Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com - Horse Racing Message Board

Go Back   Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com - Horse Racing Message Board > Off Topic > Off Topic - General


Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old 08-30-2021, 03:59 PM   #1
mostpost
Registered User
 
mostpost's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: North Riverside, Il.
Posts: 13,357
Why Biden is right on Afghanistan.

We’ll start with the situation he was handed when he took office. There was already an agreement in place signed by Donald Trump that all US forces would be out of Afghanistan by May 1, 2021. In exchange for that, Trump had wrested one concession from the Taliban. That they would not attack US troops. They made no promises about attacking Afghan government troops; no promises about attacking coalition troops from other nations,; no promises to negotiate with Afghan government; no promises to not give safe haven to terrorists. In other words, that gave up nothing.

Even before he took office, Biden was put in an untenable position.

Even so, things would probably have gone OK were it not for the incredible corruption and incompetence of the Afghan government. And the fact that Trump completely shut the Afghan government out of his Troop withdrawal negotiations with the Taliban.

As a result, the Taliban by passed the central government and negotiated with local authorities and military leaders. Negotiated there surrender and withdrawal from the battlefield. All of this unknown to the Trump administration or the Afghan government.

Enter now Joe Biden and the new administration. Their objective is to get our troops out of Afghanistan as quickly as possible. And they have this agreement negotiated by Trump to work with. Even so, they recognize that the May 1 deadline is impossible to meet. So they extend it four months and the Taliban agrees.

The unspoken foundation for all this was that Afghan’s government was sufficiently trained and sufficiently powerful to continue holding off the Taliban. This was obviously not the case in retrospect, but it was believed by both the outgoing and the incoming administration.

Which brings us to the two major issues of the withdrawal; the loss of American military equipment and technology to the Taliban and the failure to evacuate all our Afghan allies who wished to leave.

Dealing with the military equipment etc. first. There are two categories here; Equipment and weapons possessed by US forces, and those in possession of Afghan government forces. The former were basically destroyed or evacuated. The latter were supposed to be used by the Afghan government in its fight against the Taliban. The presumption was the government was strong enough to survive without us. Reclaiming our weapons and equipment would have rendered that impossible.

Of course, that presumption was incorrect, but by then it was too late. It’s not like all the Blackhawk helicopters were sitting on the tarmac at one Air Base , or all Armored Personnel Carriers were parked at one motor pool. Ammunition and weapons were in as many different places as the Afghan troops.

Removing or destroying all that was impossible.

As for the evacuation of the Afghan interpreters, scouts and other assets, when the Taliban took control, everyone wanted to get out. But how many had even applied when they thought the government was in charge, when they thought the would be safe. People don’t easily leave their homes, their country unless under duress. Certainly they don’t do it having no job prospects and no place to live at their destination.

In spite of all that, we have evacuated more than 120,000 people in the last two weeks.
__________________
Proud Possessor of Zero Rep Points.
mostpost is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 04:12 PM   #2
OntheRail
Registered User
 
OntheRail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 4,800
Ha ha you and Joe two turds in a toilet. So you going to at least give credit to that Atlantic article you just rubbed one out after reading it... or are you claiming original thought here.

Funny you are the one I thought of while scanning that piece of garbage. Thought boy this sounds just like MoPo. And then

No Joe phucked it up big time... no amount of spin is going to shake the shit stain and stench of failure off him.
__________________
Remember To Help Old Friends Thoroughbred Retirement Center.
OntheRail is online now   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 04:24 PM   #3
Jeff P
Registered User
 
Jeff P's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: JCapper Platinum: Kind of like Deep Blue... but for horses.
Posts: 4,157
Sometimes a picture is worth 1000 words.

Link to Branco Cartoon:
https://legalinsurrection.com/2021/0...artoon-plan-b/


-jp

.

Attached Images
File Type: jpg Branco083021.JPG (85.8 KB, 36 views)
__________________
Team JCapper: 2011 PAIHL Regular Season ROI Leader after 15 weeks
www.JCapper.com
Jeff P is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 04:25 PM   #4
Inner Dirt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Beaverdam Virginia
Posts: 3,980
Stop blaming Trump, Biden overturned everything he could that Trump did, but he decided to honor an agreement with a terrorist organization? The poorly planned pull out looked like the running of the bulls times a couple thousand. How anyone could make excuses for that mess is beyond belief, it appears you are as out of touch with reality as Biden is. 13 brave soldiers died because of Biden and all he cared about is trying to lie his way out of the disaster he created, nobody with a lick of common sense bought his fake grieving at the podium. The mumbling on about his own son was as pathetic as it gets. Worst president in my lifetime by a country mile, and that is saying something.

Last edited by Inner Dirt; 08-30-2021 at 04:26 PM.
Inner Dirt is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 06:00 PM   #5
classhandicapper
Registered User
 
classhandicapper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queens, NY
Posts: 17,803
What a load of crap.

The question isn't necessarily whether we should have gotten out or the date we should have gotten out. It's the order in which he did things. He was beyond incompetent. It guaranteed a disaster.
__________________
“Truth is Treason in an Empire of Lies”
classhandicapper is online now   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 06:08 PM   #6
Inner Dirt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Beaverdam Virginia
Posts: 3,980
Quote:
Originally Posted by classhandicapper View Post
What a load of crap.

The question isn't necessarily whether we should have gotten out or the date we should have gotten out. It's the order in which he did things. He was beyond incompetent. It guaranteed a disaster.

I am shocked it wasn't worse.
Inner Dirt is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 06:12 PM   #7
Tom
The Voice of Reason!
 
Tom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Canandaigua, New york
Posts: 105,441
We are now out, early.
And we left American citizens who wanted to get out behind.

This is the legacy of Joseph bin Biden, traitor, coward, and scumbag.
__________________
Who does the Racing Form Detective like in this one?
Tom is online now   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 06:17 PM   #8
JustRalph
Just another Facist
 
JustRalph's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Now in Houston
Posts: 48,214
Quote:
Originally Posted by mostpost View Post
We’ll start with the situation he was handed when he took office. There was already an agreement in place signed by Donald Trump that all US forces would be out of Afghanistan by May 1, 2021. In exchange for that, Trump had wrested one concession from the Taliban. That they would not attack US troops. They made no promises about attacking Afghan government troops; no promises about attacking coalition troops from other nations,; no promises to negotiate with Afghan government; no promises to not give safe haven to terrorists. In other words, that gave up nothing.

Even before he took office, Biden was put in an untenable position.

Even so, things would probably have gone OK were it not for the incredible corruption and incompetence of the Afghan government. And the fact that Trump completely shut the Afghan government out of his Troop withdrawal negotiations with the Taliban.

As a result, the Taliban by passed the central government and negotiated with local authorities and military leaders. Negotiated there surrender and withdrawal from the battlefield. All of this unknown to the Trump administration or the Afghan government.

Enter now Joe Biden and the new administration. Their objective is to get our troops out of Afghanistan as quickly as possible. And they have this agreement negotiated by Trump to work with. Even so, they recognize that the May 1 deadline is impossible to meet. So they extend it four months and the Taliban agrees.

The unspoken foundation for all this was that Afghan’s government was sufficiently trained and sufficiently powerful to continue holding off the Taliban. This was obviously not the case in retrospect, but it was believed by both the outgoing and the incoming administration.

Which brings us to the two major issues of the withdrawal; the loss of American military equipment and technology to the Taliban and the failure to evacuate all our Afghan allies who wished to leave.

Dealing with the military equipment etc. first. There are two categories here; Equipment and weapons possessed by US forces, and those in possession of Afghan government forces. The former were basically destroyed or evacuated. The latter were supposed to be used by the Afghan government in its fight against the Taliban. The presumption was the government was strong enough to survive without us. Reclaiming our weapons and equipment would have rendered that impossible.

Of course, that presumption was incorrect, but by then it was too late. It’s not like all the Blackhawk helicopters were sitting on the tarmac at one Air Base , or all Armored Personnel Carriers were parked at one motor pool. Ammunition and weapons were in as many different places as the Afghan troops.

Removing or destroying all that was impossible.

As for the evacuation of the Afghan interpreters, scouts and other assets, when the Taliban took control, everyone wanted to get out. But how many had even applied when they thought the government was in charge, when they thought the would be safe. People don’t easily leave their homes, their country unless under duress. Certainly they don’t do it having no job prospects and no place to live at their destination.

In spite of all that, we have evacuated more than 120,000 people in the last two weeks.

Did you write this? Or did you plagiarize it like your hero? Fess up….
JustRalph is online now   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 06:34 PM   #9
Marshall Bennett
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Houston , Tx.
Posts: 8,799
Check the facts Mosty. Quit being an idiot. The Taliban almost immediately broke the terms of the agreement to the May 1 deadline. First and foremost, they failed to hold peace negotiations with the Afgan Govt. There were at least 2 other conditions they failed to follow, one of which was the continued inhumane treatment of Afgan civilians.
The May 1 deadline became null and void before Trump ever left office. Biden is a gd liar to tell Americans otherwise and shift blame anywhere else. He should be removed from office and imprisoned. He's directly responsible for the deaths of 13 servicemen and should be punished accordingly.
Marshall Bennett is online now   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 07:18 PM   #10
lex
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NY
Posts: 125
I don't believe for a second that Trump or Biden thought the Afghan army would hold up. We helped them build an army that was reliant on us and our contractors. I think Trump was convinced the Taliban would hold tight until we got out so it is a bit rich to see people from the Trump admin on TV worried about the women in the country.

Biden pulled out troops as the Taliban was moving their way across the country. That seems very shortsighted and I'm supposed to believe the DoD recommended that. Um no way.

I'm actually more interested in knowing why the Taliban didn't just sit around until we got out. I have to assume it was the optics of us running. Either way this pull out is on Biden. he proudly took credit for the plan. Harris proudly jumped on the bandwagon for credit. No one should be acting like this wasn't his doing.
lex is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 08:11 PM   #11
jay68802
Registered User
 
jay68802's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 13,797
And we are out. The with draw is complete. Thanks, to all the brave Americans who served and died.

And a big **** you to Joe Biden. Abandoning American citizens, leaving without getting them all out. You are a coward. Showing your true colors. A piece of shit who cares for only for yourself.
jay68802 is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 08:50 PM   #12
horsefan2019
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 239
What a load of crap...the problem wasn't that we didn't want to get out, it was the entire execution of the process....it was a major screw up by the current administration that put the Taliban back into power while the Afghan government we helped put into power collapsed because they hightailed in the middle of the night without being notified. In the process because of the chaotic pullout, 13 Marines got killed because of the botched process and we also left a bunch of civilians behind because they were afraid of the Taliban's hard deadline.
horsefan2019 is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 08:52 PM   #13
mostpost
Registered User
 
mostpost's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: North Riverside, Il.
Posts: 13,357
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marshall Bennett View Post
Check the facts Mosty. Quit being an idiot. The Taliban almost immediately broke the terms of the agreement to the May 1 deadline. First and foremost, they failed to hold peace negotiations with the Afgan Govt. There were at least 2 other conditions they failed to follow, one of which was the continued inhumane treatment of Afgan civilians.
The May 1 deadline became null and void before Trump ever left office. Biden is a gd liar to tell Americans otherwise and shift blame anywhere else. He should be removed from office and imprisoned. He's directly responsible for the deaths of 13 servicemen and should be punished accordingly.
https://www.state.gov/wp-content/upl...n-02.29.20.pdf
Here’s the transcript of the agreement. First of all there is nothing in there requiring the Taliban to continue their inhumane treatment of Afghan civilians.

And you are wrong about the Taliban not holding peace negotiations with the Afghan Govt. you it is true that said negotiations we’re supposed to start March of 2020 and didn’t start until September. As punishment for this failure to abide by the terms of the agreement, Trump accelerated the pace of the withdrawal. On the date we were supposed to have 8,600 troops in Afghanistan, we actually had less than 5,000 and by the time Trump left office our troop levels were down to 2,500.

ETA: nothing you said above is even close to a fact.
__________________
Proud Possessor of Zero Rep Points.

Last edited by mostpost; 08-30-2021 at 08:59 PM.
mostpost is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-30-2021, 08:52 PM   #14
xtb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Western NY
Posts: 2,796
Trump was prepared to conduct a conditional and intelligent withdrawl and cut our losses. Biden surrendered unconditionally and disgracefully like a coward and lost everything gained over the last 20 years plus so much more for years to come. That is the difference between a leader and a dementia riddled puppet. The Taliban knew that Trump would have them blown into the next century if they pulled any shit. Joe DeMentia gave them pallets of cash and many lives. Musty, you are either being paid to post these opinions or you are a truly disgusting human being. Most likely you are both.
xtb is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 08-31-2021, 01:14 PM   #15
Elkchester Road
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Near Lexington, KY
Posts: 1,678
Quote:
Originally Posted by mostpost View Post
We’ll start with the situation he was handed when he took office. There was already an agreement in place signed by Donald Trump that all US forces would be out of Afghanistan by May 1, 2021. In exchange for that, Trump had wrested one concession from the Taliban. That they would not attack US troops. They made no promises about attacking Afghan government troops; no promises about attacking coalition troops from other nations,; no promises to negotiate with Afghan government; no promises to not give safe haven to terrorists. In other words, that gave up nothing.

Even before he took office, Biden was put in an untenable position.

Even so, things would probably have gone OK were it not for the incredible corruption and incompetence of the Afghan government. And the fact that Trump completely shut the Afghan government out of his Troop withdrawal negotiations with the Taliban.

As a result, the Taliban by passed the central government and negotiated with local authorities and military leaders. Negotiated there surrender and withdrawal from the battlefield. All of this unknown to the Trump administration or the Afghan government.

Enter now Joe Biden and the new administration. Their objective is to get our troops out of Afghanistan as quickly as possible. And they have this agreement negotiated by Trump to work with. Even so, they recognize that the May 1 deadline is impossible to meet. So they extend it four months and the Taliban agrees.

The unspoken foundation for all this was that Afghan’s government was sufficiently trained and sufficiently powerful to continue holding off the Taliban. This was obviously not the case in retrospect, but it was believed by both the outgoing and the incoming administration.

Which brings us to the two major issues of the withdrawal; the loss of American military equipment and technology to the Taliban and the failure to evacuate all our Afghan allies who wished to leave.

Dealing with the military equipment etc. first. There are two categories here; Equipment and weapons possessed by US forces, and those in possession of Afghan government forces. The former were basically destroyed or evacuated. The latter were supposed to be used by the Afghan government in its fight against the Taliban. The presumption was the government was strong enough to survive without us. Reclaiming our weapons and equipment would have rendered that impossible.

Of course, that presumption was incorrect, but by then it was too late. It’s not like all the Blackhawk helicopters were sitting on the tarmac at one Air Base , or all Armored Personnel Carriers were parked at one motor pool. Ammunition and weapons were in as many different places as the Afghan troops.

Removing or destroying all that was impossible.

As for the evacuation of the Afghan interpreters, scouts and other assets, when the Taliban took control, everyone wanted to get out. But how many had even applied when they thought the government was in charge, when they thought the would be safe. People don’t easily leave their homes, their country unless under duress. Certainly they don’t do it having no job prospects and no place to live at their destination.

In spite of all that, we have evacuated more than 120,000 people in the last two weeks.
One thing everybody here can take to the bank. This post by you will age just like all the other posts you make defending the actions of these Lowlife Liberals. Like shit.

You'll get your chance to defend all you have said in support of these Ghouls. President Biden's term isn't surviving this. The reset to how things were before President Trump is going along just fine. There won't be much need for Biden...sooner than you think.
__________________
Just when you least expect it...just what you least expect-The Pet Shop Boys.
Elkchester Road is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Reply




Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

» Advertisement
» Current Polls
Wagering Pool with best chance to find an overlay.
Win - 36.36%
20 Votes
Place - 3.64%
2 Votes
Show - 9.09%
5 Votes
Exacta - 30.91%
17 Votes
Trifecta - 7.27%
4 Votes
Superfexta - 1.82%
1 Vote
Pick(x) - 10.91%
6 Votes
Hi 5 Pentafecta - 0%
0 Votes
Total Votes: 55
This poll is closed.
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:35 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 1999 - 2021 -- PaceAdvantage.Com -- All Rights Reserved
We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program
designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.