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Old 12-07-2020, 10:14 PM   #1
CBYRacer
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Watching workouts in person

Hi all,

Do any of you go out to the track to watch workouts in person? I don't know anything about how to do this so would appreciate any tips you might have. Basic questions I have are:

1) Are the workouts usually run in the mornings? If so, around 5am? 6am?
2) Can anyone generally come to the track to watch these? Do you need a special pass or permission?
3) How do you know beforehand which horses are working out and when? Is this information published anywhere?
4) Has watching in person been helpful to your handicapping? Is it worth it?
5) Any tips on what to look for when watching in person? How do you keep notes?

Thanks guys for your help!
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Old 12-08-2020, 04:10 PM   #2
MooseDog
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Training hours are probably my favorite time to be at a race track. If you can, go with an owner or someone familiar with what is going on out there and can explain it. Frankly, it's organized chaos. If your track has a program where you can go see a presentation or a barn tour (Emerald Downs has an excellent one) by all means do it.

Even if you decide to go on your own don't be afraid to ask questions of those you run into. For the most part horse people are "good people" and happy to answer questions.

Pre-COVID at most tracks you could walk into the grandstand and take a seat and watch the workouts, no one would bother you. In fact you'd probably find a smattering of owners and trainers doing the same, as well as maybe a private clocker or two.

I'm guessing most tracks have restricted access now due to COVID protocols, but at some point we'll get back to that. So I'll answer your questions under "normal" circumstances.

1) Training hours for most tracks are a 4 hour period every morning. Some tracks like GG shut down on Mondays but others go 7 days. Generally it's 6am to 10am but can change with daylight savings and track location. Generally you don't want too much training in darkness.

2) Most tracks I've been at there is no special access needed, though I suppose some tracks may limit it to license holders, especially those with casinos attached, but for the most part if you can get into the grandstand, you're good.

3) Unless you know someone personally, there is no way of knowing before hand what horses are working out. Generally just about ALL horses on the grounds will get out for a gallop or walk around the track a couple of times every training day. The rules for a work out, or "breeze" is a process but is also rather chaotic, involving a person on the grounds, usually called a "gap attendant" and a clocker or group of clockers located in the grandstand with a view of the whole track. Rules vary, but for the most part it is up the gap attendant and the clockers to verify that a particular horse is working out, but a trainer can't just work a horse out without announcing it. They identify a lot of them by sight, which is remarkable if you think about it, but there are back up methods involving barn rosters (horses wear a saddlecloth with the trainer logo on it) and a Jockey Club marking database.

4) I've never taken the time, but if you're going to go this route you have to do it every day without fail, take extensive notes, and really, get to know nearly all 800-1500 horses on the grounds by sight and peculiarity. There are very few with the discipline or skill of a Bruno de Julio or Gary Young or Andrew Harrington among others to do this right. At the major tracks now there are services selling workout reports and I'd highly recommend going this route as I don't think the time would be worth a casual individual doing this on their own. If you're serious about using workout information these services are well worth the money. In addition, for SoCal several of the TVG hosts have access so them and will often mention "good workout reports". There are few secrets any more so you're not likely to catch a 30-1 shot you saw in a flashy workout.

5) When watching workouts, the most obvious thing is how much pressure was the horse under to run a particular time. Most trainers now do not tend to work theirs horses fast. Baffert likes his to go 12 second furlongs. Jeff Bonde works them as fast as they can go. You watch the rider and see is he restraining the horse, is he urging with hands, or is he in a full out whipping frenzy. And again, you have to know what horse you are watching.

Hope that helps a bit. The XBTV (Stronach owned) YouTube channel has a lot of workouts of stakes horses, watch those and you can get a good idea of what the process looks like.
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Old 12-09-2020, 09:35 AM   #3
CBYRacer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MooseDog View Post
Training hours are probably my favorite time to be at a race track. If you can, go with an owner or someone familiar with what is going on out there and can explain it. Frankly, it's organized chaos. If your track has a program where you can go see a presentation or a barn tour (Emerald Downs has an excellent one) by all means do it.

Even if you decide to go on your own don't be afraid to ask questions of those you run into. For the most part horse people are "good people" and happy to answer questions.

Pre-COVID at most tracks you could walk into the grandstand and take a seat and watch the workouts, no one would bother you. In fact you'd probably find a smattering of owners and trainers doing the same, as well as maybe a private clocker or two.

I'm guessing most tracks have restricted access now due to COVID protocols, but at some point we'll get back to that. So I'll answer your questions under "normal" circumstances.

1) Training hours for most tracks are a 4 hour period every morning. Some tracks like GG shut down on Mondays but others go 7 days. Generally it's 6am to 10am but can change with daylight savings and track location. Generally you don't want too much training in darkness.

2) Most tracks I've been at there is no special access needed, though I suppose some tracks may limit it to license holders, especially those with casinos attached, but for the most part if you can get into the grandstand, you're good.

3) Unless you know someone personally, there is no way of knowing before hand what horses are working out. Generally just about ALL horses on the grounds will get out for a gallop or walk around the track a couple of times every training day. The rules for a work out, or "breeze" is a process but is also rather chaotic, involving a person on the grounds, usually called a "gap attendant" and a clocker or group of clockers located in the grandstand with a view of the whole track. Rules vary, but for the most part it is up the gap attendant and the clockers to verify that a particular horse is working out, but a trainer can't just work a horse out without announcing it. They identify a lot of them by sight, which is remarkable if you think about it, but there are back up methods involving barn rosters (horses wear a saddlecloth with the trainer logo on it) and a Jockey Club marking database.

4) I've never taken the time, but if you're going to go this route you have to do it every day without fail, take extensive notes, and really, get to know nearly all 800-1500 horses on the grounds by sight and peculiarity. There are very few with the discipline or skill of a Bruno de Julio or Gary Young or Andrew Harrington among others to do this right. At the major tracks now there are services selling workout reports and I'd highly recommend going this route as I don't think the time would be worth a casual individual doing this on their own. If you're serious about using workout information these services are well worth the money. In addition, for SoCal several of the TVG hosts have access so them and will often mention "good workout reports". There are few secrets any more so you're not likely to catch a 30-1 shot you saw in a flashy workout.

5) When watching workouts, the most obvious thing is how much pressure was the horse under to run a particular time. Most trainers now do not tend to work theirs horses fast. Baffert likes his to go 12 second furlongs. Jeff Bonde works them as fast as they can go. You watch the rider and see is he restraining the horse, is he urging with hands, or is he in a full out whipping frenzy. And again, you have to know what horse you are watching.

Hope that helps a bit. The XBTV (Stronach owned) YouTube channel has a lot of workouts of stakes horses, watch those and you can get a good idea of what the process looks like.
Wow! This is a fantastic response, MooseDog! Thank you so much! A lot to process here so I'll read through thoroughly but wanted to thank you for the time you put into this. Really interesting stuff.
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Old 12-09-2020, 05:41 PM   #4
jay68802
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Love watching works at Fonner Park when they are running and I have time. Knowing what horse is working is the key. Having a few friends at the track can be very helpful in this. But, I will still watch, even without knowing who is running. If a horse catches my eye, I will get as many photos of the horse as possible, and try to spot the horse in a Post Parade. Not the best thing, but once in a while, you have to use what you have to work with.
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Old 12-09-2020, 08:41 PM   #5
sharkey11
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heres a question most works are published in the racing form how is it they know wich horse is wich without an entry sheet. are the horsemen required to submit an entry an to whom do they give it to?
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Old 12-09-2020, 10:07 PM   #6
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good luck ... I would in many cases have a difficult time determining what stable the horse or group of horses was from.

what track are you planning on doing this at? are there feeder training tracks or other nearby tracks that frequently ship in and out horses?
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Old 12-10-2020, 09:30 AM   #7
46zilzal
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It can be very confusing even if you recognize the saddle cloth of the trainer as so many horses are out there at one time. If you do not have access to WHO is WHOM, it can be an exercise in frustration.
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Old 12-10-2020, 09:35 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sharkey11 View Post
here's a question most works are published in the racing form how is it they know which horse is which without an entry sheet. are the horsemen required to submit an entry an to whom do they give it to?
When the horses arrive from the "gap" (open area to the backstretch to the main course) they are required to identify the horse working and tell the horse identifier the proposed distance of the work. The identifier, then, radios that information up to the clockers on the roof.

If many horses are out there, it can be confusing even to the clockers especially when one horse passes another during the work

If you are not connected to that pipeline, you will not know who is woking and the proposal of how far that day's worked was PLANNED

I like the way Hong Kong does it: all horses are listed with saddle cloth numbers so anyone watching knows who is who.
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Old 12-10-2020, 12:33 PM   #9
sharkey11
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great info zilzal kinda tells something about published workouts i dont use them myself just the days since the last workout and the distance of of it thanks much sir
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Old 12-10-2020, 01:41 PM   #10
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Buy the workout data from one of the services.

They are experts at it and it will save you tons of time and money.

Now, just for fun......."Breakfast with the works" at Keeneland is a great morning to attend. I haven't been in many years, but the last time I went it was a great time. Good Breakfast too.......
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Old 12-19-2020, 11:20 AM   #11
mountainman
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I've known a few "official" clockers who could barely stay abreast of what horse MIGHT be working. Good luck as an outsider.

The whole scene resonates with purpose and pageantry, to be sure. But you would find it a soul-stirring blur-like a gorgeously shot movie in which lips move, but no dialogue comes out.
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