Religion II

[hcap]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

It was meant to be humorous....I obviously failed, my bad.

Cool, but I am trying to make what should be an obvious point.

Not using past info is hilarious. As is denying cause and effect.

[ReplayRandall]

Originally Posted by hcap

Cool, but I am trying to make what should be an obvious point.

Not using past info is hilarious. As is denying cause and effect.

Boxcar uses the Bible, doesn't he?....So he's using past info, which is still alive and valid for debates about "cause and effect" in the here and now, plus eternity.....And you use the ever evolving argument of science?.....You're in a tough spot...Just sayin'.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

It was meant to be humorous....I obviously failed, my bad.

If it's any consolation...I had no trouble spotting the humor in your Taulbot Pace Calculator post.

[hcap]

Originally Posted by Actor

Whatever! I don't see what all this time stuff has to do with religion. How about you starting a separate thread on time.

I am sure you recall some of his his 11 part thesis on the universe. For those of you unfamiliar with his speculations........

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...n+the+Universe

And why I criticized his "REVERSE TIME THEORY"

From "Is Time a Triunity?" #10

This is his his proclamation that "TIME" originates in the future:........


..."So, then, how does Time exist? And what is its Source? The answer will surprise most here, if not all, by first stating what it isn’t: It’s not the Past! Carelessly, we think it is so. But it’s not. (Remember: Not all things are as they appear.) Many have spoken of the “stream of Time” as flowing out of the Past. Most believe that Time moves out of the Past through the Present into the Future. But this is all backwards! For Time does not come out of the Past; it proceeds from the Future! I have undoubtedly shocked many readers’ minds with this revelation because it militates sharply against the habit of our thinking. Nonetheless, it is the self-evident fact. Now we must examine how this is so."

...."Very soon “today” will become “yesterday” – and slip into the immediate Past. Then it will become a “week ago” – in the recent Past. Then it will become “last month” in the ever receding Past. Then it will become “last year” into the distant Past.

Manifestly, that that section of time we call “today” comes out of the distant Future, then into the near Future, then into the Present, and then continues flowing through the Present as it steams first into the recent Past, then eventually “disappears” into the distant Past. What must be understood is that this is the unbroken, irrevocable, invariable and irrefutable order of Time. Never does Time flow in the opposite direction. Never does “yesterday” reverse its flow and become “today”. “Yesterday” can only become the “day before “yesterday” – two days deeper into the immediate Past. Never does the Past flow through the Present. Or for that matter, the Present into the Future. Never does “today” become “tomorrow”. It is “tomorrow” that becomes “today”. Then “today” becomes “yesterday”.

Therefore, since all this is undeniably true, the Future is the Source – the “reservoir” of Time, which one day will be Present, and then the Past. The Present, then, should be thought of as the “narrow strait”, the “living instant” “the flashing reality” through which the oncoming Future passes into the endless, receding Past.

...........................................
...Remember......

since all this is undeniably true

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by hcap

I am sure you recall some of his his 11 part thesis on the universe. For those of you unfamiliar with his speculations........

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...n+the+Universe

And why I criticized his "REVERSE TIME THEORY"

From "Is Time a Triunity?" #10

This is his his proclamation that "TIME" originates in the future:........


..."So, then, how does Time exist? And what is its Source? The answer will surprise most here, if not all, by first stating what it isn’t: It’s not the Past! Carelessly, we think it is so. But it’s not. (Remember: Not all things are as they appear.) Many have spoken of the “stream of Time” as flowing out of the Past. Most believe that Time moves out of the Past through the Present into the Future. But this is all backwards! For Time does not come out of the Past; it proceeds from the Future! I have undoubtedly shocked many readers’ minds with this revelation because it militates sharply against the habit of our thinking. Nonetheless, it is the self-evident fact. Now we must examine how this is so."

...."Very soon “today” will become “yesterday” – and slip into the immediate Past. Then it will become a “week ago” – in the recent Past. Then it will become “last month” in the ever receding Past. Then it will become “last year” into the distant Past.

Manifestly, that that section of time we call “today” comes out of the distant Future, then into the near Future, then into the Present, and then continues flowing through the Present as it steams first into the recent Past, then eventually “disappears” into the distant Past. What must be understood is that this is the unbroken, irrevocable, invariable and irrefutable order of Time. Never does Time flow in the opposite direction. Never does “yesterday” reverse its flow and become “today”. “Yesterday” can only become the “day before “yesterday” – two days deeper into the immediate Past. Never does the Past flow through the Present. Or for that matter, the Present into the Future. Never does “today” become “tomorrow”. It is “tomorrow” that becomes “today”. Then “today” becomes “yesterday”.

Therefore, since all this is undeniably true, the Future is the Source – the “reservoir” of Time, which one day will be Present, and then the Past. The Present, then, should be thought of as the “narrow strait”, the “living instant” “the flashing reality” through which the oncoming Future passes into the endless, receding Past.

...........................................
...Remember......

since all this is undeniably true

Of course, it's undeniably true, since all time is consumed only ONCE and then only in the Present. But hey...be sure to let us know when you can physically go back into the Past are relive a segment of it. Or jump into the Future and consume time there. These are the only ways you can prove your lame, absurd theory

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

I believe him. If God has gotten interested enough to save Boxcar's soul...who's to say that God's "grace" cannot extend to the racetrack?

I was investing in the ponies long before God got a hold of me.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by hcap

Yes we have been down this road before, but am asking if as a "successful" wagerer, do you deny using past cause and effects correlations learned from a horses previous races, to ascertain the chances of a horse to do well today, as all of us other gamblers do?

Did Ray Taulbot, your instructor, learn from past performances including the racing program, or/and keeping his own records?

Do you even agree the major players in the multi-billion financial markets ever seek and value correlational of of past causation and past outcomes (effects) to project future outcomes? Do you understand advances in science, mathematics and engineering are also based on knowledge handed down from others who have learned from correlations over and over again?

Do any of us learn from experience?
The ordinary life of causes and effects?

The growth of all human culture has in part came about by learning from experience.

"Predictive analytics is the use of data, statistical algorithms and machine learning techniques to identify the likelihood of future outcomes based on historical data. The goal is to go beyond knowing what has happened to providing a best assessment of what will happen in the future."

You're hopelessly stuck on stupid. To borrow some wanna-be religious expert's often-used, tired, worn out, hackneyed phrase: "You're confusing the map for the territory." Causes always precede physical effects in this physical world; but so what? Those events or effects are not Time itself. You can't help but conflate the two, can you? Just like you can't distinguish between the chronological and logical flows of Time.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

It was meant to be humorous....I obviously failed, my bad.

You did not fail. Hcap's sense of humor is an epic fail.

[hcap]

Originally Posted by boxcar

You're hopelessly stuck on stupid. To borrow some wanna-be religious expert's often-used, tired, worn out, hackneyed phrase: "You're confusing the map for the territory." Causes always precede physical effects in this physical world; but so what? Those events or effects are not Time itself. You can't help but conflate the two, can you? Just like you can't distinguish between the chronological and logical flows of Time.

So what? You denied using past performances in handicapping. Claiming learning from the past is only speculation.

You still have no evidence that the future precedes the present and the past.
Causality debunks your reverse direction of time from the future

Events define e the direction of time. You have a ridiculous understanding of time, divorcing events from it because cause and effect does not fit into your faith based religious proclamations.

You assume time is "used". You anthropomorphize time as you anthropomorphize god.

Now bunky, explain how you handicap without studying past racing events.
Or is your latest blather about separation of events from the direction of time your convenient excuse, contrary to all your denials, that you indeed use past events even tho you maintained you did not

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by hcap

So what? You denied using past performances in handicapping. Claiming learning from the past is only speculation.

You still have no evidence that the future precedes the present and the past.
Causality debunks your reverse direction of time from the future

Events define e the direction of time. You have a ridiculous understanding of time, divorcing events from it because cause and effect does not fit into your faith based religious proclamations.

You assume time is "used". You anthropomorphize time as you anthropomorphize god.

Now bunky, explain how you handicap without studying past racing events.
Or is your latest blather about separation of events from the direction of time your convenient excuse, contrary to all your denials, that you indeed use past events even tho you maintained you did not

I have not denied using PPs to handicap. I do study the history of horses in order to make my selections. BUT AGAIN, SO WHAT!!!!? I have never denied that the Past chronologically precedes the Present, only that logically it does not. And this is what you cannot wrap the few remaining live brain cells you own around.

Events do not define or dictate the direction of time. Logic does! And we know your "arrow of time" is logically out to lunch because you have time being consumed in the Past and the Future, whereas time can only be consumed once in the Present. And this is an irrefutable truth!.

And the only reason we think in chronological terms is because we're hopelessly time-bound. We cannot think of ourselves as existing before we physically existed, i.e. when we were only in the Future. We need roots. We need history. We need background. We have a really tough time wrapping our minds around something that is not historical. So, we naturally think of time in chronological terms, from where we mistakenly think we came. But logically, we came out of the Future to become a Present reality at some specific point in Time, and then our existence flowed into the Past to become an historical record, and for those us who are still breathing, continues to flow into the Past, which will actually become the sum total of our lives. All our history lies in the Past, not in the Future where you lame theory has it!

Moreover, since you have the Past and Present flowing into the Future, we should be able to predict the Future with 100% accuracy; yet, we cannot -- not by a long shot.

[boxcar]

Hey, Humpty, you should do yourself a favor. Go the nearest beach to you. In fact, get there at NIGHT. Stay up all night. Stay vigilant all night. Stay awake all night and you will witness an amazing sight, I promise you! You will witness the the birth of Tomorrow and watch it become Today, as you see the sun rise over the eastern horizon.

Honest Injun'. Check it out someday. See Time on the move.

[hcap]

Originally Posted by boxcar

I have not denied using PPs to handicap. I do study the history of horses in order to make my selections. BUT AGAIN, SO WHAT!!!!? I have never denied that the Past chronologically precedes the Present, only that logically it does not. And this is what you cannot wrap the few remaining live brain cells you own around.

I asked you...

If you did not use past performances, you are saying for you the future actually arrived before the running of today's race and the future outcome of that race was known before the race ran.
You even use as your tag line a statement of the necessity of multiple causative factors needed to wager successfully

Your answer to me.
.

We've been down this road before. Don't you know that past performances are no guarantee of future performances? This little "factoid" is stated on all stock prospectuses, and applies equally to turf speculation. And the key word here is speculation.

Everyone already knows that prognostications are not guaranteed. You have claimed past events are not indicative of future events and denied and wanted to bet that. Claiming not all causes precede their induced effects.

Another cop out due to your inability to accept cause and effect as an accurate indicator of the direction of time. You went on about the "fallacy" of "if we use past events to predict future events, it should be perfect. Therefore there was no point. You used a lame GPS analogy

You have the Past flowing through the Present to become the Future. If we were to liken your arrow to a GPS, you would have us believe that where we were is now where we are and were we are will become our destination. So, all we have to do with our GPS is to look to our final destination to see where we are and from where we came.

So now you are claiming what else to handicap? Astrology

[hcap]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Hey, Humpty, you should do yourself a favor. Go the nearest beach to you. In fact, get there at NIGHT. Stay up all night. Stay vigilant all night. Stay awake all night and you will witness an amazing sight, I promise you! You will witness the the birth of Tomorrow and watch it become Today, as you see the sun rise over the eastern horizon.

Honest Injun'. Check it out someday. See Time on the move.

Backwards boxcarian word games. Yesterday becalming today and today becalming tomorrow is just as easily said. The big difference is yesterday's events had an influence on today, and yesterday's events as well as todaoy's events, will influence tomorrow.

Neither tomorrows event's will influence today's,(except by human anticipation) or today's change yesterdays one iota. The past leads to the present, and the present leads to to the future.

See if your bank will pay you interest for an account you promise to open tomorrow, today or maybe last week. Check your statement and let us know if you accrue interest backwards

Good work if you can get it.

Evidence please bunky

[HalvOnHorseracing]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Hey, Humpty, you should do yourself a favor. Go the nearest beach to you. In fact, get there at NIGHT. Stay up all night. Stay vigilant all night. Stay awake all night and you will witness an amazing sight, I promise you! You will witness the the birth of Tomorrow and watch it become Today, as you see the sun rise over the eastern horizon.

Honest Injun'. Check it out someday. See Time on the move.

So the sun rises, eh? Or is that a colloquialism?

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by hcap

I asked you...

Your answer to me.
.Everyone already knows that prognostications are not guaranteed. You have claimed past events are not indicative of future events and denied and wanted to bet that. Claiming not all causes precede their induced effects.

Another cop out due to your inability to accept cause and effect as an accurate indicator of the direction of time. You went on about the "fallacy" of "if we use past events to predict future events, it should be perfect. Therefore there was no point. You used a lame GPS analogy


So now you are claiming what else to handicap? Astrology

No, what I have claimed is that Time in the PAST does not CAUSE Future events.!!! Pay Attention. You are so helplessly confused because you insist on conflating Time with Events that take place in Time!

Physical Causes and Effects are NOT indicators of the direction of Time. Time is independent of human activities and events. Human events and activities on the physical level occur in the "Vast Ocean of Time". Time is the environment in which physical and activities and events are "submerged". These events and activities have zero impact on the logical flow of Time.

Here's a little clue for you, Humpty: Time is not a man-made invention, as you would have us believe with your dumb theory. Man didn't invent time and then decide that his activities or events sets the direction for time. We no more created Time than we did the rest of the universe!

Also, I did not want to bet what you said I wanted to bet. What I wanted to bet, and am still quite willing to wager, is that causes do not always precede effects with all human activities -- that in fact, effects often precede causes in the world of human activity. I'm still willing to bet you, providing you accept the terms to my wager.