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03-05-2017, 04:59 PM
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#136
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 46,883
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Show Me the Wire
There is no show. Mythicisim is not accepted by accredited mainstream historians and/or theologians.
You should know this and when he quoted their works, you could have told him to apply the burden of peer review to his sources, like he applies to you.
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I went one better than "peer review". I told him to cite just one ancient first century source that even questioned the existence of Jesus or in any way casts doubt on his existence. But what do we find instead with secular ancient sources? We find Jesus' existence everywhere to be presumed if not outright stated.
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Consistent profits can only be made on the basis of analysis that is far from obvious to the majority. - anonymous guru
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03-05-2017, 05:23 PM
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#137
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Librocubicularist
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 10,466
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxcar
But what do we find instead with secular ancient sources? We find Jesus' existence everywhere to be presumed if not outright stated.
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Definition:
pre•sume ► v. To take for granted as being true in the absence of proof to the contrary.
This is "the argument from ignorance, which claims that a proposition is true because it has not been shown to be false, perhaps the most common logical fallacy in religious apologetics." -- Iron Chariots Wiki
Quote:
Originally Posted by boxcar
I went one better than "peer review". I told him to cite just one ancient first century source that even questioned the existence of Jesus or in any way casts doubt on his existence.
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This is also an attempt to shift the burden of proof which falls upon the one making the claim. It is not up to the skeptic to provide a questioning source, rather it is up to the claimant to provide an affirmative source.
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Sapere aude
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03-05-2017, 05:27 PM
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#138
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Librocubicularist
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 10,466
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxcar
And let another show begin...  |
About time. The thread has been languishing. 
By the way, I may be absent for a while. My computer has been intermittently acting up. It's still in warranty but the dealer says I have to send it back to the manufacturer for repair. I figure shipping both ways will take a week and repair will probably take another week (mostly waiting in the queue). So I may be out for two weeks or more.
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Sapere aude
Last edited by Actor; 03-05-2017 at 05:32 PM.
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03-05-2017, 05:53 PM
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#140
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 4,553
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03-05-2017, 05:53 PM
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#141
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Quintessential guru
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 11,254
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VigorsTheGrey
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No. Not in the manner being used by Actor.
__________________
A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined; to which end a uniform and well-digested plan is requisite; and their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories as tend to render them independent of others for essential, particularly military, supplies.
George Washington
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03-05-2017, 05:53 PM
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#142
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 46,883
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Actor
About time. The thread has been languishing.
By the way, I may be absent for a while. My computer has been intermittently acting up. It's still in warranty but the dealer says I have to send it back to the manufacturer for repair. I figure shipping both ways will take a week and repair will probably take another week (mostly waiting in the queue). So I may be out for two weeks or more. |
I really feel bad for your 'puter. On the other hand, it may welcome a break from you.
At any rate, I hope all goes well for both of you.
__________________
Consistent profits can only be made on the basis of analysis that is far from obvious to the majority. - anonymous guru
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03-05-2017, 05:55 PM
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#143
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Quintessential guru
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 11,254
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VigorsTheGrey
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Do you know what peer reviewed means?
__________________
A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined; to which end a uniform and well-digested plan is requisite; and their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories as tend to render them independent of others for essential, particularly military, supplies.
George Washington
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03-05-2017, 05:58 PM
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#144
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Quintessential guru
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 11,254
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HalvOnHorseracing
The name of the thread should be changed to "Two Atheists and a Lunatic Christian."
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After reviewing Vigors answer to PA, I suggest you may have to modify the title from two atheists to one atheist and one polytheists or pagan
__________________
A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined; to which end a uniform and well-digested plan is requisite; and their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories as tend to render them independent of others for essential, particularly military, supplies.
George Washington
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03-05-2017, 06:12 PM
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#145
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 4,553
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https://ia601507.us.archive.org/13/i...-Voli-1888.pdf
The Secret Doctrine by Blavatsky, this is a large file but loads easily on a computer...not recommended for download on phone or tablet.
Last edited by VigorsTheGrey; 03-05-2017 at 06:15 PM.
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03-05-2017, 09:58 PM
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#146
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 4,553
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Show Me the Wire
After reviewing Vigors answer to PA, I suggest you may have to modify the title from two atheists to one atheist and one polytheists or pagan
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I'm not an atheist for one cannot be against something that is admitted to have no material basis...
I am not a Pagan either, as I neither worship gods, nor rocks, nor stars...
I am not an agnostic because I really can't say that "I just don't know"...
I am, however, a student of philosophy and religion, including the mystery schools, and arcane and secret knowledge...I enjoy learning about all these areas including Judaism...
Last edited by VigorsTheGrey; 03-05-2017 at 09:59 PM.
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03-05-2017, 10:51 PM
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#147
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Denver
Posts: 4,163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VigorsTheGrey
I'm not an atheist for one cannot be against something that is admitted to have no material basis...
I am not a Pagan either, as I neither worship gods, nor rocks, nor stars...
I am not an agnostic because I really can't say that "I just don't know"...
I am, however, a student of philosophy and religion, including the mystery schools, and arcane and secret knowledge...I enjoy learning about all these areas including Judaism...
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An atheist is a person who disbelieves or lacks belief in the existence of God or gods.
Now, convince me you don't fit that definition.
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03-05-2017, 11:12 PM
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#148
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,549
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HalvOnHorseracing
An atheist is a person who disbelieves or lacks belief in the existence of God or gods.
Now, convince me you don't fit that definition.
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To "disbelieve" isn't the same as to "lack belief". To "disbelieve" means that your mind is made up on the matter...whereas to "lack belief" could mean that you just lack sufficient proof in order to "believe".
__________________
Live to play another day.
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03-05-2017, 11:23 PM
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#149
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Denver
Posts: 4,163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thaskalos
To "disbelieve" isn't the same as to "lack belief". To "disbelieve" means that your mind is made up on the matter...whereas to "lack belief" could mean that you just lack sufficient proof in order to "believe".
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Right, but in either case that makes you atheistic. Hence, either test (disbelieve or lacks belief) qualifies you.
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03-05-2017, 11:38 PM
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#150
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: St. Louis suburb
Posts: 1,761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VigorsTheGrey
I'm not an atheist for one cannot be against something that is admitted to have no material basis...
I am not a Pagan either, as I neither worship gods, nor rocks, nor stars...
I am not an agnostic because I really can't say that "I just don't know"...
I am, however, a student of philosophy and religion, including the mystery schools, and arcane and secret knowledge...I enjoy learning about all these areas including Judaism...
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The early moderns rejected the qualitative aspects of nature (intentionality, color, odor, taste, etc.) because they weren't quantifiable, attributing them to individual perceptions of things not actually existing in the physical world.
Do you agree?
__________________
"I like to come here (Saratoga) every year to visit my money." ---Joe E. Lewis
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