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Old 06-29-2022, 09:22 AM   #1
Andy Asaro
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Kickbacks in horseracing, say it ain’t so

https://pastthewire.com/kickbacks-in...ay-it-aint-so/


Excerpt:

Jomar Torres had been successful for eight previous WIN races on a 5 year-old racemare, a PA. bred by the name of CHUBB WAGON (Hey Chub), owned by Daniel Lopez and George Chestnutt of Joe-Dan Farm.
John Salamone continued

“Yes, there are the sweeteners and the kickbacks that are asked of the jockey to keep the mount. But heck, CHUB WAGON has done well with my guy, Jomar. Irad Ortiz won two races on her, as far as I know nobody was staked at the barn. Nobody! With her, my book is on Jomar, with the way he reads her and gets her to the wire”

Yesterday, CHUBB WAGON ran successfully in the 8th race at PARX. Not, however with Jomar Torres in the irons as he was replaced after Agent Salamone could not pay the $2000 sweetener requested by one of CHUBB’s owners to guarantee the ride.
And, this, after Salamone and his client, Jomar Torres, paid for barn parties after the 8 Torres piloted CHUBB wins. Eight wins with Jomar Torres. Eight parties.In addition to those parties Torres has personally paid $1100 to the groom as a kickback and Salamone the agent has paid several hundred dollars to barn staff.
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Old 06-30-2022, 05:21 AM   #2
zerosky
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Interesting article
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Old 06-30-2022, 08:56 AM   #3
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Is this much different than suspecting that certain jockeys are more or less aggressive depending on the trainer of the other horse because they want to get more mounts or not lose the ones they have?

We've all seen what looks like a tag team effort from uncoupled horses trained by the same trainer but for different owners or some jockey that normally herds and pins horses conveniently allowing his main client's favored horse to have a clear path when he had him blocked.
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Old 06-30-2022, 09:23 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by classhandicapper View Post
Is this much different than suspecting that certain jockeys are more or less aggressive depending on the trainer of the other horse because they want to get more mounts or not lose the ones they have?

We've all seen what looks like a tag team effort from uncoupled horses trained by the same trainer but for different owners or some jockey that normally herds and pins horses conveniently allowing his main client's favored horse to have a clear path when he had him blocked.
That is definitely a side effect of a Jockey so desperate to get into a big barn that he/she is willing to kick back 25% to the Trainer or his wife/relatives. This practice should definitely be stopped. And what gets me more than anything is that these people demanding kickbacks often don't need the money. They are extremely successful. Make me sick
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Old 06-30-2022, 10:07 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by classhandicapper View Post
We've all seen what looks like a tag team effort from uncoupled horses trained by the same trainer but for different owners ...


an uncoupled entry is known/expected to work together.

what we don't want is jockeys and agents controlled by owners and trainers other than to give their best effort for a given mount or entry.

politics is great fun and very impressive, but nobody wants to see most of the races drawn and failed to be hustled to suit owners, who then influence several jocks/agents.
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Old 06-30-2022, 10:47 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Asaro View Post
That is definitely a side effect of a Jockey so desperate to get into a big barn that he/she is willing to kick back 25% to the Trainer or his wife/relatives. This practice should definitely be stopped. And what gets me more than anything is that these people demanding kickbacks often don't need the money. They are extremely successful. Make me sick
There is never enough money

There are two kinds of money.

“Enough” and “not enough”

And the qualifications for those labels change every day
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Old 06-30-2022, 11:25 AM   #7
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an uncoupled entry is known/expected to work together.
Not if they are different owners.

If I owned a horse do you think I'd want my horse used as a rabbit, to herd on the turn, or break in/out to cut another horse off for some other owner?

There are so many partnerships these days there may be some crossover ownerships, but unless I'm benefitting a lot, I'm not going to want that. Other than using one as a rabbit, I don't want other stuff at all because it can be dangerous too.
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Old 06-30-2022, 11:30 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Andy Asaro View Post
That is definitely a side effect of a Jockey so desperate to get into a big barn that he/she is willing to kick back 25% to the Trainer or his wife/relatives. This practice should definitely be stopped. And what gets me more than anything is that these people demanding kickbacks often don't need the money. They are extremely successful. Make me sick
The question I have is even without kickbacks, are some jockeys so desperate to get or stay into the big barns they change riding tactics.
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Old 06-30-2022, 01:44 PM   #9
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Not if they are different owners.

If I owned a horse do you think I'd want my horse used as a rabbit, to herd on the turn, or break in/out to cut another horse off for some other owner?

There are so many partnerships these days there may be some crossover ownerships, but unless I'm benefitting a lot, I'm not going to want that. Other than using one as a rabbit, I don't want other stuff at all because it can be dangerous too.

When they start to shatter my perception of reality, I move on the next race.


Not an 'extreme' example relative to the more extreme stuff, and there weren't any shenanigans or scores 'put over', but the ml 2nd choice in today's 8th race MSW HEDY LEMARR is a complicated read. Madakat owns part.

Debut MSW - For Brown ridden by Irad, chases home a more important lower priced Brown to run 2nd.

2nd lifetime race - Maryland stakes shipping, attends pace to setup for the same lower priced more important Brown (Consumer Spending). Fin 5th.

3rd race MSW Aqu - Irad up, Sets pace for another Chad Brown horse, while both were 3/1 and finishes 2nd to Jose.

4th race - shipped to Florida, odd Leparoux up, next start will barn transfer to Kenneally. No action here.

5th race - Remember he's in Kenneally barn here; sets pace for a Brown 3/5 chalk, hangs on for 2nd.

Today - 2nd choice ml, but chalk is Brad Cox and Hedy Lamarr's owners (unless some recent drama I don't follow has happened) have partnered with many good Brad Cox horses.

quite the resume. And none of this stuff was form reversals or betting coups and all could be seen as fair in the perspective of Hedy Lamarr.
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Old 06-30-2022, 01:52 PM   #10
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That is definitely a side effect of a Jockey so desperate to get into a big barn that he/she is willing to kick back 25% to the Trainer or his wife/relatives. This practice should definitely be stopped. And what gets me more than anything is that these people demanding kickbacks often don't need the money. They are extremely successful. Make me sick
Absolutely.
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Old 06-30-2022, 01:54 PM   #11
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There is never enough money

There are two kinds of money.

“Enough” and “not enough”

And the qualifications for those labels change every day
Preach, Ralph!!!
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Old 06-30-2022, 04:00 PM   #12
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there is only one thing better than money and that is more money.
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Old 07-01-2022, 11:57 PM   #13
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parx and a photo of delaware park...... we're giving these people casino players money and it still isn't enough!!
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Old 07-02-2022, 08:23 AM   #14
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you really wonder what the hell is going on in this game today. the jockeys paying off for mounts has been high spread for this whole century. then all the ped's that were given to the horses and now partially banned. then you have the guys like Navarro and company that were hitting the horse with super-duper rocket fuel. and what about the highly respected trainers that hire traveling veterinarians from Kentucky to come once or twice a month to inject every joint in every horse in their barns.

just because shockwave and tapping is legal depending upon the time before the race doesn't make it right, do you guys really think that the vet that does the injecting doesn't run to the window and place the unknowledgeable bettor at a distinct pari-mutuel disadvantage every time he plunks down his money.

as it turns out, the racing game protects the big trainers that are the star of the show along with their high-paying owners, and the game shoves it up the ass of the smaller player that is the lifeline of the game along with the smaller owners and trainers. instead of limiting these big guys, they turn the game in their favor and penalize the smaller guy.
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