He isn't the same without the foot ointment

[classhandicapper]

To be clear, I'm not defending Baffert. Assuming the split sample is positive, IMO the horse should be DQ'd and he should get a significant fine and suspension. That said, the general public does not understand subtle differences between positives.

This is a therapeutic drug that reduces inflammation and allows the horse to train and run to his natural ability. That's different from a performance enhancer like EPO and the kinds of things Servis and Navarro are accused of using. Those things allow a horse to run beyond his natural ability.

We have to clean things up, but I think we have to be clear to the public that one is legal and therapeutic and the other is illegal. This was an overage of a legal and useful drug that should be punished appropriately, but it's not really a performance enhancer like we've seen in track and field, cycling etc..

If he's doing other things besides pushing the envelop, we have to catch him doing it.

[burnsy]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

To be clear, I'm not defending Baffert. Assuming the split sample is positive, IMO the horse should be DQ'd and he should get a significant fine and suspension. That said, the general public does not understand subtle differences between positives.

This is a therapeutic drug that reduces inflammation and allows the horse to train and run to his natural ability. That's different from a performance enhancer like EPO and the kinds of things Servis and Navarro are accused of using. Those things allow a horse to run beyond his natural ability.

We have to clean things up, but I think we have to be clear to the public that one is legal and therapeutic and the other is illegal. This was an overage of a legal and useful drug that should be punished appropriately, but it's not really a performance enhancer like we've seen in track and field, cycling etc..

If he's doing other things besides pushing the envelop, we have to catch him doing it.

I call BS. The public isn’t paid to know the rules..,,,. Subtle or not. Bob Baffert is! And like I said...... he’s been around a long time. He knows the freaking rules in every state.! No excuses. This whole thing has been yet another media and society food fight. I think people get off on the drama. I don’t even care what the handle was yesterday. Probably good. Cause the coverage was like watching the Kardashians, Tiger King or a Train wreck . If you really love this sport and the horses. You almost could of cried.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by burnsy

He denied it was injected. So, the ointment story and dermatitis is all we have to go by. Even though that wasn’t the first “explanation “ he gave. But there were a couple factors that cost that horse . The turn around is probably one of them but a huge difference was Midnight Bourbon and Irad. The jock change gave this horse a way more faster start from the gate with no bump. The pace wasn’t sizzling but Irad was on Medina Spirits ass through out. No breathers and he put that horse away easily. He also only ran two weeks ago and the Preakness was a huge improvement. Not all of these horses tire like people think. The difference was a little contention on the lead and a horse named Rombauer stepping up his game fresh. If Rombauer can duplicate that effort he’s gonna be a tough out from now on. I didn’t have him but he looked the part yesterday from entering the track til the wire. That freaking horse was feeling good. Lost but glad Medina didn’t win. This crap has to end so people can move on. All I say is , you fail a test, you give the game a black eye. On derby day you’re causing a disaster. Don’t care about excuses, thresholds or any of that. You won all these races over the years......... you know the fcking rules by now!

Medina Spirit should have pulled away at the 3/16 pole if it was the same horse as the Derby. He did not get a bad trip. He just wasn't on the dope this time.

[Frost king]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

Medina Spirit should have pulled away at the 3/16 pole if it was the same horse as the Derby. He did not get a bad trip. He just wasn't on the dope this time.

Funny how a horse posts a 14 pt new Beyer top, and a not word. Even though it is typical of California horses to run faster outside the state, than when they are at home. Where are the conspiracy theories today?

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by burnsy

I call BS. The public isn’t paid to know the rules..,,,. Subtle or not. Bob Baffert is! And like I said...... he’s been around a long time. He knows the freaking rules in every state.! No excuses. This whole thing has been yet another media and society food fight. I think people get off on the drama. I don’t even care what the handle was yesterday. Probably good. Cause the coverage was like watching the Kardashians, Tiger King or a Train wreck . If you really love this sport and the horses. You almost could of cried.

Which part are you calling BS on?

Is the part where I said the horse should be DQ'd and he should get a stiff fine and suspension or is it the part where we explain to the public what's actually going on?

[burnsy]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

Medina Spirit should have pulled away at the 3/16 pole if it was the same horse as the Derby. He did not get a bad trip. He just wasn't on the dope this time.

That was a fast Preakness. I don’t think anyone in this crop beats Rombauer yesterday. He finished strong and fast. Looks like the Belmont favorite if he enters. That may come back the fastest race of this crop..... he was moving.

The part I called BS was Class talking about the “subtle” rule violations. The public doesn’t care or want to hear it. Plus, how many is too many? Is this guy gonna get excuses and a pass forever? That’s what I call BS!’

[Maximillion]

Originally Posted by burnsy

He denied it was injected. So, the ointment story and dermatitis is all we have to go by. Even though that wasn’t the first “explanation “ he gave. But there were a couple factors that cost that horse . The turn around is probably one of them but a huge difference was Midnight Bourbon and Irad. The jock change gave this horse a way more faster start from the gate with no bump. The pace wasn’t sizzling but Irad was on Medina Spirits ass through out. No breathers and he put that horse away easily. He also only ran two weeks ago and the Preakness was a huge improvement. Not all of these horses tire like people think. The difference was a little contention on the lead and a horse named Rombauer stepping up his game fresh. If Rombauer can duplicate that effort he’s gonna be a tough out from now on. I didn’t have him but he looked the part yesterday from entering the track til the wire. That freaking horse was feeling good. Lost but glad Medina didn’t win. This crap has to end so people can move on. All I say is , you fail a test, you give the game a black eye. On derby day you’re causing a disaster. Don’t care about excuses, thresholds or any of that. You won all these races over the years......... you know the fcking rules by now!

I didnt really see the Preakness as a huge improvement for MS.Even his effort against his stablemate where he was likely not fully extended I saw as actually pretty strong.In my opinion neither MB nor the pace did him in yesterday....he wasnt "right" for whatever reason.

[PaceAdvantage]

Originally Posted by barbaro123

Let me ask you a question- if betamethasone was injected, wouldn't the amount found in the blood be higher than it was? I don't know, which is why I am asking- there was so little found in the overage of this medication.

He screwed up in the timing? Or the horse took longer to rid it from his system then Baffert and/or the vet thought?

It's called pushing the envelope. Or taking a risk. Or being sloppy.

Take your pick.

[PaceAdvantage]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

Medina Spirit should have pulled away at the 3/16 pole if it was the same horse as the Derby. He did not get a bad trip. He just wasn't on the dope this time.

So if this story never happened (positive), MS would have been 1/9 on the board?

You act like he won the Derby by 13 lengths.

[upthecreek]

Originally Posted by Gander36

FACTS:

Bob Baffert ran three horses at Pimlico over the weekend.

All three were tested pre-race.

All three ran clear of medicines.

All three were favorites.

All three lost.

Couldn't happen to a nicer guy
Baffert having horses entered persuaded me not to bet a dime (in those races)

[Spalding No!]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

So if this story never happened (positive), MS would have been 1/9 on the board?

You act like he won the Derby by 13 lengths.

In addition, wasn't there a faster and more contentious pace yesterday than there was in the Derby? The Preakness, despite being the longest race on the card, had the fastest 1/2 mile fraction of the 2 or 3 other dirt routes on the card.

The foreign horse made an ill-timed early move to add fuel to the fire as well.

[therussmeister]

Originally Posted by upthecreek

Couldn't happen to a nicer guy
Baffert having horses entered persuaded me not to bet a dime (in those races)

So you missed a chance to bet against three losing favorites. Sounds like a winning plan!

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

So if this story never happened (positive), MS would have been 1/9 on the board?

You act like he won the Derby by 13 lengths.

No

I mean he got the exact same trip as he did in the Derby. But without the dope he got tired in the stretch.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by Spalding No!

In addition, wasn't there a faster and more contentious pace yesterday than there was in the Derby? The Preakness, despite being the longest race on the card, had the fastest 1/2 mile fraction of the 2 or 3 other dirt routes on the card.

The foreign horse made an ill-timed early move to add fuel to the fire as well.

The half mile split was SLOWER yesterday than in the Derby, AND it was a shorter race.

But when they aren't taking a performance enhancing drug they get tired.

[GMB@BP]

Lets see if the trend continues, has two in today, same race, 6th at SA.