Religion III

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Actor

The problem being that it is highly doubtful that this "God-Man" ever existed. On the off-chance that some itinerant preacher named Jesus did exist the idea that he rose from the dead is absolutely ridiculous.

So sin is "transgression against the law of God," etc., etc. The problem being that there is absolutely no evidence that any deity exists.

Studies have been done. Those most likely to reject the God Hypothesis are (1)highly intelligent and (2)highly educated. Those most likely to accept the God Hypothesis are (1)of low intelligence and/or (2)poorly educated.

You forgot to state the top reason why people reject the "God Hypothesis": They don't want to believe because they want to live autonomously and do what they think is right in their own eyes.

Little do such people know, who think they are wise in their own eyes, that the day will come when they will be put to shame and utterly dismayed (Jer 8:9). Their wisdom will vanish and the intelligence of the intelligent will be hidden (Isa 29:14).

[Actor]

Originally Posted by boxcar

You forgot to state the top reason why people reject the "God Hypothesis": They don't want to believe because they want to live autonomously and do what they think is right in their own eyes.

You make the claim. The burden of proof is yours.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by boxcar

You forgot to state the top reason why people accept the "God Hypothesis": They want to believe because they want to live autonomously and do what they think is right in their own eyes.

FTFY!

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Actor

FTFY!

NO, no, no. You don't get it. Born again believers do NOT want to live autonomously. It's people like yourself who reject Christ (and people have different ways of doing this!) who want to cut all ties with God. Read Psalm 2 someday. What it says about the nations in that psalm applies equally, of course, to individuals.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by Actor

You make the claim. The burden of proof is yours.

The burden of proof is still yours. I'm waiting.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Actor

The burden of proof is still yours. I'm waiting.

What claim did I make? You made the claim that God-deniers aren't seeking autonomy, right? So prove it.

Conversely, true born again believers whom God has brought into his kingdom, willfully and joyfully submit to the lordship of Christ -- to the Law of Christ.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by boxcar

What claim did I make?

This claim. Viz., post #8356 "You forgot to state the top reason why people reject the 'God Hypothesis': They don't want to believe because they want to live autonomously and do what they think is right in their own eyes."

Originally Posted by boxcar

You made the claim that God-deniers aren't seeking autonomy, right? So prove it.

Fallacy of shifting the burden of proof. Your claim predates any post I made on the subject. You were the first to use the word "autonomously."

The burden of proof is still yours.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Actor

This claim. Viz., post #8356 "You forgot to state the top reason why people reject the 'God Hypothesis': They don't want to believe because they want to live autonomously and do what they think is right in their own eyes."

Fallacy of shifting the burden of proof. Your claim predates any post I made on the subject. You were the first to use the word "autonomously."

The burden of proof is still yours.

Okay. That's simple. Pay attention. Since everyone wants to be their own boss -- make up their own moral standards -- do what is right in their own eyes -- make up the rules as they go, etc, this accounts for the universal Law of Distrust. This is why there is this universal presumption that people unknown to us should be distrusted. Each of us knows that another person might indeed not have our best interests at heart; therefore we presume that person to be untrustworthy until that he/she proves otherwise and earns our trust.

P.S. This is also why faith is a virtue, according to scripture. But the world system doesn't operate on this virtue.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Okay. That's simple. Pay attention. Since everyone wants to be their own boss -- make up their own moral standards -- do what is right in their own eyes -- make up the rules as they go, etc, this accounts for the universal Law of Distrust. This is why there is this universal presumption that people unknown to us should be distrusted. Each of us knows that another person might indeed not have our best interests at heart; therefore we presume that person to be untrustworthy until that he/she proves otherwise and earns our trust.

This so-called "universal Law of Distrust", if it exists, would be the result of Darwinian evolution, i.e., natural selection. In any case there are plenty of instances where trustworthiness of others is assumed

Originally Posted by boxcar

P.S. This is also why faith is a virtue, ...

Faith is belief without evidence.

Originally Posted by boxcar

... according to scripture.

Duh! Religion depends on unquestioning belief for its very existence. Of course it's going to promote faith as a virtue.

Originally Posted by boxcar

But the world system doesn't operate on this virtue.

I think you are wrong there. Many institutions of religion and government depend of unquestioning belief. It's unfortunate that so may are successful.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Actor

This so-called "universal Law of Distrust", if it exists, would be the result of Darwinian evolution, i.e., natural selection. In any case there are plenty of instances where trustworthiness of others is assumed
Faith is belief without evidence.
Duh! Religion depends on unquestioning belief for its very existence. Of course it's going to promote faith as a virtue.
I think you are wrong there. Many institutions of religion and government depend of unquestioning belief. It's unfortunate that so may are successful.

Darwinianism supposedly controls and accounts for our physical existence in physical, but not our moral/spiritual outlook that governs our behavior. Morality is not a physical thing.

Of course, there are plenty of instances where trustworthiness is assumed: It's generally assumed with people we know. As stated previously, people usually have to earn our trust.

And this brings us to the question of faith: Faith is like Fear: Either one of these can be rational or irrational in nature. Would you walk into a lion's cage, blindly, irrationally trusting that the lion will receive you with open paws and make nice with you like a little puddy cat, or would you have a healthy, rational fear of the beast and distrust him because you don't know him and he doesn't know you?

The Christian Faith is grounded in rational faith -- not blind, irrational faith.

[dnlgfnk]

Originally Posted by Actor

Religion depends on unquestioning belief for its very existence.

The Catholic Church, for one, rejects fideism.
But look what happened when atheist Thomas Nagel "questioned" the neo-Darwinian orthodoxy regarding emergent consciousness...

https://www.wilsonquarterly.com/quar...neo-darwinists

The atheist, neuroscientist and polymath Raymond Tallis has questioned similarly, "What was the purpose of consciousness when reproduction was doing just fine"?

The examples of reason & faith are numerous. Leibniz "Why is there anything at all"?, Aristotle's answer (act and potency) to Parmenides regarding change, which Aquinas built upon, and Heisenberg adapted to explain probabilities in quantum mechanics. Etc, etc.

[Light]

It doesn't matter to God whether you are an Atheist or not. He doesn't operate on such a superficial level as "beliefs" which are all human constructs of the master of illusions.

"Belief" or "disbelief" in God are two sides of the same coin of belief. God is an experience. God is who you are deep down. If you don't know that, then yes, God is a mere intellectual exercise of debate of beliefs which can only go nowhere.

Many Atheists who visited the afterlife during an NDE saw God and became believers afterwards. But they were never admonished for not believing up till then and never threatened with the nonsense boxcar spews for not believing.

One asked God what religion he was and God said "no religion" and that all who pray to their own Gods end up praying to Him.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Morality is not a physical thing.

So, what is it?

[Actor]

Originally Posted by dnlgfnk

The atheist, neuroscientist and polymath Raymond Tallis has questioned similarly, "What was the purpose of consciousness when reproduction was doing just fine"?

He does not understand how natural selection works.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by dnlgfnk

The Catholic Church, for one, rejects fideism.

So??? Why should non-Catholics carw what the Catholic Church thinks?