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Old 03-14-2019, 09:19 PM   #46
Burls
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What other factor besides the surface could possibly explain why there's such a spike in deaths at Santa Anita?
Are all of the deaths resulting from the kinds of injuries that would come from a faulty track?
Could there be a toxic liquid that was spilled in some of the barns?
Could there be something poisonous coming out of corroded water pipes?
Could there be something at the source of the water?
There are a lot of live possibilities that need to be investigated.

But Lasix and overuse of riding whips are not among them.
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Old 03-14-2019, 09:36 PM   #47
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I think it's a pretty solid bet that it's the surface. The horsemen at Santa Anita aren't using any drugs that would be different than any other track in the country. The same situation would be happening all over the place if it was drugs. I haven't seen anything stated that it's two or three trainers with all the break downs.
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Old 03-14-2019, 10:24 PM   #48
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I think it's a pretty solid bet that it's the surface. The horsemen at Santa Anita aren't using any drugs that would be different than any other track in the country. The same situation would be happening all over the place if it was drugs. I haven't seen anything stated that it's two or three trainers with all the break downs.
Come on. The horsemen are sending horses to the track that shouldn’t be going. Obviously some of the breakdowns were just freak accidents but the trainers played a big part in this. Were they being pressured? Probably. I remember earlier in the meet Shelbe Ruis had an issue when she tried to scratch after she was not happy with the surface...but the track is an easy scapegoat.

Lots of filthy hands all around.
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Old 03-14-2019, 11:11 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by Burls View Post
What other factor besides the surface could possibly explain why there's such a spike in deaths at Santa Anita?
Are all of the deaths resulting from the kinds of injuries that would come from a faulty track?
Could there be a toxic liquid that was spilled in some of the barns?
Could there be something poisonous coming out of corroded water pipes?
Could there be something at the source of the water?
There are a lot of live possibilities that need to be investigated.

But Lasix and overuse of riding whips are not among them.
Amen
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Old 03-14-2019, 11:12 PM   #50
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I think it's a pretty solid bet that it's the surface. The horsemen at Santa Anita aren't using any drugs that would be different than any other track in the country. The same situation would be happening all over the place if it was drugs. I haven't seen anything stated that it's two or three trainers with all the break downs.
EXACTLY.

California Horseman are not running more unsound horses than the rest of the country.
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Old 03-14-2019, 11:25 PM   #51
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My take isn't hot or dramatic: The breakdowns are largely an anomaly that points out how many unsound and sore horses compete at even "elite" tracks.


I wonder how many casual bettors actually realize this.

Last edited by mountainman; 03-14-2019 at 11:31 PM.
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Old 03-15-2019, 12:16 AM   #52
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My whole problem with this entire shit show is, why isn't somebody stepping up, heading this off at the pass and giving public comments?

They need a face, and a voice. Not BS tweets or comments of crap nobody wants to hear.

Somebody get their ass out their and present a message.

Answer questions. Be a firm voice and face for all to see. Be responsible and not sit behind the bushes and be cowards.

Somebody in this organization has to "have a set", right?
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Old 03-15-2019, 12:50 AM   #53
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My take isn't hot or dramatic: The breakdowns are largely an anomaly that points out how many unsound and sore horses compete at even "elite" tracks.


I wonder how many casual bettors actually realize this.
In a nationwide study on fatal breakdowns conducted a few years ago, the results of which were reported on this very site...it was discovered that, in the vast majority of the cases, the fatal breakdowns had occurred exactly on the part of the leg where preexisting trauma had already taken place...trauma which had obviously not been allowed to heal properly. We read disturbing findings such as these, and it upsets us for a short while...but then we move on to the next "controversy" in the sport. And our anger arises anew when this disturbing "secret" within the sport causes more fatalities somewhere down the line. But, this new anger of ours also soon passes...and we again are quickly off to "bigger and better" things.

The horses are not allowed to heal properly in the name of "profit", gentlemen...and much more than just the lives of these magnificent animals hang in the balance. And, through our betting dollars...we too play a hand in this disgusting travesty. If there is a bigger or more disturbing issue in this game...then I can't seem to find it.
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Old 03-15-2019, 01:05 AM   #54
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In a nationwide study on fatal breakdowns conducted a few years ago, the results of which were reported on this very site...it was discovered that, in the vast majority of the cases, the fatal breakdowns had occurred exactly on the part of the leg where preexisting trauma had already taken place....
Great post. And gullible fans still buy into the "one bad step" myth. And neither Ruffian nor Go for Wand (etc..etc) ever evidenced ANY soundness issues before their respective tragedies. Uh huh.

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Old 03-15-2019, 01:42 AM   #55
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Great post. And gullible fans still buy into the "one bad step" myth. And neither Ruffian nor Go for Wand (etc..etc) ever evidenced ANY soundness issues before their respective tragedies. Uh huh.
Horses used to run every week, or even back-to-back days in "the day".


How many races did John Henry run in a year and never break down? That was 1975 when he was foaled. 83 (39-15-9) with 4 G1 wins in his last year of racing. He ran 9 races as a 9YO and won 4 G1 races.



We have bred the life out of sound horses that could run once a week, much less back-to-back days.
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Old 03-15-2019, 02:09 AM   #56
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Horses used to run every week, or even back-to-back days in "the day".


How many races did John Henry run in a year and never break down? That was 1975 when he was foaled. 83 (39-15-9) with 4 G1 wins in his last year of racing. He ran 9 races as a 9YO and won 4 G1 races.

We have bred the life out of sound horses that could run once a week, much less back-to-back days.

Citation ran 45 races. Won 32.

Ran 18 races as a 3YO. Won all of them outside of a Trial race he jogged.


He won the late April "qualifier" to get into the Derby, and then ran another in between the Triple Crown cuz he could.

Yeah. We run our horses nowadays "too hard".
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Old 03-15-2019, 06:29 AM   #57
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Part I --

The recent fatality spikes at Turf Paradise and Santa Anita found me spending a lot of time doing Google searches and reading articles about thoroughbred microfractures, fractures, treatments, breakdowns, and possible causes.

I'm not a veterinarian, and I'm certainly no medical expert. But one thing has become crystal clear to me.

When you compare the days when John Henry ran vs. today or even five years ago --

There's a huge difference in our society, especially when you look at the degree to which drugs were used back then vs. right now.

Back then, drug use was certainly prevalent. But I think our world view was a little different then vs. what it is now. We were a little more judicious when it came to using drugs. I think we had a tendency to use them if there was no other choice, and get the patient off them at the first opportunity.

In today's society, not just drug use, but the idea that drugs are how we should be treating everything has become widely accepted. Literally, no matter what the ailment, we have not one but perhaps dozens of different drugs for that - and we have this idea that we need to get the patient on a drug protocol immediately. Imo, it's off the charts.

This is true for both humans and horses.

Many times the latest drug has unintended side effects that fail to show up in early testing - side effects that are only discovered after a large population of patients has been taking the drug.

Sadly, horses can't talk.


More to come --


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Old 03-15-2019, 06:53 AM   #58
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Part II --

One of the drug classes I stumbled upon was bisphosphonates.

From what I've been able to glean from the articles:

For humans bisphosphonates are used treat osteoporosis and similar diseases because they prevent the loss of bone density.

For horses bisphosphonates are considered a therapeutic. They promote rapid healing of fractures while having the ability to reduce pain and inflammation.

So far so good right?

But according to some of the articles I've read there's a side effect.

Daniel Ross | October 03, 2017 |
The bone disease treatment drugs that may be putting young horses at risk
https://www.thoroughbredracing.com/a...g-horses-risk/

Quote:
Opposite effect

There’s still so much unknown about the way bisphosphonates affect the physiology of the racehorse, with the bulk of the drug research done on humans and on animals other than horses. But many experts point to studies suggesting that, if bisphosphonates are used to treat bone problems in young horses — those being prepared for the sales, for example — that, rather than strengthen the bone, bisphosphonates might actually have the opposite effect.

What’s more, bisphosphonates can be challenging to detect and can remain in the bone for months, even years at a time, making the regulation of them an even greater obstacle.

“It’s a big concern industry wide,” said Jeff Blea, a Santa Anita-based veterinarian, one of a number of prominent veterinarians in recent years to have dug into the effects of bisphosphonates in racehorses.

“I don’t think they belong on the racetrack,” he added. “The biggest reason why I take that position is that bisphosphonates potentially have potent pain-modifying abilities, and that bothers me.”
--and:
Quote:
Analgesic effects

The potential for harm occurs when bisphosphonates are administered to treat conditions outside of FDA recommendations. And here’s where the lack of comprehensive research in bisphosphonates — especially in racehorses — leaves a lot of hovering questions marks.

Let’s start with their potential analgesic effects.

Studies have pointed out that in some cases where bisphosphonates have proven effective in treating lameness, it’s difficult to know just how much of the improvement was a result of the drug’s pain-killing effect, and how much was due to its function as an osteoclast inhibitor.

Which leads neatly back to osteoclasts.

As we know, bisphosphonates inhibit the functions that osteoclasts perform. Old dead bone cells aren’t destroyed. Rather, this dead tissue — which has lost all its former elasticity — stays exactly where it is. Crudely put, it’s like a bullet fired into the trunk of a tree that has never been removed.

This has the effect of making the diagnosis of brewing bone conditions hard to do with things like x-ray machines, for the dead bone material can give the impression of everything appearing okay, said Rick Arthur, California Horse Racing Board equine medical director.

“The concern is bisphosphonates make bone look good on radiographs,” he said. “When in fact, the bone is weakened.”



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Old 03-15-2019, 06:54 AM   #59
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Part III --

by Natalie Voss | 03.01.2018 | 5:13pm
Bramlage: ‘Price To Pay’ For Bisphosphonate Use Is Delayed Healing:
https://www.paulickreport.com/horse-...layed-healing/

Quote:
“I wish we'd never seen these drugs,” said renowned orthopedic surgeon Dr. Larry Bramlage at the conclusion of a recent presentation about bisphosphonates.

Four years after the Food and Drug Administration approved the use of Tildren and Osphos (both trade names for bisphosphonates) for use in adult horses suffering from navicular syndrome, Bramlage said he's seeing unintended side effects from people using the drug off label.

As Bramlage explained at a recent client education seminar held by Rood and Riddle Equine Hospital, there are three main types of cells associated with bone repair and growth: osteoblasts, which make new bone; osteoclasts, which break down damaged or inferior bone, and osteocytes, which direct the repair.

When a horse has a fracture, the crack is initially filled by the osteoblasts with a temporary boney substance called woven bone, which can be made very quickly but is not very strong. Over time, osteoclasts clear away woven bone, which is poorly organized and weak, allowing osteoblasts to lay down the better organized and stronger lamellar bone. The lamellar bone fills in the crack and makes the bone whole again, both practically and on radiograph.

Bones are constantly breaking down and building back up in response to normal wear and tear and training.

Bisphosphonates work by poisoning osteoclasts and for this reason are used to slow osteoporosis in people. They also have an analgesic effect, which is why they are used in human bone tumor patients. This is also why they are presented as an option for horses dealing with painful and hard-to-pinpoint inflammation due to navicular syndrome.

Bramlage is finding bisphosphonates' mechanism of action also disrupts the natural healing process in young horses during training.

“I thought initially it might create a lot of acute fractures,” he said. “I don't think it increases their incidence very much. Where it causes a problem is whenever you're trying to heal something that's happened as a result of training and needs to repair. Part of the horse's natural coping mechanism is disabled.”

Bramlage is seeing stunted healing on radiographs of horses who have had surgery or rest to repair fractures which normally would have improved in a couple of months. Sometimes as much as 14 months after injury, the x-rays still show the injuries that have been “patched up” with woven bone still persist with original fractures visible.

“I've spent 40 years looking at horses' bones trying to understand the process of damage and repair that we consistently deal with in the racehorse. In the last two years we've had horses' injuries that don't behave anything like they did in my first 40 years,” he said. “We can no longer depend on the repair process that we have come to expect as normal for the horse. Bisphosphonates also 'mute' the normal bone turnover we depend on in bone scans.”

Bisphosphonates don't stop horses from making new bone, which Bramlage says is the reason the drugs don't seem to be causing fractures. They do stop osteoclasts from clearing the weak woven bone out of the way of osteoblasts putting in the strong stuff. The radiographs show new layers of bone being added over cracks but not remodeling of the fractures themselves. As a result, a horse's bone gets denser on the radiographs because of the added woven bone but it doesn't get stronger or repair.

--and:
Quote:
All of this seems to Bramlage like a poor trade-off for a pain-relieving effect that probably wears off in about 30 days. (Bisphosphonates are shown to attach to the bone's surface after administration and persist for years even after just one dose. Repeated doses cause cumulative levels on the interior surfaces of the bones.) Bramlage said it's important to note that because of the drug's long life on bone surfaces, a trainer currently in possession of a horse may not be the one who originally gave the horse bisphosphonates and may not even know the horse has been exposed to the drug.

“Unfortunately a lot of people who are giving it and are having it given, don't understand the price. They see a temporary improvement in the horse's lameness and they don't understand that what happens months later may be related,” he said. “The people who are in charge when the horse gets the drug don't have to be in charge when you're trying to rehab the horse and get it back to racing. So the lay-up facilities, the owners, and the horses pay the price for the remodeling debt precipitated by the use of the bisphosphonates. I am convinced some horses that we would have rehabilitated effectively in the past never make it back to form because of their history of bisphosphonate use.”

The issues Bramlage is seeing are in horses that have been given bisphosphonates outside manufacturer guidelines. The guidelines state the drugs should not be administered to horses under the age of five. A quick look at the drug literature will make the intended use clear.

“If you're interested in using them, you should go to the manufacturer's website because more than 50 percent of the package insert is telling you why you shouldn't use them in young horses,” he said. “However, they're perfectly willing to sell them to you for use in young horses. All of those disclaimers are meant to put the blame for anything bad that happens to your young training horse on you and not the company.”

Bisphosphonates became a concern for racing regulators in 2015 when the Kentucky Equine Drug Research Council announced its intent to study the drugs after receiving information some managers and trainers could be using it for its analgesic effect.

In England, the British Horseracing Authority issued a mandatory 30-day stand-down period for horses receiving bisphosphonates and prohibits their use in horses less than 3 1/2 years of age. Unfortunately, the drug is difficult to test for and Bramlage worries the temptation of general analgesia can prove too much for some horsemen.

“Routine use of it I think is accelerating on the racetrack based on the number of horses we see that don't follow the normal healing pattern,” he said. “That's a temporary fix, and there's a price to pay.”


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Old 03-15-2019, 07:36 AM   #60
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EXACTLY.

California Horseman are not running more unsound horses than the rest of the country.
So why were horses breaking down on the turf also?
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