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View Poll Results: How do you feel about gun control laws?
Current laws infringe on our rights and should be weakened 21 17.80%
Current laws are just fine, thanks. We don't need anything more 28 23.73%
Current laws are not satisfactory, there are "common sense" adjustments that should be made 69 58.47%
Voters: 118. This poll is closed

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Old 02-23-2018, 08:12 PM   #256
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Bad news, guys. The libs have finally started educating themselves about firearms, and are using that knowledge to destroy arguments for gun ownership.

MSNBC's Lawrence O'Donnell uses facts to prove that a teacher with a hand gun can never stop a shooter with an AR-15. Excerpts:

Quote:
A bullet fired from an AR-15 travels 3x faster than one from a handgun.

And yet the president and the NRA think giving teachers guns will stop a school shooter.

2,182 miles per hour. That’s how fast the bullets were moving when they came out of that AR-15 at Marjorie Stoneman-Douglas High School last week. 2,182 miles per hour. 3,200 feet per second. That’s what those kids were trying to outrun. That’s three times the speed of a bullet leaving a 9mm handgun.
...

With a high-capacity magazine, the AR-15 can maybe fire 90 or 100 bullets in a minute. A concealable handgun can fire maybe 15 bullets in a minute.
...

You can walk off a handgun wound.
https://www.louderwithcrowder.com/la...nell-gun-rant/
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Old 02-23-2018, 08:20 PM   #257
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clocker View Post
Bad news, guys. The libs have finally started educating themselves about firearms, and are using that knowledge to destroy arguments for gun ownership.

MSNBC's Lawrence O'Donnell uses facts to prove that a teacher with a hand gun can never stop a shooter with an AR-15. Excerpts:

https://www.louderwithcrowder.com/la...nell-gun-rant/
But it must be true. Larry is an accomplished crisis journalist actor with MSNBC
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Old 02-23-2018, 08:20 PM   #258
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All of you people who voted to limit your 2nd amendment rights, you need to rethink your position, especially if you think the government is going to protect you.

FYI the government has no duty to protect its citizens from crimes. That is right several courts, as well as, SCOTUS has held the goevenment (police, FBI, etc) do not have a duty to protect you. DeShaney v. Winnebago County Department of Social Services,” Stevens writes, “the U.S. Supreme Court declared that the Constitution does not impose a duty on the state and local governments to protect the citizens from criminal harm.” [emphasis added]

Listen to Justice Stevens, you have to protect yourself, do not give up any 2nd amendment rights.

Last edited by Show Me the Wire; 02-23-2018 at 08:30 PM.
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Old 02-23-2018, 09:12 PM   #259
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Originally Posted by Clocker View Post
Bad news, guys. The libs have finally started educating themselves about firearms, and are using that knowledge to destroy arguments for gun ownership.

MSNBC's Lawrence O'Donnell uses facts to prove that a teacher with a hand gun can never stop a shooter with an AR-15. Excerpts:

https://www.louderwithcrowder.com/la...nell-gun-rant/
I needed a good laugh today.
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Old 02-23-2018, 09:15 PM   #260
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It looks like the government is going to have to crack down and pass stricter gun control laws. Next month there will be a student march on Washington demanding tougher gun controls.

High fashion clothing company Gucci has announced a $500K donation to help fund it.

Quote:
On Monday, George Clooney and his human rights lawyer wife Amal, Oprah Winfrey, director Steven Spielberg and his actress wife Kate Capshaw, and film producer Jeffrey Katzenberg and his wife Marilyn each also pledged $500,000.
http://www.breitbart.com/news/gucci-...-reform-march/
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Old 02-23-2018, 10:11 PM   #261
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I needed a good laugh today.
Larry is the go-to guy when you are looking for a super-sized serving of stupid.

You have to wonder where these guys get their "facts" and what goes through their minds when they "think" about them.

What difference does it make how fast a bullet travels? A hand gun bullet is going to hit you before your brain can register that the gun has been fired. Three times faster than that is more deadly?
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Old 02-23-2018, 10:16 PM   #262
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Originally Posted by Clocker View Post
Larry is the go-to guy when you are looking for a super-sized serving of stupid.

You have to wonder where these guys get their "facts" and what goes through their minds when they "think" about them.

What difference does it make how fast a bullet travels? A hand gun bullet is going to hit you before your brain can register that the gun has been fired. Three times faster than that is more deadly?
What? MSNBC and CNN always seem to have bulls-eye accuracy with their 'facts'.
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Old 02-23-2018, 10:38 PM   #263
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What? MSNBC and CNN always seem to have bulls-eye accuracy with their 'facts'.
That's true. I was personally ashamed when a Princeton professor of religion and African American Studies appeared on MSNBC and explained that “toxic masculinity” is driving America’s “gun culture.”

http://www.breitbart.com/tech/2018/0...f-gun-culture/

I immediately admitted the truth to myself and repented, and took my vast collection of firearms and ammunition to the nearest lake and threw everything into the deepest water.

Gun grabbers please make a note of the above and put it in my file. It's all gone. Thank you.
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Old 02-23-2018, 10:38 PM   #264
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What difference does it make how fast a bullet travels? A hand gun bullet is going to hit you before your brain can register that the gun has been fired. Three times faster than that is more deadly?
The Simple Physics that make some bullets more deadly than others

Note the Velocity chapter.

https://www.thetrace.org/2017/06/phy...lt-rifles/amp/
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Old 02-23-2018, 10:41 PM   #265
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clocker View Post
Larry is the go-to guy when you are looking for a super-sized serving of stupid.

You have to wonder where these guys get their "facts" and what goes through their minds when they "think" about them.

What difference does it make how fast a bullet travels? A hand gun bullet is going to hit you before your brain can register that the gun has been fired. Three times faster than that is more deadly?


The .17 REM has a muzzle velocity of 4450 fps or 3,000+ MPH!!!

You and I ever get in a gunfight though and I'd still prefer you shoot me with that k?
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Old 02-23-2018, 10:48 PM   #266
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The Simple Physics that make some bullets more deadly than others

Note the Velocity chapter.

https://www.thetrace.org/2017/06/phy...lt-rifles/amp/
Can we not?

I build the things and the loads...

It comes down to mass and velocity yes. However bullets are all designed differently as to when they expand and deliver that energy.

The .223/5.56 is a great middle range round that has been proven to function well at middle distances of 200-400 meters. Mostly because M855 or NATO Green Tip has a penetrator to defeat most light body armor at that range, decellerate the bullet, and allow it to expand and transfer the majority of its energy into the target.

That round is horrible for shooting someone at close range because it's far to fast and simply overpenetrates. So what does the military use for CQB? The SEALs are issued the MP5 chambered in a... you guessed it... 9mm hand gun round because it's slower and more lethal at close range.

If you're really bored I can share with you why my deer AR is in a .450 Bushmaster.

Careful though you might learn something in this post.

Last edited by elysiantraveller; 02-23-2018 at 11:02 PM.
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Old 02-23-2018, 11:08 PM   #267
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Originally Posted by FantasticDan View Post
The Simple Physics that make some bullets more deadly than others

Note the Velocity chapter.

https://www.thetrace.org/2017/06/phy...lt-rifles/amp/
Since we're talking about projectiles here, a question for you:

At 100 yards, would you rather be shot in the arm or leg with a standard AR-15, or an 1861 Springfield (or 1853 Enfield) as used by both sides in the Civil War? [I suppose both weapons could be considered the "assault" rifles of their day.]

(Hint: in 1866 the State of Mississippi allocated one-half of its budget for the purchase of artificial limbs for its returning veterans.)

Not that the physics formulas in your article are incorrect, just sensationalized for effect.
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Old 02-23-2018, 11:21 PM   #268
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The Simple Physics that make some bullets more deadly than others

Note the Velocity chapter.

https://www.thetrace.org/2017/06/phy...lt-rifles/amp/
Did you note the velocity section? It is nonsense.

Quote:
Assault rifles don’t shoot the largest bullets on the market. In fact, the .223 projectile, a common round for the AR-15, is not much larger than many .22 rounds like the Hornet, typically used for youth shooting sports, target shooting, and hunting varmints. The .223 weighs in at 55 grains, while the .22 is usually 45 grains or smaller.
The .22 Hornet is not typically used for youth shooting sports or target shooting, the .22 LR (Long Rifle) is. And it is a much smaller and less powerful cartridge than the Hornet.

So a major scoop, a military grade cartridge is more dangerous than a common, much smaller civilian sport cartridge, especially at the 500 yard range cited in the article. And the point is what?
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Old 02-23-2018, 11:31 PM   #269
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Did you note the velocity section? It is nonsense.

The .22 Hornet is not typically used for youth shooting sports or target shooting, the .22 LR (Long Rifle) is. And it is a much smaller and less powerful cartridge than the Hornet.

So a major scoop, a military grade cartridge is more dangerous than a common, much smaller civilian sport cartridge, especially at the 500 yard range cited in the article. And the point is what?
And lets be honest... nobody uses a .22 Hornet for anything these days.

Fairer grain comparisons to the .223 would be .220 Swift and .22/250 Rem both of which donkey stomp AR round in terms of speed and range.

Last edited by elysiantraveller; 02-23-2018 at 11:32 PM.
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Old 02-23-2018, 11:49 PM   #270
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The Simple Physics that make some bullets more deadly than others

Note the Velocity chapter.

https://www.thetrace.org/2017/06/phy...lt-rifles/amp/
This will give you an idea and why articles like this do more damage than good. All the below pictured rounds have totally different velocities and purposes...



A variety of .223 Remington cartridges and a .308 Winchester (right) for comparison. Bullets in .223 cartridges (left to right): Montana Gold 55 grain Full Metal Jacket, Sierra 55 grain Spitzer Boat Tail, Nosler/Winchester 55 grain Combined Technology, Hornady 60 grain V-MAX, Barnes 62 grain Tipped Triple-Shock X, Nosler 69 grain Hollow Point Boat Tail, Swift 75 grain Scirocco II.
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