Unbelievable/Joe Sharp Blackberry Wine

[jahura2]

5th at Oaklawn today. Joe Sharp trainee Blackberry Wine , already a 2 time winner at Fairgrounds wins an 87K MSW at the Arkansas track. The trick for Mr. Sharp is to have your 2 time winner disqualified due to an illegal dewormer BOTH TIMES, but still despite having won 2 races on the track be allowed to go somewhere else with his charge and take down an even bigger purse.
This is the second example of Sharp sending a previous winner up to OP after getting the purse taken away at Fairgrounds and winning a high price MSW at OP. See Sycamore Lane , Feb 15th at OP in the second race.
Something is seriously wrong here. I know technically these horses were still maidens but no suspensions or moratorium for Sharp horses and he gets to take down even bigger purses. Wow

[deelo]

Originally Posted by jahura2

5th at Oaklawn today. Joe Sharp trainee Blackberry Wine , already a 2 time winner at Fairgrounds wins an 87K MSW at the Arkansas track. The trick for Mr. Sharp is to have your 2 time winner disqualified due to an illegal dewormer BOTH TIMES, but still despite having won 2 races on the track be allowed to go somewhere else with his charge and take down an even bigger purse.
This is the second example of Sharp sending a previous winner up to OP after getting the purse taken away at Fairgrounds and winning a high price MSW at OP. See Sycamore Lane , Feb 15th at OP in the second race.
Something is seriously wrong here. I know technically these horses were still maidens but no suspensions or moratorium for Sharp horses and he gets to take down even bigger purses. Wow

Hard to fault the guy for taking advantage. If regulators don't give a shit about common sense rules regarding this why not capitalize. Every bettor in the country knows the horse should have lost its condition.

[cj]

Feels like a logical rule would be if you get DQed out of a win, you still lose the condition.

[jay68802]

48 days between the DQ's. The trainer already knows what he has positives for. Still run's the horse, and wins, while using the same med. Had 8 positives, and can take the horse to a different track and run. Shows just how little the current system is doing.

[Bigadam119]

Still wondering how he wasn’t on the indictment...

[clicknow]

I already posted about this incident earlier this afternoon right after the race:

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...8&postcount=44

Ialso attached the article about the previous DQ, etc.

Made me mad, too----I posted about how he was so far out ahead of the rest of the field, it was like he was running on the track alone......what was it, 12 or 14 lengths or something......unreal to watch.

I"ve decided to just finish out the OP season and then decide if I still wish to participate in this sport, unless I see some strong actions to change things and pass the horse racing integrity act, etc.

[jay68802]

But Oaklawn has some of the strictest drug rules in racing.....

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by cj

Feels like a logical rule would be if you get DQed out of a win, you still lose the condition.

I don't think owners would go for a rule like that.

There are too many horses that will never be competitive beyond a handful of easy conditions. Sometimes you know it before the horse has won anything. If you win and get DQ'd, that's painful enough as far as trying to earn enough to pay your bills. If you also lose the condition, it would be too much.

Maybe in some cases you could say "if you win an ALW race and get DQ'd you can't drop back to maiden", but you have to keep that ALW condition.

[Tom]

Originally Posted by cj

Feels like a logical rule would be if you get DQed out of a win, you still lose the condition.

Good idea. This Joe Sharp is either not very bright or not very honest.

You decide.

I don't think owners would go for a rule like that.

Bottom line, tough S***.
I'm sure washing hands is an inconvenience for cooks - do we let them not do it.

Stop worrying about the kitchen staff and worry about the customers.
If these crappy trainer don't like it and leave the game mood! As you say, their horses are not worth much anyway.

We can survive with less than a dozen racetracks. Probably much better than today.

[jay68802]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

I don't think owners would go for a rule like that.

Major reason the sport is in this situation. All the horses trained by Servis and the others that were indicted, were stopped from racing because of the use of PED's. Why not this horse? Just because he was not indicted? The "not fair to the owners" excuse is just that, an excuse. Racing steps in when the publicity is bad, but in this case, goes back to business as usual. Same thing as the rule that allows owners that have a trainer suspended, run the horse under another trainer.

If the owners are stopped from running, or lose a condition, it might slow down the drug abuse.

[green80]

a lot of owners are not at the track or even in the same state as their horse when it's running. They have no clue what the trainer is giving the horse.

[Tom]

Originally Posted by green80

a lot of owners are not at the track or even in the same state as their horse when it's running. They have no clue what the trainer is giving the horse.

Again, Tough S***.

It is the owner's responsibility.
He owns the horse, he hires the trainer.
He should be the PRIMARY recipient of all penalties.

When you get your car hit by a Fed Ex truck, do you make excuses for the Fed Ex CEO because HE was not in the truck?

[clicknow]

Originally Posted by jay68802

But Oaklawn has some of the strictest drug rules in racing.....

Never heard anyone claim that?

They are on-board with the new plan along with Churchill Downs Inc., New York Racing Association Inc. Stronach Group, Del Mar, Keeneland, Lone Star Park, Remington Park, Los Alamitos Racecourse, and Tampa Bay regarding Lasix use (would be banned for 2-year-old horses within 24 hours of a race and in 2021, would extend to all horses in any stakes races).

They have boosted their drug testing budget every year, (enhanced daily testing and out-of-competition testing) but I have never heard that it's stricter than any other race track?

Their breakdown rate was below the 5.2 average of all tracks last I heard.

They know how to treat their customers and horsemen; they re-surface their track every year; they are in a town that supports racing, they are very innovative and offered lasix free racing with a 10% bonus were pioneers in simulcasting.

But it's always been common knowledge that Cella was openly critical of the NTRA in the early days and has never been a full member so do not report to JC equine injury database.

So I personally have never heard they have "the strictest drug rules in racing"? other than boosting their testing a tad every year.

[Robert Fischer]

there are no clean tracks

between non-tested substances, designer substances that a virtually undetectable, and layoffs/breaks/foal-juvenile substances that greatly enhance performance but will be out of their system by the time they are entered...

there are no clean tracks...

The FBI doing surveillance and going through peoples private texts and phone records, and leveraging/turning a snitch, is about the only way it's even possible to catch anyone.

That's part of the reason horse racing and every sport or entertainer who uses their body to make a living has a high rate of PED use. There's guys who read the weather forecast and guys who do cooking shows who are on PEDs...

at some of the ones recently mentioned on this page, i've seen occasions where three top doping operations have had horses in the same race.

[classhandicapper]

I'm not debating the case of a horse potentially being drugged. Those punishments should exist outside the purse distribution anyway.

I'm talking about mythical trainer "Mr Clean".

He has a very good horse he knows can beat maidens, but decides to run in a NW1 because he thinks the horse might be able to win the bigger purse and because the race is on the schedule at the right time and at the right distance etc... So he takes a shot against tougher, wins, but gets DQ'd.

The horse is still technically a maiden.

There's no way it's acceptable for him to lose that ALW condition too.

At worst, if you really want to bend the rules you can say if you win an ALW and get DQ'd, you are ineligible to run against maidens (though I even hate that idea) or you can write ALW races that specifically say "no maidens", but you can't punish a guy because his horse got DQ'd over and above the already huge punishment of losing the purse.

If a rule like that was in place, fewer horses would run out of their conditions to take a shot at a small stakes or anything else.