countries together and away from the US dollar when the right strategy was to deal with Putin against China like Trump wanted to do. Of course we couldn't do that when pure evil like the neocons prefer war with anyone does doesn't bow down to them. Things are getting riskier for the west long term now.
I like how this is your new pivot. The Dollar.

What's the replacement? The Yuan? Laughable... India, which is a lynchpin to this cockamamie theory of yours, isn't particularly receptive to Chinese regional dominance.

As far as dealing with China perhaps you haven't been monitoring the scoreboard lately but they aren't a threat to America militarily or economically at this point.

Pax Americana isn't going anywhere.

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Putin has a little bit of an issue with hard liners that want an all out assault, use of the air force, use of tactical nukes etc... to take all of Ukraine and just end it, but fortunately he is resisting WW3.
Two paragraphs up you blame the neocon's for this. Now its Hardliner's that want war on a grander scale than the already pretty grand scale we're seeing.

Whatever happened to uniting Russian speaking peoples which was your excuse a few months ago?

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Other than that, when this is over he's going to be richer, Russia will be more secure because Ukraine will be decimated and not in NATO, his primary goal will be achieved, and he will have new alliances in trade moving away from the US.
- Sweden and Finland, on the border, will be in NATO.

- He will be down approximately 2000 tanks.

- 3000 Infantry fighting vehicles.

- He will have almost zero guided munition left.

- Turned a Guided Missile Cruiser and a Heavy Frigate into coral reefs.

- Lost roughly, current estimate, 100,000 troops.

Definitely victory acheived.

#winning

Meanwhile on planet Earth the rest of us can stick to hard facts about this confllict.

Been a pleasure as always.
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Old 11-15-2022, 12:35 AM   #1713
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Some of the replies here are always interesting.

Over the past 30 years. Basically since the collapse of the Soviet Union its always been easy for America to think its being "caught" by some foreign power/bloc.

In the 90s there was legitimate fear about the EU one day. The 2000's was the global war on terror. In the past decade the new bogeyman has been China.

I've been guilty of this mindset as well but if we've learned anything in the past 9 months or so its this;

The United States is the sole global hyperpower and there isn't anyone out there that's anywhere fucking close...
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Old 11-15-2022, 02:46 AM   #1714
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The United States is the sole global hyperpower and there isn't anyone out there that's anywhere fucking close...
Not with that demented old fool and his cackling sidekick (that YOU voted for) at the helm we're not...throw the woke military leaders (like Milley) into the pot and I'll likely double-down on this...
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Old 11-15-2022, 04:19 AM   #1715
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Not with that demented old fool and his cackling sidekick (that YOU voted for) at the helm we're not...throw the woke military leaders (like Milley) into the pot and I'll likely double-down on this...
That you think the alternative is absurd.
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Old 11-15-2022, 10:52 AM   #1716
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That you think the alternative is absurd.
They're the type of comments that disqualify people's opinions.

Anything to inject partisanship into the conversation.
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Old 11-15-2022, 10:53 AM   #1717
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They're the type of comments that disqualify people's opinions.

Anything to inject partisanship into the conversation.
You're right in one sense. Partisan politics has nothing to do with this conversation.

Both parties are absolute dog shit as of this point and neither can be relied upon to do what is best for this country.
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Old 11-15-2022, 12:12 PM   #1718
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You're right in one sense. Partisan politics has nothing to do with this conversation.

Both parties are absolute dog shit as of this point and neither can be relied upon to do what is best for this country.
Both parties have handled this conflict fairly well and the outcome so far is about as desired as possible.
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Old 11-15-2022, 12:21 PM   #1719
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Both parties have handled this conflict fairly well and the outcome so far is about as desired as possible.
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Old 11-15-2022, 01:57 PM   #1720
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At least two dead after Russian missile lands in Poland on Ukraine border

https://www.forexlive.com/news/at-le...rder-20221115/
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Old 11-15-2022, 02:18 PM   #1721
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At least two dead after Russian missile lands in Poland on Ukraine border

https://www.forexlive.com/news/at-le...rder-20221115/
Huge problem here, I dont see them invoking article 5 as this was likely due to inferior Russian technology, but I would expect further troop build ups, high alert status, and several ultimatums from NATO.....this could get bad real fast.
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Old 11-15-2022, 03:06 PM   #1722
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Huge problem here, I dont see them invoking article 5
We should defer to the expert and see if he thinks this will EVER happen...
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Old 11-15-2022, 03:09 PM   #1723
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We should defer to the expert and see if he thinks this will EVER happen...
It's Poland so... <shrugs>

Basically the Scrappy Doo of the alliance.

Definitely will do wonders for breaking the will of the West as Class has predicted.
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Old 11-15-2022, 03:11 PM   #1724
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Huge problem here, I dont see them invoking article 5 as this was likely due to inferior Russian technology, but I would expect further troop build ups, high alert status, and several ultimatums from NATO.....this could get bad real fast.
Or brinksmanship.

Maybe Chi told Putin that he just met with Biden for three hours and that a sniveling coward who couldn't put a coherent sentence toghter, push him.....remember, Biden was VP for Obama's "pink line" in the sand.
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Old 11-15-2022, 03:13 PM   #1725
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Or brinksmanship.

Maybe Chi told Putin that he just met with Biden for three hours and that a sniveling coward who couldn't put a coherent sentence toghter, push him.....
Yeah... I doubt that.

The Poles are itching for a reason to fuck the Russians up and make no mistake... they would fuck them up.
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