Religion II

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by Show Me the Wire

Overpopulation is a threat to our survival. Hmm I wonder where I got that idea about you having that exact position about overpopulation?

Of course you could be sad or affected about the death of a child or at the death of anyone, no matter what the individual's age. I never said anything to the contrary.

My confusion is based on the conflict between having the position that overpopulation is a threat to our survival and using nature's tool to prevent overpopulation as a club to bash other people's beliefs.

There is a natural safeguard built into the system and it is death. Again and I can't emphasize this enough that we can grieve over anyone dying, while also understanding death plays a role in regulating population.

Also, let me add this. I don't advocate any person in a dire situation or deserves to forfeit his life, because that person deserves such. And such we should have at least compassion for such people.

Oh, I'm sorry...did I inadvertently bash someone's beliefs? How naughty of me. You know...being a Roman Catholic, one would think that you'd be a little more understanding towards those who bash people for their beliefs. But, yes...I am now reminded of your recent argument that the "Roman Catholic church doesn't kill people anymore". Now...the RC Church just covers up the RAPES that their clergy commit.

[Show Me the Wire]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

Oh, I'm sorry...did I inadvertently bash someone's beliefs? How naughty of me. You know...being a Roman Catholic, one would think that you'd be a little more understanding towards those who bash people for their beliefs. But, yes...I am now reminded of your recent argument that the "Roman Catholic church doesn't kill people anymore". Now...the RC Church just covers up the RAPES that their clergy commit.

I have been vocal in bashing those predatory homosexual clergy and those who allow it. Those involved in this evil behavior do not have any supernatural faith and are fully in-tune with the selfish ways of the world. Feel free to bash them for they are not acting according to their " professed' faith. Per my beliefs, I no longer fund them through contributions, as my beliefs, nor does Church doctrine permit sexual predatory acts toward children, teenagers and young adults.

As I expressed before I don't throw the baby out with the bath water. Abuse is just that abuse, but abuse does not render the intrinsic value of an institution or system worthless or less useful.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by Show Me the Wire

I have been vocal in bashing those predatory homosexual clergy and those who allow it. Those involved in this evil behavior do not have any supernatural faith and are fully in-tune with the selfish ways of the world. Feel free to bash them for they are not acting according to their " professed' faith. Per my beliefs, I no longer fund them through contributions, as my beliefs, nor does Church doctrine permit sexual predatory acts toward children, teenagers and young adults.

As I expressed before I don't throw the baby out with the bath water. Abuse is just that abuse, but abuse does not render the intrinsic value of an institution or system worthless or less useful.

I got mad at YOU...because you responded to me in your initial post here today by suggesting that I have no right to complain about child mortality...because I consider overpopulation to be a serious concern when it comes to humanity's survival. You also said that death is nature's solution to the overpopulation problem...as if all sorts of different types of deaths should be considered equal.

My wife died at the age of 37, after battling a terrible disease for 4 years...and she left behind a 5 year-old son whom she loved dearly. As a result of my many hospital visits with her...I became acquainted with many other young women, who had suffered similar fates...and the experience shook me profoundly. And then my young son needed to be hospitalized for an ailment himself, and I had to accompany him during HIS numerous visits to Children's Memorial Hospital...where I became acquainted with many kids who were afflicted with illnesses MUCH more serious than the one plaguing my son. And my heart cried for all those terminally sick children...and their much-maligned parents. And now I find myself debating with you...to try and explain why I can't accept that death is nature's solution to overpopulation. Or...I find myself arguing with Boxcar...who tells me that "not a hair falls from our head without God wishing it so".

COMPASSION is my "religion"...and my heart bleeds when I see misfortune befalling the undeserving. And I sometimes lash out when I am told that there really are no "undeserving" among us...when it comes to these tragedies of life. When people tell me that there is an ever-loving God above...I honestly don't know what they are talking about...because I have seen too much evidence to the contrary.

[Show Me the Wire]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

I got mad at YOU...because you responded to me in your initial post here today by suggesting that I have no right to complain about child mortality...because I consider overpopulation to be a serious concern when it comes to humanity's survival. You also said that death is nature's solution to the overpopulation problem...as if all sorts of different types of deaths should be considered equal.

My wife died at the age of 37, after battling a terrible disease for 4 years...and she left behind a 5 year-old son whom she loved dearly. As a result of my many hospital visits with her...I became acquainted with many other young women, who had suffered similar fates...and the experience shook me profoundly. And then my young son needed to be hospitalized for an ailment himself, and I had to accompany him during HIS numerous visits to Children's Memorial Hospital...where I became acquainted with many kids who were afflicted with illnesses MUCH more serious than the one plaguing my son. And my heart cried for all those terminally sick children...and their much-maligned parents. And now I find myself debating with you...to try and explain why I can't accept that death is nature's solution to overpopulation. Or...I find myself arguing with Boxcar...who tells me that "not a hair falls from our head without God wishing it so".

COMPASSION is my "religion"...and my heart bleeds when I see misfortune befalling the undeserving. And I sometimes lash out when I am told that there really are no "undeserving" among us...when it comes to these tragedies of life. When people tell me that there is an ever-loving God above...I honestly don't know what they are talking about...because I have seen too much evidence to the contrary.

I know about your loss, and I am sorry that you lost a spouse. I too have compassion for those children and their suffering parents. Even though I experienced loss, I can't imagine the grief over the loss of a child. I do not believe these suffering children or their parents deserve their fates, because of their behavior.

There really is no debate, death is a fact of life and it is nature's tool to regulate population. Also grieving is a fact of life and I hope compassion is too.

Have a joyful Holiday, as I have to leave to attend worship services. May all your days be blessed.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

I have repeatedly corrected you and you do not listen.

The correction is to substitute the word PAIN for SIN.

Your use of SIN is a frivolous religious concept open to vast interpretation.

PAIN rules this world in a seriously real way and laughs at your SIN because PAIN RULES SIN. SIN IS A SLAVE TO PAIN. SIN IS WHAT YOU DO WHEN PAIN HAS YOU BY THE BALLS. You are as NAIVE as it gets.

The Divine power of Love is the only power that can save us and lift us out of the power that PAIN can wreck on our lives. It is a rigged game in order for us to GROW on a spiritual level we can't even fully comprehend.

I stop replying to you because your level of understanding the scheme of things is so beyond stupidity, its not worth a reply.

You know... your ignorance and your condescending, arrogant smugness brings to mind this proverb which fits you to a tee:

Prov 26:12
2 Do you see a man wise in his own eyes?
There is more hope for a fool than for him.
NASB

The ruler of this world "in a seriously real way" is not a what or a thing. It's a WHO. It's a person. That Person is God who reigns through his Son (Mat 2818; Rev 3:4-5, etc.). And God has also appointed an under lord to rule under him: His name is Satan (2Cor 4:4; Jn 12:31; 16:11).

Jesus suffered great pain on the Cross, yet that pain was not caused by any personal sin of his. How do you explain your lame thesis in light of Christ's sinlessness? Below is a link that contains scriptures that affirms the doctrine of Christ's impeccability.

https://www.gotquestions.org/Jesus-sinless.html

And would your loving god rig the game for us? Is your god dealing us losing hands from the bottom of the deck Are you suggesting that your god of love has a mean, sadistic streak in him? Or would a genuinely loving and righteous God provide a real and everlasting remedy for man's horrible, helpless and hopeless sinful condition, while simultaneously, in his infinite wisdom, satisfying his own demands for justice on behalf of his elect?

Since you have it all backwards, thinking pain causes sin and that pain is the ultimate path to spiritual growth, it seems to me you are eminently fit to grow spiritually for all eternity through the House of Pain, a/k/a Hell.

Hell is:

a place of weeping and gnashing of teeth (Mat 25:30)
a place of outer darkness (Mat 22:13)
a place of endless torments (Lk 16:23)
a place of unceasing sorrows )2Sam 22:5-7)
a place of everlasting destruction (2Thes 1:9)
a place of fire and brimstone (Rev 21:8)
a place of worms that don't die (Mk 9:43)
a place of unquenchable fire (Ml 9:43)
a place of perpetual unrest (Rev 14:11)
a place that will ultimately become a "lake of fire" (Rev 20:14)
a place of utter despair and eternally unsatisfied desires (Lk 16:24
a furnace of fire (Mat 13:42, 50)
a place filled with all manner of vile sinners (Rev 21:8)
a place shut out from the presence of the Lord and his majesty (2Thes 1:9)
a place initially created for demons (2Pet 2:4, Jude 1:16)

All these descriptions should be sweet music to your ears, and sweeter than honey to your taste buds. There's all manner of pain in hell -- physical, mental, emotional, psychological -- something suitable for everyone's perverse tastes. And since "spiritual growth", apparently, is the name of your game, well you'll be growing infinitely with no end in sight. You will never arrive to maturity. Maturity will always be beyond your grasp because eternal growth never ends.

And Hell itself awaits to welcome you. Talk about a win-win situation. The devil gets what he wants and you get what you want. Such a deal! The devil's eternal playground will have a most memorable reception for you.

Isa 14:9-10
9 "Sheol from beneath is excited over you to meet you when you come;
It arouses for you the spirits of the dead, all the leaders of the earth;
It raises all the kings of the nations from their thrones.
10 "They will all respond and say to you,
'Even you have been made weak as we,
You have become like us.
NASB

You are already weak and pathetic and pitiful. You talk your love game non-stop while simultaneously spurning God's real love which he in space and time and human history demonstrated to the entire world at the Cross of his only Begotten Son.

Rom 5:8-11
8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him. 10 For if while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. 11 And not only this, but we also exult in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation.
NASB

Yes, I exult in God through Christ for his unspeakable gift of salvation. For taking on flesh in the person of Jesus and living the perfectly holy and righteous life I could not live, and dying the death that I should have died. God loves me so much that he gave me the gift of the Holy Spirit and new heart so that I would not remain in the former swamp of my miserable, wretched, pathetic sinful life -- but rather gradually transform me into the image of his Son here on earth. And when I die, I'll be ushered immediately into God's perfect, blissful, Edenic heaven -- not because of any good works I've done in this world, but because of my Savior's perfect righteousness. When God looks at me, he'll see Jesus' righteousness. That's genuine agape love.

Titus 3:4-7
4 But when the kindness of God our Savior and His love for mankind appeared, 5 He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit, 6 whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 that being justified by His grace we might be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
NASB

You see, it's not God's love that saves anyone per se, it's God's love in ACTION that saves. This love in action is God's grace.

Eph 2:8-10
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9 not as a result of works, that no one should boast.
NASB

Awake, O Sleeper before it's too late. Your god's love is deceptive and will prove to be your eternal undoing if you persist in refusing God's real love in action -- unimaginable grace.

Finally, if sin is so "frivolous" why did God have to come to earth, take on flesh, and bear the sins of his people on the Cross?

1 Peter 2:24
24 and He Himself bore our sins in His body on the cross, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness; for by His wounds you were healed.
NASB

And,

2 Cor 5:21
21 He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.
NASB

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

I already said it was.





First prove your senile bullshit you write here^^^




More senile bullshit lies.



Are you the Riddler?



What does it matter what I think of this?



More stupidity^^^

Did your god of love teach you all this vulgarity?

Were you too lazy to look up the verse in Romans 14 to which I alluded?

Rom 14:17
7 for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.
NASB

Since you don't know who the Holy Spirit is, you cannot possibly be in God's kingdom, anymore than the Pharisees of Jesus' day. All true believers know who the Holy Spirit is because he bears witness to their spirit. In other words, all true believers experience the Holy Spirit within them.

Rom 8:16-17
16 The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,
NASB

I know what I'm about to say is really going to come off to you as a very novel idea -- but here it is anyway: Perhaps you should make a New Year's resolution to try really hard to get on the same page as your "best friend" -- but of course that would require that you actually believe him.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

IMO...we owe this man a debt of gratitude. If it weren't for his meanderings...how else would we get reminded of the ludicrous speculations and superstitions upon which organized religion is hinged? When the human mind gets brainwashed enough...even the death of a CHILD can be deemed readily justified.

Having rational answers beats willful ignorance, and all the lame theories that naturally proceed therefrom any day.

Merry Christmas!

[boxcar]

Christmas officially a national holiday in Iraq

https://thehill.com/policy/internati...oliday-in-iraq

You see, skeptics: There is a God in heaven who performs miracles. Christmas is proclaimed a national holiday in modern day Babylon. Who among you would have ever thunk such a thing?

[boxcar]

Christ reigns as King from the crib – Come, let us adore him!

The Christian message is dominated by two events: the Nativity and the Passion. In each case we find Jesus Christ at the center of the picture, apparently helpless.

https://www.lifesitenews.com/mobile/...t-us-adore-him

[Actor]

#9025

Originally Posted by dnlgfnk

... Jerry Coyne holding seminars to convince people they don't have free will.

Besides his seminars, Coyne’s book Why Evolution is True seems to be quite visible on the internet. However, I submit that Coyne’s book Faith Versus Fact: Why Science and Religion are Incompatible is his magnum opus.

“There are no heated discussions about reconciling sport and religion, literature and religion, or business and religion; the important issue is the harmony between science and religion. But why, of all human endeavors that we could compare with religion, are we so concerned with its harmony with science?

“The answer, to me at least, seems obvious. Science and religion – unlike, say, business and religion – are competitors at discovering truths about nature. And science is the only field that has the ability to disprove the truth claims of religion, and has done so repeatedly. … Religion, on the other hand, has no ability to overturn the truths found by science. It is this competition, and the ability of science to erode the hegemony of faith – but not vice versa – that has produced the copious discussion of how the two areas relate to each other, and how to find harmony between then.” – Jerry Coyne


Religion has no ability to overturn the truths found by scientists. That doesn’t keep some people from trying.

YouTube

YouTube

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Actor

#9025



Besides his seminars, Coyne’s book Why Evolution is True seems to be quite visible on the internet. However, I submit that Coyne’s book Faith Versus Fact: Why Science and Religion are Incompatible is his magnum opus.

“There are no heated discussions about reconciling sport and religion, literature and religion, or business and religion; the important issue is the harmony between science and religion. But why, of all human endeavors that we could compare with religion, are we so concerned with its harmony with science?

“The answer, to me at least, seems obvious. Science and religion – unlike, say, business and religion – are competitors at discovering truths about nature. And science is the only field that has the ability to disprove the truth claims of religion, and has done so repeatedly. … Religion, on the other hand, has no ability to overturn the truths found by science. It is this competition, and the ability of science to erode the hegemony of faith – but not vice versa – that has produced the copious discussion of how the two areas relate to each other, and how to find harmony between then.” – Jerry Coyne


Religion has no ability to overturn the truths found by scientists. That doesn’t keep some people from trying.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txzOIGulUIQ


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTjA3BXz45c

Why would anyone with his head screwed on straight think for a second that religion and science are dealing with the same subject matter, i.e. "nature"? May I suggest that science has no ability to overturn the metaphysical truths of religion?

[Actor]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Why would anyone with his head screwed on straight ...

Ad hominem!

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Actor

Ad hominem!

Well...get your lid screwed on right.

How long have you been under the illusion that the bible is a science text book?

[Actor]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Well...get your lid screwed on right.

Ad hominem!

Originally Posted by boxcar

How long have you been under the illusion that the bible is a science text book?

• The universe is 13.7 billion years old.
• The earth is 4.5 billion years old.
• Evolution is true.
• Newton's laws of motion are true.
• There never was a great flood that killed all but six people.

You do not agree with any of the above. Why not? Because the Bible says otherwise. Ergo you, not I, are under the illusion that the Bible is a science textbook.

Keep reading my posts.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Actor

Ad hominem!

• The universe is 13.7 billion years old.
• The earth is 4.5 billion years old.
• Evolution is true.
• Newton's laws of motion are true.
• There never was a great flood that killed all but six people.

You do not agree with any of the above. Why not? Because the Bible says otherwise. Ergo you, not I, are under the illusion that the Bible is a science textbook.

Keep reading my posts.

That makes no sense whatsoever. What I don't believe are science text books and their lame theories on the genesis of the universe, its age, etc.

Again, the bible deals with metaphysical realities; science deals with only physical realities. And the twain shall never meet.

Got all that now...?