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05-16-2020, 03:10 PM
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#16
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 547
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryBoyle
These last 2 minutes from episode 7 were excellent. Hard not to admire MJ's focus on winning no matter what.
For context, they had showed a few clips of former teammates saying that MJ was pretty ruthless to play/practice with and that he wasn't a nice guy when it came to being on the team. Interviewer asked if that bothered him.
https://twitter.com/jimhamilton4/sta...62033155260425
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The points he makes in this clip can't be overstated. Main takeaway for me: "Winning has a price. Leadership has a price". The mental strength needed for both is immense, and one of the reasons he is the GOAT, in my opinion.
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05-16-2020, 07:26 PM
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#17
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,569
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What was Phil Jackson doing while MJ was beating up his teammates during practice?
__________________
"Theory is knowledge that doesn't work. Practice is when everything works and you don't know why."
-- Hermann Hesse
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05-16-2020, 08:57 PM
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#18
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The Voice of Reason!
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Canandaigua, New york
Posts: 112,887
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thaskalos
What was Phil Jackson doing while MJ was beating up his teammates during practice?
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Getting Michael coffee and donuts.
__________________
Who does the Racing Form Detective like in this one?
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05-16-2020, 09:22 PM
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#19
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 547
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It's amusing to me how people think Jordan was some kind of bully. Those guys were playing for the highest stakes imaginable in their profession. Emotion and passion can and do intertwine, especially when the efforts of some aren't perceived as acceptable by the alphas in the room. It's always been that way in sports.
I played in college and coach in HS now and I can say unequivocally that team members must be put in the most uncomfortable situations (sometimes by other players) in practice to perform at the highest levels when the bright lights shine. If it was easy, everybody would do it.
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05-17-2020, 06:51 PM
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#20
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 444
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Is what they've shown on TLD from Bulls practices supposed to be examples of MJ being hard on teammates? I got worse than that from my junior high PE coach.
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05-17-2020, 06:58 PM
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#21
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 547
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Quote:
Originally Posted by metro
Is what they've shown on TLD from Bulls practices supposed to be examples of MJ being hard on teammates? I got worse than that from my junior high PE coach.
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Exactly!!
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05-17-2020, 07:07 PM
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#22
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,569
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PressThePace
It's amusing to me how people think Jordan was some kind of bully. Those guys were playing for the highest stakes imaginable in their profession. Emotion and passion can and do intertwine, especially when the efforts of some aren't perceived as acceptable by the alphas in the room. It's always been that way in sports.
I played in college and coach in HS now and I can say unequivocally that team members must be put in the most uncomfortable situations (sometimes by other players) in practice to perform at the highest levels when the bright lights shine. If it was easy, everybody would do it.
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When you are coaching HS...do you permit the players to punch each other in the face? Jordan punching Will Perdue and Steve Kerr in the face during practice is considered to be "acceptable behavior"? If Jordan was allowed to do as he pleased...what was Phil Jackson needed for?
__________________
"Theory is knowledge that doesn't work. Practice is when everything works and you don't know why."
-- Hermann Hesse
Last edited by thaskalos; 05-17-2020 at 07:15 PM.
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05-18-2020, 01:02 AM
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#23
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Bombardier
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,043
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Jordan said that Jackson threw him (Jordan) out of practice because of the incident with Kerr. He later called Kerr and apologized.
__________________
They don't think it be like it is, but it do. ~O.Gamble
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05-18-2020, 02:31 AM
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#24
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 15,123
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When we scrimaged in baseball, if a batter missed a bunt, or was not aggressive when needed, the next pitch was thrown at him. At football practice, I had a coach grab me by the facemask after a play, and told me I needed to be more aggressive. The next play I accidently ran into the coach at full speed. Nothing wrong with what MJ did as far as I am concerned.
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05-18-2020, 02:33 AM
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#25
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,569
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingfin66
Jordan said that Jackson threw him (Jordan) out of practice because of the incident with Kerr. He later called Kerr and apologized.
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Kerr was the smallest guy on the team...did MJ face any consequences for lighting up Will Purdue? Or for endlessly tormenting all the bench players? I got a kick out of the Robert Parish incident...when Jordan got in Parish's face and cursed him out after Parish messed up during one of his first practices with the Bulls in 1996-97. Here's how Parish put it: "He got in my face and sassed me hard...and I told him 'I'm not as enamored with you as these other guys. I've got some rings too'. Then he told me that he would kick my ass...and I took a step closer to him and said 'No, you really aren't'. And he never did."
MJ was the best ever...but he was also a bully. If he wasn't...then he would try to "motivate" Parish too. But he knew better.
__________________
"Theory is knowledge that doesn't work. Practice is when everything works and you don't know why."
-- Hermann Hesse
Last edited by thaskalos; 05-18-2020 at 02:40 AM.
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05-18-2020, 08:09 AM
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#26
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 1,755
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Just a great documentary. No matter what you think of Jordan bully no bully whatever, all this guy wanted was to win no matter what it took. He punched Kerr but in a the biggest spot he gave Kerr the ball.
The producers who filmed this should be proud.
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05-18-2020, 10:57 AM
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#27
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by metro
Is what they've shown on TLD from Bulls practices supposed to be examples of MJ being hard on teammates? I got worse than that from my junior high PE coach.
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My 6th grade football coach was terrifying and put us through drills that are banned in the Nfl. The Jordan stuff seemed minor.
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05-18-2020, 12:17 PM
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#28
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thaskalos
Kerr was the smallest guy on the team...did MJ face any consequences for lighting up Will Purdue? Or for endlessly tormenting all the bench players? I got a kick out of the Robert Parish incident...when Jordan got in Parish's face and cursed him out after Parish messed up during one of his first practices with the Bulls in 1996-97. Here's how Parish put it: "He got in my face and sassed me hard...and I told him 'I'm not as enamored with you as these other guys. I've got some rings too'. Then he told me that he would kick my ass...and I took a step closer to him and said 'No, you really aren't'. And he never did."
MJ was the best ever...but he was also a bully. If he wasn't...then he would try to "motivate" Parish too. But he knew better.
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Parish was a shell of his former self by his Bulls days. Why get beat up to motivate a guy that barely plays?
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05-18-2020, 12:18 PM
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#29
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 547
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thaskalos
Kerr was the smallest guy on the team...did MJ face any consequences for lighting up Will Purdue? Or for endlessly tormenting all the bench players? I got a kick out of the Robert Parish incident...when Jordan got in Parish's face and cursed him out after Parish messed up during one of his first practices with the Bulls in 1996-97. Here's how Parish put it: "He got in my face and sassed me hard...and I told him 'I'm not as enamored with you as these other guys. I've got some rings too'. Then he told me that he would kick my ass...and I took a step closer to him and said 'No, you really aren't'. And he never did."
MJ was the best ever...but he was also a bully. If he wasn't...then he would try to "motivate" Parish too. But he knew better.
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Couldn't disagree more. I just listened to two of MJ's teammates say definitively that he was not a bully. A bully is someone who only tests the little guy. Jordan challenged everybody. Kerr went at Jordan first after a hard foul. That was noted by Kerr in the series.
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05-18-2020, 12:23 PM
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#30
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 547
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thaskalos
When you are coaching HS...do you permit the players to punch each other in the face? Jordan punching Will Perdue and Steve Kerr in the face during practice is considered to be "acceptable behavior"? If Jordan was allowed to do as he pleased...what was Phil Jackson needed for?
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No, of course we discourage it because teenage kids aren't the best in the world about seeing the big-picture. You are comparing the interactions of adults with that of kids. These are grown men playing in a game that is really a business. That is very different from what I do. However, I've had kids that call others out for not going hard, which is perfectly acceptable to me provided the accuser isn't ever guilty of the same thing.
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