The DQ (or non-DQ) complaint thread

[v j stauffer]

Originally Posted by Hoofless_Wonder

Race 4 today at Del Mar - start of the pick 6.

4/5 taken down, 19-1 put up. Evidence that odds don't matter (which I think is true).

Looked a bit ticky tack to me, with the running up almost directly into the back end of the . Could see the argument either way.

If it's a Breeder's Cup race, the stays up.

Don't think it stays up in the Breeders Cup either.

Very easy call.

Here's the way to navigate watching the head on.

All horses are entitled to a clear and unobstructed path.

1st question. Did have a clear path to the wire. Answer yes. 2nd question. Did take away that path without being sufficiently clear? Answer yes. 3rd question. Was cost an opportunity as a better placing? Answer yes. That was made very clear by the way re-rallied and was gaining on .

If only they were all that easy.

[Stillriledup]

Originally Posted by Hoofless_Wonder

Race 4 today at Del Mar - start of the pick 6.

4/5 taken down, 19-1 put up. Evidence that odds don't matter (which I think is true).

Looked a bit ticky tack to me, with the running up almost directly into the back end of the . Could see the argument either way.

If it's a Breeder's Cup race, the stays up.

This came down in BC

[YT=""]31N5AJktBoY[/YT]

[Hoofless_Wonder]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

Don't think it stays up in the Breeders Cup either.

Very easy call.

Here's the way to navigate watching the head on.

All horses are entitled to a clear and unobstructed path.

1st question. Did have a clear path to the wire. Answer yes. 2nd question. Did take away that path without being sufficiently clear? Answer yes. 3rd question. Was cost an opportunity as a better placing? Answer yes. That was made very clear by the way re-rallied and was gaining on .

If only they were all that easy.

It appeared to me that the caused some of his own trouble by running up directly behind the . For a couple of strides, I thought he was going to the inside, and then there may not have been an inquiry at all, as the results could have stood.

When the came out, it didn't look like the was lapped on (unlike SRU's BC example), though it's hard to judge how much clearance the horse had. Since we see horses not maintain straight paths when passing other horse (i.e., get back down on the golden rail), it's a gray area (judgement call) as to what point in the race the must maintain a straight path. And I'm not totally sure that that point had been reached.

And while I agree that the did surge again, and was coming on late, I have a problem with (again) a judgement call being made that he would eventually have stormed by, or would have won had he not had to alter his path and go a bit wider. We know there's plenty of hanging sucker horses who would never win in that scenario. In Aussie racing or Hong Kong, I believe the winner stays up.

In complete disclosure, I had no vested interest after the next race, as I had the in a cheap pick six, and the in a pick three, missing the next leg on both of those tickets.

[v j stauffer]

Originally Posted by Hoofless_Wonder

It appeared to me that the caused some of his own trouble by running up directly behind the . For a couple of strides, I thought he was going to the inside, and then there may not have been an inquiry at all, as the results could have stood.

When the came out, it didn't look like the was lapped on (unlike SRU's BC example), though it's hard to judge how much clearance the horse had. Since we see horses not maintain straight paths when passing other horse (i.e., get back down on the golden rail), it's a gray area (judgement call) as to what point in the race the must maintain a straight path. And I'm not totally sure that that point had been reached.

And while I agree that the did surge again, and was coming on late, I have a problem with (again) a judgement call being made that he would eventually have stormed by, or would have won had he not had to alter his path and go a bit wider. We know there's plenty of hanging sucker horses who would never win in that scenario. In Aussie racing or Hong Kong, I believe the winner stays up.

In complete disclosure, I had no vested interest after the next race, as I had the in a cheap pick six, and the in a pick three, missing the next leg on both of those tickets.

Several points. Not trying to pick apart your analysis. But there are some flaws.

1st. Watch the head on. You can clearly see then you can't. The reason is crossed over in front of him. Did come in slightly? I suppose so, just a bit. But clearly crosses in front of him.

You said it's hard to judge how much clearance had. How much? Maybe. Enough? No chance. The general rule of thumb is a length and a half. wasn't even a full length in front of . Not sufficiently clear.

There is NEVER a point where doesn't have to maintain a straight course from the gate to the wire. The rules don't change. Again, to cross into the path of a rival a horse must be sufficiently clear. At any point on the track.

Stewards do not have to judge whether was going to pass . The rule reads was cost an "opportunity" at a better placing. While nobody knows for sure if would have passed , I think he would have. That is not the criteria. Was he cost and opportunity to pass ? IMO 100% yes.

Easy call.

Hope that helps.

[EMD4ME]

Only question was : is he placed 2nd or possibly 3rd.


Correct DQ and placement in this case IMHO

[Redhook206]

Fairly new to this site, but is VJ Stauffer Vic Stauffer? Former Hollywood Park Announcer?

[Stillriledup]

Originally Posted by Redhook206

Fairly new to this site, but is VJ Stauffer Vic Stauffer? Former Hollywood Park Announcer?

Yes, that's the real Vic.

[v j stauffer]

Originally Posted by Redhook206

Fairly new to this site, but is VJ Stauffer Vic Stauffer? Former Hollywood Park Announcer?

Unless you work for the IRS in which case my name is Fernando El Malaguena. Ole'

[Ocala Mike]

Yes, Vic has taken the jump up in class from "goofontheroof" to PA mainstay. Lately, I think he's in charge of the Dispute Resolution section of the site.

[Stillriledup]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

Unless you work for the IRS in which case my name is Fernando El Malaguena. Ole'

Check out the Michael Bolton IRS 'love song' from the John Oliver show, hilarious!

[EMD4ME]

Chuck Town race 5 tonight. IMHO a total Bullcrap DQ. If that's a DQ, they need to have a DQ in 6 races a night there.

I had no wager, just in case people are wondering. Just happen to have the NYRA channel on and saw the race.

[bello]

Last Friday ( or Th) they had an awful leave up of a hirse that should have clearly come down.

This was the most ridiculous take down I have ever seen. And it was quick. There was NO foul, and I had the three

[EMD4ME]

Originally Posted by bello

Last Friday ( or Th) they had an awful leave up of a hirse that should have clearly come down.

This was the most ridiculous take down I have ever seen. And it was quick. There was NO foul, and I had the three

They took no time to make the decision, didn't really show the head on clearly. You can tell what was going to happen.

Bello, I appreciate your honesty, despite your wager on the horse put up.

[Stillriledup]

Originally Posted by EMD4ME

Chuck Town race 5 tonight. IMHO a total Bullcrap DQ. If that's a DQ, they need to have a DQ in 6 races a night there.

I had no wager, just in case people are wondering. Just happen to have the NYRA channel on and saw the race.

CT and Mountain lead the nation in DQs and non DQs that defy any kind of consistency or logic. Bet these places at your own risk.

[Redhook206]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

Unless you work for the IRS in which case my name is Fernando El Malaguena. Ole'

So cool to have Vic in the house! Really enjoyed your calls at HP. Especially when Zenyatta was 20 lengths back at the top of the lane.

Would love your opinion on my bad beat DQ last week at Delta. See my post on page 56. Ultracapper gave a solid writeup. Do you agree with us?