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10-27-2017, 09:02 PM
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#316
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,964
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lamboguy
i just looked at the charts today race by race and just saw something i have never seen before, the pick 6 had $16,000 bet into it and the pick 5 that started in the next race had $715,000 bet into it. some guy must have loved the pick 5 today for some reason because that looks like a giant bet that is way bigger than Belmont and Santa Anita combined.
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There was a $98,000 carryover in the pick 5. That is why there was extra handle today.
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10-27-2017, 09:51 PM
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#317
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Boston+Ocala
Posts: 23,661
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poindexter
There was a $98,000 carryover in the pick 5. That is why there was extra handle today.
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thanks for the clarification, i hadn't really paid to much attention with their meet this year other than reading this thread.
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10-28-2017, 11:57 AM
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#319
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 983
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmyb
Thread has almost 20,000 hits. keeneland take notice.
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What is most important is that I think OTHER tracks will notice. The industry schleps can spin these numbers any way they want, but it is very obvious to me from feedback I am getting that this boycott is clearly sending a message.
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10-28-2017, 01:12 PM
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#320
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,230
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The Laffer Curve at work.
So if Belmont and SA are up about 10% and Keeneland is down about 7%, isn't Keeneland's real loss about 17%, since they also should be up about 10%?
This is my first post in this thread, and I did not make a bet at Keeneland this fall.
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10-28-2017, 01:41 PM
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#321
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Boston+Ocala
Posts: 23,661
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnGalt1
The Laffer Curve at work.
So if Belmont and SA are up about 10% and Keeneland is down about 7%, isn't Keeneland's real loss about 17%, since they also should be up about 10%?
This is my first post in this thread, and I did not make a bet at Keeneland this fall.
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i'm with you all the way! reading this thread has been much more exciting than watching or betting on the Keeneland product. truthfully in a selfish way i am hoping that Keeneland raises the take some more so i can read all the new excuses and comparisons. pretty soon we are going to be comparing this years handle numbers to those 29 years ago.
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10-28-2017, 02:05 PM
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#322
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Missouri
Posts: 2,190
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NY Racing Fan
I think too many boycotts creates a watered down effect and limits their effectiveness. I think that everyone should use the HANA track ratings to always determine value when playing the races. I feel that everyone should gear up for next Spring's Keeneland meet and make the boycott even stronger. We need to show the "A" tracks how another takeout increase will be responded to by the betting public.
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I think you are right. CD use to be my favorite track. 90% of my play goes to KEE, OP, CD. I'm running out of tracks to play!
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10-28-2017, 08:43 PM
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#323
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Missouri
Posts: 2,190
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https://www.paulickreport.com/news/t...and-fall-meet/
On-track wagering during totaled $17,597,035, just shy of last year's $17,793,419 but well below the record $27,591,341 established in 2013. Average daily on-track handle was $1,035,120 versus $1,046,672 in 2016. All-sources wagering on Keeneland racing totaled $121,712,702, down 8.4 percent when compared to last fall's $132,937,720 and the lowest since 2010. The all-time high wagering mark was set in 2013, when $142,999,252 was bet. Average daily all-sources handle of $7,159,571 dipped 8.4 percent from last year's $7,819,866 and is 14.9 percent lower than the 2013 record $8,411,722.
Keeneland increased its wagering takeout prior to the fall meeting, sparking criticism from many corners, including from perennial leading owner Kenneth Ramsey. The Horseplayers Association of North America urged a boycott of Keeneland to its members.
“These are solid results, especially considering that eight races during the meet were taken off the turf and three race cards were conducted either entirely or partially on an off track,” Keeneland vice president of racing and sales Bob Elliston said. “Those factors adversely impacted field size and therefore overall wagering, particularly when compared to last fall when we enjoyed perfect weather every race day.”
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10-28-2017, 08:46 PM
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#324
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: JCapper Platinum: Kind of like Deep Blue... but for horses.
Posts: 5,258
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Will post a further update once I crunch numbers for Santa Anita.
Here's what I have so far...
Totals after 17 days --
Keeneland Fall 2017 Meet:
http://www.Playersboycott.org/kee_fa...side-2017.html
DOWN -$11.32M -8.52%
Belmont during all 17 days of Keeneland's fall 2017 meet:
http://www.Playersboycott.org/bel_fa...side-2017.html
UP +$15.40M +12.07%
In terms of total handle:
This year: Belmont outhandled Keeneland by 17.5%
Last year: Keeneland outhandled Belmont by 4.2%
That's a 21.7% reversal.
But obviously, that has nothing to do with takeout.
-jp
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__________________
Team JCapper: 2011 PAIHL Regular Season ROI Leader after 15 weeks
www.JCapper.com
Last edited by Jeff P; 10-28-2017 at 08:51 PM.
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10-28-2017, 09:24 PM
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#325
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: JCapper Platinum: Kind of like Deep Blue... but for horses.
Posts: 5,258
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The Paulick Report - Solid Attendance And Record Purse Money But Declining Handle During Keeneland Fall Meet:
https://www.paulickreport.com/news/t...and-fall-meet/
Quote:
“These are solid results, especially considering that eight races during the meet were taken off the turf and three race cards were conducted either entirely or partially on an off track,” Keeneland vice president of racing and sales Bob Elliston said. “Those factors adversely impacted field size and therefore overall wagering, particularly when compared to last fall when we enjoyed perfect weather every race day.”
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Somebody might want to tell Elliston the dirt was wet on both Oct 20th 2016 and Oct 21st 2016 - and that races 3 and 6 were taken off the turf on Oct 21st 2016 as well.
-jp
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__________________
Team JCapper: 2011 PAIHL Regular Season ROI Leader after 15 weeks
www.JCapper.com
Last edited by Jeff P; 10-28-2017 at 09:28 PM.
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10-28-2017, 10:38 PM
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#326
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 4,962
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Thanks to everyone who participated in the boycott.
And thanks to Jeff for working so damn hard at it.
Dean
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10-28-2017, 11:39 PM
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#327
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 7,727
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeanT
Thanks to everyone who participated in the boycott.
And thanks to Jeff for working so damn hard at it.
Dean
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I'll second both of those.
__________________
One flew east, one flew west,
One flew over the cuckoo's nest.
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10-29-2017, 10:24 AM
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#329
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Top Horse Analytics
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 12,303
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10-29-2017, 10:42 AM
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#330
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Boston+Ocala
Posts: 23,661
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Mr. Elliston, you have this whole thing ass backwards. what you need to do is cut the purses in half and if you need to lower them even more and then lower the takeout and get rid of the breakage that gets fleeced out of all your customers. i promise you this will not only lead to increased field sizes and much better racing but also triple your handle without being to innovative. Mr. Elliston, this is easy math, nothing tough to this. you will also make so much more money from your parking, admissions, seats, and your concession stands that you will have to find more space to put all the people in the place that want to get in.
by raising the takeout you have sent this game into a death spiral.
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