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07-20-2020, 05:43 PM
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#31
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 3,641
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingAnon
I they bet on loot crates and gacha video games..
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Basically, glorified skinner boxes.
(A Skinner box, also known as an operant conditioning chamber, is an enclosed apparatus that contains a bar or key that an animal can press or manipulate in order to obtain food or water as a type of reinforcement.) In the partial reinforcement schedules, some pigeons receive a pellet after they peck at the key five times. This is known as a fixed-ratio schedule. Pigeons in another group receive reinforcement after a random number of responses, which is known as a variable-ratio schedule. Still, more pigeons are given a pellet after a 10 minute period has elapsed. This is called a fixed-interval schedule. In the final group, pigeons are given reinforcement at random intervals of time.)
King ... creators of Candy Crush, employs Ph.D. Psychologists whose specialty is addiction.
Really no comparison to horse racing. Horse racing not going to go away for same reason crossword puzzles don't. Some people like to do their studying and figuring out a good puzzle.
It takes knowledge and work to analyze horse racing data.
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07-20-2020, 07:07 PM
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#32
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clicknow
Basically, glorified skinner boxes.
(A Skinner box, also known as an operant conditioning chamber, is an enclosed apparatus that contains a bar or key that an animal can press or manipulate in order to obtain food or water as a type of reinforcement.) In the partial reinforcement schedules, some pigeons receive a pellet after they peck at the key five times. This is known as a fixed-ratio schedule. Pigeons in another group receive reinforcement after a random number of responses, which is known as a variable-ratio schedule. Still, more pigeons are given a pellet after a 10 minute period has elapsed. This is called a fixed-interval schedule. In the final group, pigeons are given reinforcement at random intervals of time.)
King ... creators of Candy Crush, employs Ph.D. Psychologists whose specialty is addiction.
Really no comparison to horse racing. Horse racing not going to go away for same reason crossword puzzles don't. Some people like to do their studying and figuring out a good puzzle.
It takes knowledge and work to analyze horse racing data.
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Horse racing will always exist in some form, but it's not going to be a mainstream thing again. Much like Wrestling, the Harlem Globetrotters, Roller Derby and so forth. They exist, they can be found, but their glory days are long gone.
The average age of people who gamble on it or go to races is old. Millenials and Gen Z are just not as interested and I don't see any way that can be changed.
The media also has it out for horse racing, which is another major hurdle.
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07-20-2020, 07:39 PM
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#33
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 7,325
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingAnon
Horse racing will always exist in some form, but it's not going to be a mainstream thing again. Much like Wrestling, the Harlem Globetrotters, Roller Derby and so forth. They exist, they can be found, but their glory days are long gone.
The average age of people who gamble on it or go to races is old. Millenials and Gen Z are just not as interested and I don't see any way that can be changed.
The media also has it out for horse racing, which is another major hurdle.
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Quiet Chris....the names change, but the song remains the same.
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07-20-2020, 08:15 PM
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#34
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The Voice of Reason!
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Canandaigua, New york
Posts: 112,470
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingAnon
I like horse racing and wrestling, and both are dying and will eventually be dead.
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Shirley you jest~!
I am not sure about racing, but WRESTLING is thriving!
This is the new golden age.
WWE, AEW, Impact, NWA, ROH, NewJapan
Pretty much every day of the week, and they, too, doing it without fans.
Although one is more believable than the other....
__________________
Who does the Racing Form Detective like in this one?
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07-21-2020, 01:18 PM
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#35
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom
Shirley you jest~!
I am not sure about racing, but WRESTLING is thriving!
This is the new golden age.
WWE, AEW, Impact, NWA, ROH, NewJapan
Pretty much every day of the week, and they, too, doing it without fans.
Although one is more believable than the other....
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Wrestling's dead, man.
In 1983, 10 different promotions in the US drew 10,000 fans or more for an event. In 2020, with a lot more technology and 50 million new people, only 2 promotions could achieve it.
Raw's averaging under 2 million viewers, AEW and NXT combined can't hit 1.5 million. ROH has been dead since the MSG show and Impact is so low on the totem pole, it's not even worth discussing. I don't even think NWA has come close to making a profit yet. WWE's getting tons of money due to tv deals, but it's less people spending more.
New Japan is doing good, but Japan and Mexico are different beasts than the US. NJPW is still way down from its peak in the 90's and every name Japanese promotion has been sold to someone else in the last decade. With Mexico, it's part of the culture and the local arena's are a lot of the heart and soul of it, but CMLL is having to rely on foreign visitors which is not good at all.
Last edited by KingAnon; 07-21-2020 at 01:25 PM.
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07-21-2020, 01:42 PM
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#36
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 371
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingAnon
I like horse racing and wrestling, and both are dying and will eventually be dead. The interest is just not there and the media makes horse racing seem like a thoroughbred genocide to the average person. Within the next 50 years, there's only going to be a few tracks left, if its not completely barred. At least we will always have Japan and Hong Kong though.
I'm younger. I don't know anyone who watches horse racing, nor even know anyone who knows anyone who watches horse racing. People my age don't bet on horse racing, they bet on loot crates and gacha video games. And with all of the sports channels/sites promoting betting on games, it's going to be harder and harder as the older folks pass away.
I don't know how you reverse the trend or if you even can, but I know as a casual person, it didn't make any real strides during the lockdown.
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Betting on the ponies will be around in one form or another, probably not what the previous generations are used to. You probably won't have those giant race tracks with capacities for 40,000+ on land in expensive urban areas. It might be be one strictly catered to online betting on an Indian reservation attached to other types of gaming utilizing cheap desert land that would otherwise be unused. Overseas racing is doing relatively OK, so I don't see them going away either.
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07-21-2020, 02:08 PM
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#37
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NJ
Posts: 3,816
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingAnon
Wrestling's dead, man.
In 1983, 10 different promotions in the US drew 10,000 fans or more for an event. In 2020, with a lot more technology and 50 million new people, only 2 promotions could achieve it.
Raw's averaging under 2 million viewers, AEW and NXT combined can't hit 1.5 million. ROH has been dead since the MSG show and Impact is so low on the totem pole, it's not even worth discussing. I don't even think NWA has come close to making a profit yet. WWE's getting tons of money due to tv deals, but it's less people spending more.
New Japan is doing good, but Japan and Mexico are different beasts than the US. NJPW is still way down from its peak in the 90's and every name Japanese promotion has been sold to someone else in the last decade. With Mexico, it's part of the culture and the local arena's are a lot of the heart and soul of it, but CMLL is having to rely on foreign visitors which is not good at all.
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This is pretty much spot on. Also, the median age of a WWE fan who watches their weekly programming is 55. Young people don't watch it.
Not sure what it has to do with horse racing except for the aging fanbase, but since I actually know lower-level people in the wrestling industry, they've been preaching for years about needing new fans. It's tough when all of the people in charge are age 50 and up and think the 1980s are current. The only thing that's saved WWE is the desperate need for live sports programming and the rapidly declining standard of what a "good" TV rating is. Without those TV contracts, they're done. With them, they're making many millions a year.
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07-21-2020, 02:40 PM
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#38
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 371
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MMA is the reason why wrasslin' isn't as big as it used to be....why watch fake fighting when you can watch the real thing.
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07-23-2020, 07:02 AM
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#39
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 3,641
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingAnon
Horse racing will always exist in some form, but it's not going to be a mainstream thing again.
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Horse racing has been around for 152 years (longer but i'm just counting the U.S. and formal racing).
Get back to me when loot crates and gacha video survives even the next decade.
Mostly everyone I know loves horse racing itself, the beauty of thoroughbreds, (there's an entire photographic art history featuring them), their breeding, the thrill of watching them run, being mostly outdoors, and the whole puzzle work of raking over the data. Ditto, standing on a riverbank, fishing all day. Even if you don't catch anything, the payoff is sheer enjoyment.
I've played those games you're talking about. It feels like robotic empty insect activity to me.
Believe it or not, there are still people whose attention span can "handle" chess, fishing, baseball, horseracing, crossword puzzles, and reading a long book in a hammock for a whole day. And not all of them are "old people".
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07-23-2020, 07:37 PM
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#40
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The Voice of Reason!
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Canandaigua, New york
Posts: 112,470
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Quote:
Originally Posted by horsefan2019
MMA is the reason why wrasslin' isn't as big as it used to be....why watch fake fighting when you can watch the real thing.
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The fake stuff is more entertaining.
When can we bet on it?
(I see no difference in WWE that jocks grabbing speed horses out of the gate - FAKE racing)
__________________
Who does the Racing Form Detective like in this one?
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07-24-2020, 10:15 AM
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#41
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1
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I have felt that racing was slowly losing players over the years and recognize all the issues other have listed on this thread.
HOWEVER, to me I see much better liquidity coming into the game. P5 pools are insane! P4, P5 and P6 mandatories are incredible.
That's what the younger players want so keep em coming.
I disagree with the idea that racing is dying. I really believe these "lotto" type payouts are what is resurrecting the game.
You can see P5's at Gulf, Ny etc all going off at around the same time all with monster pools.
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07-24-2020, 12:30 PM
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#42
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Dark Side of the Moon
Posts: 5,870
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joes1818
I have felt that racing was slowly losing players over the years and recognize all the issues other have listed on this thread.
HOWEVER, to me I see much better liquidity coming into the game. P5 pools are insane! P4, P5 and P6 mandatories are incredible.
That's what the younger players want so keep em coming.
I disagree with the idea that racing is dying. I really believe these "lotto" type payouts are what is resurrecting the game.
You can see P5's at Gulf, Ny etc all going off at around the same time all with monster pools.
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Liquidity in the game is a mirage, its coming from advanced computer betting companies that are much more sophisticated than the average player, with much better information and access.
The Lotto style plays also crush the smaller player as they do not have the capital to play the bet correctly and the high takeout will run them into the ground over time.
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07-24-2020, 01:24 PM
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#43
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queens, NY
Posts: 20,528
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GMB@BP
The Lotto style plays also crush the smaller player as they do not have the capital to play the bet correctly and the high takeout will run them into the ground over time.
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That's the way I feel about it.
Everyone is trying to make a score, but between the higher takes of many exotics, inadequate bankrolls, and inevitable long losing streaks with exotics, a lot of players are going to get discouraged or go bust and give up way faster than if they stick with WPS, exactas, and doubles and stay in action with enough positive reinforcement to keep trying to learn and get an edge.
If I was a teenager now and started with Pick4s, Pick5s and Pick6s, instead of lasting 45 years, I probably would have quit in 6 months unless I got lucky.
__________________
"Unlearning is the highest form of learning"
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07-24-2020, 03:20 PM
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#44
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clicknow
Horse racing has been around for 152 years (longer but i'm just counting the U.S. and formal racing).
Get back to me when loot crates and gacha video survives even the next decade.
Mostly everyone I know loves horse racing itself, the beauty of thoroughbreds, (there's an entire photographic art history featuring them), their breeding, the thrill of watching them run, being mostly outdoors, and the whole puzzle work of raking over the data. Ditto, standing on a riverbank, fishing all day. Even if you don't catch anything, the payoff is sheer enjoyment.
I've played those games you're talking about. It feels like robotic empty insect activity to me.
Believe it or not, there are still people whose attention span can "handle" chess, fishing, baseball, horseracing, crossword puzzles, and reading a long book in a hammock for a whole day. And not all of them are "old people".
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Games with lootboxes/gacha's for skins or items aren't going anywhere and are becoming the norm for the most part.
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