The Official Del Mar Meet Thread. The Good-The Bad-The Ugly.

[GMB@BP]

Originally Posted by Dahoss9698

I think the main has been pretty kind to speed.

I would agree, its been very hard to close, its not a rail deal like saratoga but must be hard for those that distribute their energy late versus early.

[Ruffian1]

Originally Posted by Spalding No!

The problem with soft tissue injuries is that the vast majority of such horses come back at a lower class level and then we get to watch a game of "hot potato" between horsemen as the horses slide down the class ladder. And some of those aren't even afforded rest in the first place.

In short, not a pleasant experience or sight, either. Just a longer, drawn out process.

The drop off in fatalities should be commended, but swinging the pendulum from one imbalance to the other doesn't benefit the big picture (i.e., short fields, bad public image) for horse racing in the long run.

If indeed there is a rash of soft tissue injuries, it is because the horses went from not at all deep, to deep, or more bluntly, a brick road to a safer and more suitable depth. Having never trained in Calif. my knowledge on the subject is limited. I assume because the weather is more constant , the track is always the same. On the east coast, the track is never "always the same".
They are winterized each year . That means more sand , salt, etc. That means cuppier, deeper and completely different from the way it is in July. What trainers do is prepare for that. If you don't, you can get soft tissue injuries.
There are plenty of things a trainer can do to help minimize that problem until the horses can become used to the new surface. Over time, the horses will become used to the surface and not nearly as many problems will pop up. That is what east coast trainers have done for decades.

I don't know but I have to think that the horsemen had due notice that this was going to happen. And try as you might this stuff will crop up but hopefully at a minimum. No one wants to see their horse pull a suspensory, tendon, or a butt muscle all of which can shelf a horse right away. Hopefully it is not a rash of such and over 60 days, most horses should adapt with help from the trainer. So I think that it is not a swinging of a pendulum for the long term but a short term problem that trainers can help guard against. In the long run, it seems logical that it can help the overall picture . Lets hope so.
Chances are we are reacting to comments from someone who should not be commenting on the subject. And I certainly don't condone hurting a horse with soft tissue injuries instead of broken sesamoids. I don't want either of those things. But at least with a deeper surface, there are ways to help horses get used to it. Having dealt with Pimlico and the "feet raddle" mentality that came with it in the70's and 80's, there is nothing a trainer can do but watch and hope.

[Augenj]

Originally Posted by Ruffian1

If indeed there is a rash of soft tissue injuries, it is because the horses went from not at all deep, to deep, or more bluntly, a brick road to a safer and more suitable depth. Having never trained in Calif. my knowledge on the subject is limited. I assume because the weather is more constant , the track is always the same. On the east coast, the track is never "always the same".
They are winterized each year . That means more sand , salt, etc. That means cuppier, deeper and completely different from the way it is in July. What trainers do is prepare for that. If you don't, you can get soft tissue injuries.
There are plenty of things a trainer can do to help minimize that problem until the horses can become used to the new surface. Over time, the horses will become used to the surface and not nearly as many problems will pop up. That is what east coast trainers have done for decades.

I don't know but I have to think that the horsemen had due notice that this was going to happen. And try as you might this stuff will crop up but hopefully at a minimum. No one wants to see their horse pull a suspensory, tendon, or a butt muscle all of which can shelf a horse right away. Hopefully it is not a rash of such and over 60 days, most horses should adapt with help from the trainer. So I think that it is not a swinging of a pendulum for the long term but a short term problem that trainers can help guard against. In the long run, it seems logical that it can help the overall picture . Lets hope so.
Chances are we are reacting to comments from someone who should not be commenting on the subject. And I certainly don't condone hurting a horse with soft tissue injuries instead of broken sesamoids. I don't want either of those things. But at least with a deeper surface, there are ways to help horses get used to it. Having dealt with Pimlico and the "feet raddle" mentality that came with it in the70's and 80's, there is nothing a trainer can do but watch and hope.

Good post.

[theiman]

Del Mars turf goes back to rails at zero, or normal positions, for Friday through Sundays cards. This the first time they have been at normal since opening week 7/19-23.

[SG4]

So after Cal racing screwed up the jackpot mandatory payoff day so badly last time, clearly they were a) a little gun-shy and b) still with their heads stuck up their ass to prepare for today's payouts. See something new every day, today was the announcement that pick 6 will-pays would not be available due to a scratch in the finale (a scratch from 10 AM today, not a late scratch). Getting past 20 mins after last race was official & still no payouts either. Hopefully they'll figure something out before tomorrow.

[SG4]

OK, payouts for pick 6 finally up, but jeez it should not be this difficult people.

[Andy Asaro]

Remember it’s NOT all sources it’s handle on races run at Del Mar.

They started later this year so there have been less days but the daily average should be a good indicator.

2017 (219 races) = $10,101,673 Daily Average to date

2016 (248 races) = $9,469,790 Daily Average to date

2015 (256 races) = $9,645,401 Daily average to date

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by Andy Asaro

Remember it’s NOT all sources it’s handle on races run at Del Mar.

They started later this year so there have been less days but the daily average should be a good indicator.

2017 (219 races) = $10,101,673 Daily Average to date

2016 (248 races) = $9,469,790 Daily Average to date

2015 (256 races) = $9,645,401 Daily average to date

They are getting killed on live attendance though. Even Arrogate couldn't draw- only 23k on Saturday.

[CincyHorseplayer]

Man I totally dig the Del Mar meet. I wade my way through it but I find a high level of chaos at Saratoga. At Del Mar I only find the occasionally unpredictable race and the prices are surprisingly good. That combination is easy to fall in love with. Thusday I hit 3 in a row at 8-1, 14-1, and 4-1. Easy to get used too. Rarely ever that good though! Del Mar has been a blast. I need to get out there one August. The beach as much of a draw.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by CincyHorseplayer

Man I totally dig the Del Mar meet. I wade my way through it but I find a high level of chaos at Saratoga. At Del Mar I only find the occasionally unpredictable race and the prices are surprisingly good. That combination is easy to fall in love with. Thusday I hit 3 in a row at 8-1, 14-1, and 4-1. Easy to get used too. Rarely ever that good though! Del Mar has been a blast. I need to get out there one August. The beach as much of a draw.

I have always found Saratoga's big, deep, competitive fields tough to handicap. And that's not a diss- it's a compliment. Del Mar is a little easier.

[CincyHorseplayer]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

I have always found Saratoga's big, deep, competitive fields tough to handicap. And that's not a diss- it's a compliment. Del Mar is a little easier.

Absolutely. Certain pace ability types that can't win at Santa Anita can win big at Del Mar. I think that explains the price friendliness. Trainers get play here also but it's not as oppressive as at Toga. Trainer stats are huge at these meets but I can't jump on the Man-Handling approach. Trainers are bet againsts for me. I spent the day Saturday betting against Chad Brown and Todd Pletcher. They got me twice. But I got them 3 times! Dilger, Ribaudo, and Walsh. That's why I got prices at Toga.

Anyway if I get out to your back yard I hope you'll show me around. I know you love your surf and turf out there brother!

[GMB@BP]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

I have always found Saratoga's big, deep, competitive fields tough to handicap. And that's not a diss- it's a compliment. Del Mar is a little easier.

Well as someone who has full timed both meets past and present I can tell you the Saratoga meeting is a bit of an illusion. Yes, most of the stakes races with Grade 1/2 status and large purses draw great fields in general.

The stake state bred programs as well often draw very nice fields.

The mdn races, usually 1 a day draws a great field.

But beyond that the races are littered with 4-5 races of 14k dirt claimers, 40k mdn claimers, 5.5t 40k claimers and the Starter Alw races for mdn claimer graduates. Often times these races are the same bunch who take turns beating each other. Todays first four races were a great example of this.

I was expecting many more mid level claiming races filled with out of town shippers, Alw races on dirt with fuller fields, and a few more old mdn straight mdn races.

Now one can say thats all really that del mar offers, mix in a few more low level dirt claimers but I hold Saratoga to a higher standard, as we all did by that Saratoga-Del Mar poll. So I have been disappointed by my own expectations for the meet.

I also find some of the riding in the turf races infuriating, even in dirt races, the grab and hold makes races unpredictable to bet, its much more true to form at Del Mar.

Just my opinion, its still good, just not great.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by CincyHorseplayer

Absolutely. Certain pace ability types that can't win at Santa Anita can win big at Del Mar. I think that explains the price friendliness. Trainers get play here also but it's not as oppressive as at Toga. Trainer stats are huge at these meets but I can't jump on the Man-Handling approach. Trainers are bet againsts for me. I spent the day Saturday betting against Chad Brown and Todd Pletcher. They got me twice. But I got them 3 times! Dilger, Ribaudo, and Walsh. That's why I got prices at Toga.

Anyway if I get out to your back yard I hope you'll show me around. I know you love your surf and turf out there brother!

I'd be happy to. I will buy you one of Del Mar's famous margaritas.

[CincyHorseplayer]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

I'd be happy to. I will buy you one of Del Mar's famous margaritas.

Now were speaking the same language! The universality of horseflesh, beaches, woman flesh(which you've been touting!), and margaritas. Makes for some very good capping or at worst it ends up in a buzz! Love those winning strategies! LOL!

[Andy Asaro]

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