Medina Spirit dies suddenly

[Andy Asaro]

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[The_Turf_Monster]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

I would think that if he has been racing clean recently (and I sort of expect that to be the case given all the scrutiny) it would be difficult to prove that any issues he had with his heart were caused by prior performance enhancing medications.

I’m no vet but a 3 year old horse dropping dead from a heart attack doesn’t sound like a natural occurrence

[v j stauffer]

Originally Posted by davew

Does California automatically send track deaths to UC Davis for necropsy?

Yes. Every one.

[v j stauffer]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

Vic:

What do they allow in Europe?

It seems to me that the existence of large jurisdictions where they not only don't allow these things, but see them as doping, is deadly to any claim that these are necessary. Of course we could get rid of them.

But also, on Lasix specifically, the behavior of trainers indicates THEY think it's performance enhancing. They give it to horses who don't bleed. Why would you give it to horses who don't bleed, unless it's a form of doping.

(And, of course, WADA, which actually knows its stuff on drugs, considers it a masking agent.)

We are so knee deep in doping and cheating, as a sport, that we can't imagine doing something different. But yes, all raceday medication should be banned.

If you think they don't run on Lasix in Europe. You're very naive.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by The_Turf_Monster

I’m no vet but a 3 year old horse dropping dead from a heart attack doesn’t sound like a natural occurrence

It's a very low probability event, but it does happen.

When it happens to a guy with a history of suspect deaths who is under scrutiny for using therapeutics a bit recklessly (and some suspect worse) the math changes.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

If you think they don't run on Lasix in Europe. You're very naive.

A lot of Euro bleeders sure seem to ship to the states to get Lasix

[GMB@BP]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

A lot of Euro bleeders sure seem to ship to the states to get Lasix

agree, we all know horses are not doped in the EU. They ship here to get doped.

[davew]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

Yes. Every one.

Thanks, I worked at a track in another state 30 years ago and am pretty sure that state did at the time then.

If a heart defect or congenital abnormality, the necropsy will find it.

[Richie]

Originally Posted by davew

Thanks, I worked at a track in another state 30 years ago and am pretty sure that state did at the time then.

If a heart defect or congenital abnormality, the necropsy will find it.

if it wasn't either of those, would they find another reason that would be suspicious?

[davew]

Originally Posted by Richie

if it wasn't either of those, would they find another reason that would be suspicious?

They sent a sample to U of Minnesota for DNA testing. I do not know what genetic problems would cause similar symptoms, but there must be some.

If serum was tested they possibly could find electrolytes or foreign molecules that are far from normal, adding to suspicion.

[Robert Fischer]

there are a bunch of different things that could cause heart attack or cardio sudden death in a horse

genetics is one of them... steroids, stimulants, clenbuterol, arguably even lasix or dehydration issues can cause an enlarged heart or an overworking heart.

blood builders that increase RBC counts or provide synthetic oxygen carriers can thicken blood, and their use and cessation involve risks like clotting.

It doesn't seem to be a super fruitful search, but the DNA testing could say something like "Medina Spirit had an undetected genetic heart abnormality", and that would cool some of the media heat.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by GMB@BP

agree, we all know horses are not doped in the EU. They ship here to get doped.

I make no claim that horses are not doped in the EU, but they definitely often ship here to get doped. And that's part of the national scandal that is "medication" in the US.